Adding cattle (suckler herd) am I mad

[Boso]

Short question: are suckler cows less work compared to sheep?

some context:
As some probably know by now, while being employed fulltime I have a 200-250 ewe sheep enterprise.
At the moment I graze 80ha of pp, woodland, solar sites, heather etc. Over here the grazing is an enterprise in itself, ecological schemes etc.
Business has been growing with 10-15ha per year.
Have been sheep only for a few years now. Would have liked to grow to 300-350 ewes this year but lambing percentage was slightly low (lots of ewe lambs and second time lambers).
Buying in ewe lambs has been difficult due to being MV free and the lack of sheep being available.

I rotationally graze my sheep and try to keep them in a single herd as long as possible to cut down on the amount of work.
Apart from a rappa/kiwitech winder have got most time saving things covered.

One of my customers has offered me some 25-40ha more land to manage.
The land itself generates income due to the service being payed for (on average €400 per ha).

I like my sheep but find being able to use 1 poly wire instead of 3 or 4 appealing...

 

[Anymulewilldo]

If you have a low labour way of wintering then then yes! Summer wise they are pee easy. Bolus them up at turnout, couple of gathers for fly pour on, maybe a TB test. It’s housing or providing feed in the winter that takes time. I know folk won’t agree but I find it much easier to winter the cows inside than our wintering. Can check and feed in the dark! But we do have the kit to feed them. Not sure how you are set up for it. But I’d go for it .

 

[hendrebc]

Short question: are suckler cows less work compared to sheep?

Yes and no. Cattle are only less work because there are less of them and so less of them to have stuff go wrong with.
Cattle work is different to sheep work most of it is easier but some of it isn't. Winter is your biggest challenge with cattle.

 

[Jonp]

I find my sucklers to be alot less work than sheep except for the winter. If you have an easy feeding system and can outwinter them it's straightforward. TB the only real worry. Get docile cows!

 

[Boso]

Thank you for your input.

No barn so wintering will have to be outside. I can arrange for grazing, as in stockpiling a certain site.
One of the sites is 10ha, has water some trees, forage is not good enough for sheep, terrain is a pain to fence with 3-4 wires. Would be suitable as a winter cattle option.
TB is not an issue over here.
Would need some bigger yards/corrals probably.

 

[Anymulewilldo]

Thank you for your input.

No barn so wintering will have to be outside. I can arrange for grazing, as in stockpiling a certain site.
One of the sites is 10ha, has water some trees, forage is not good enough for sheep, terrain is a pain to fence with 3-4 wires. Would be suitable as a winter cattle option.
TB is not an issue over here.
Would need some bigger yards/corrals probably.

Has it got a good dry bank?

 

[Boso]

Yes, has even got it's own hill
However if it get's extremely wet I can put them in a 6ha woodland next to our house which is on very sandy soils.
Looking forward to giving it a go.

 

[M-J-G]

I find sheep to be easier

 

[CopperBeech]

Cattle generally easier in summer and can be harder in winter but if you get the right set up they are fine. TB is the biggest problem for suckers etc here. They compliment sheep well, and everyone likes beef. Go for it, if it doesn't work just sell them.

 

[Woolless]

Thank you for your input.

No barn so wintering will have to be outside. I can arrange for grazing, as in stockpiling a certain site.
One of the sites is 10ha, has water some trees, forage is not good enough for sheep, terrain is a pain to fence with 3-4 wires. Would be suitable as a winter cattle option.
TB is not an issue over here.
Would need some bigger yards/corrals probably.

I would agree with less work summer/more work winter comments, particularly if you are electric fencing them. You will need bigger, stronger gates and a cattle crush, though. I've really enjoyed starting to build up a small herd, mainly Traditional Herefords. There is at least one herd of them in the Netherlands and they might suit you (docile, will thrive on winter stockpile).

 

[Boso]

I would agree with less work summer/more work winter comments, particularly if you are electric fencing them. You will need bigger, stronger gates and a cattle crush, though. I've really enjoyed starting to build up a small herd, mainly Traditional Herefords. There is at least one herd of them in the Netherlands and they might suit you (docile, will thrive on winter stockpile).

Like the idea of traditional herefords or maybe Lakenvelders as a suckler cow crossed to something big.
Only affordable way into health certified cows over here is highlanders. Should be able to breed up from them to a more efficient suckler cow?

 

[Woolless]

Like the idea of traditional herefords or maybe Lakenvelders as a suckler cow crossed to something big.
Only affordable way into health certified cows over here is highlanders. Should be able to breed up from them to a more efficient suckler cow?

