Are we a communist state through the back door

willy

Member
Mixed Farmer
Location
Rutland
Listening to general public interviewed yesterday after the budget, all the younger (well they sounded it) were saying taxes should go up to pay for services etc. one older Irish guy said let people decide what they spend their money on. Made me think the younger generation would rather have all the services paid for by the state nearly to the point we may aswell become a communist state. Civil servants and politicians will decide how much money we get to keep and how much they will then waste on needless pc sh!t.
 
Last edited:

Steevo

Member
Location
Gloucestershire
Listening to general public interviewed yesterday after the budget, all the younger (well they sounded it) where saying taxes should go up to pay for services etc. one older Irish guy said let people decide what they spend their money on. Made me think the younger generation would rather have all the services paid for by the state nearly to the point we may aswell become a communist state. Civil servants and politicians will decide how much money we get to keep and how much they will then waste on needless pc sh!t.

I think the reason for this is those “young people” probably don’t pay very much tax at all.
 

Bald Rick

Moderator
Moderator
Location
Anglesey
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Blank

Member
Listening to general public interviewed yesterday after the budget, all the younger (well they sounded it) where saying taxes should go up to pay for services etc. one older Irish guy said let people decide what they spend their money on. Made me think the younger generation would rather have all the services paid for by the state nearly to the point we may aswell become a communist state. Civil servants