Highlanders crossed with a Whitebred or Beef Shorthorn would give you a decent heifer. My son's Highland heifer is running with my Traditional Hereford bull currently. I'll keep you posted!

 

[M-J-G]

Highland crossed to a Simmental is quite a good hill cow, I know someone on Mull who runs Highlands on very poor land and sells their Sim heifers for upland replacements.

It all depends on land though, I see no point in these types of cattle on good land.
If land is reasonable (able to be ploughed), a dual purpose cow like a lakenvelder is more likely to yield what your land is capable of producing

 

[Boso]

Highland crossed to a Simmental is quite a good hill cow, I know someone on Mull who runs Highlands on very poor land and sells their Sim heifers for upland replacements.

It all depends on land though, I see no point in these types of cattle on good land.
If land is reasonable (able to be ploughed), a dual purpose cow like a lakenvelder is more likely to yield what your land is capable of producing

I'm not a highland fan perse however a lepto/ibr/bvd free highland cow with heifer calf will cost me €750,- total for both of them.
Everything else which is certified clean is €1250,- per head. I think most of the available grazing would be fine for more productive livestock but with the investment involved I'd rather breed up from the highlander cows.

 

[RobDog]

Short question: are suckler cows less work compared to sheep?

some context:
As some probably know by now, while being employed fulltime I have a 200-250 ewe sheep enterprise.
At the moment I graze 80ha of pp, woodland, solar sites, heather etc. Over here the grazing is an enterprise in itself, ecological schemes etc.
Business has been growing with 10-15ha per year.
Have been sheep only for a few years now. Would have liked to grow to 300-350 ewes this year but lambing percentage was slightly low (lots of ewe lambs and second time lambers).
Buying in ewe lambs has been difficult due to being MV free and the lack of sheep being available.

I rotationally graze my sheep and try to keep them in a single herd as long as possible to cut down on the amount of work.
Apart from a rappa/kiwitech winder have got most time saving things covered.

One of my customers has offered me some 25-40ha more land to manage.
The land itself generates income due to the service being payed for (on average €400 per ha).

I like my sheep but find being able to use 1 poly wire instead of 3 or 4 appealing...

It all depends on alot of things. Sucklers are easy until you need to catch them . The calves can be a nightmare you are not going to keep them in behind a single wire electric fence .
Every job with sucklers is a big job and you need alot of (expensive) handling equipment especially if your field are spread about. Winter and getting ready for winter can be alot of work and expensive. I got rid of mine last year I loved having them but so much work and no money I'm glad they're gone

 

[Aspiring Peasants]

There are side benefits to keeping cattle. Your sheep should do better and you will have a supply of "free" fertiliser. You also don't have all your eggs in one basket when it comes to selling in volatile markets.

 

[Boso]

It all depends on alot of things. Sucklers are easy until you need to catch them . The calves can be a nightmare you are not going to keep them in behind a single wire electric fence .
Every job with sucklers is a big job and you need alot of (expensive) handling equipment especially if your field are spread about. Winter and getting ready for winter can be alot of work and expensive. I got rid of mine last year I loved having them but so much work and no money I'm glad they're gone

I could take on year old steers/bulls to take away the complexity of breeding and calving. Might be even less cash involved to get started.
However to me part of the fun is in breeding and the management decisions you make.
Have thought about dairy bull calves in the past, but they would be pretty useless from a grazing point of view at least if I would sell them at the moment they are actually worth anything (under a year).

 

[Boso]

There are side benefits to keeping cattle. Your sheep should do better and you will have a supply of "free" fertiliser. You also don't have all your eggs in one basket when it comes to selling in volatile markets.

I agree. Over here beef is also much more suitable to sell direct. Lamb I can only sell to the slaughter house.

 

[topground]

It all depends on alot of things. Sucklers are easy until you need to catch them . The calves can be a nightmare you are not going to keep them in behind a single wire electric fence .

My sucklers have been strip grazed and back fenced for the first time this year. The young calves go under the wire but that is not a bad thing because they forward graze and come back to suckle. Now they are 4 and a half months old they respect the single strand and are rarely out and if they are they don’t go far.

 

[RobDog]

My sucklers have been strip grazed and back fenced for the first time this year. The young calves go under the wire but that is not a bad thing because they forward graze and come back to suckle. Now they are 4 and a half months old they respect the single strand and are rarely out and if they are they don’t go far.

Don't want to contradict you but I think you've been lucky. Depends alot on individual situations and neighbours. Calves getting ear tags caught on the wire can be a real problem.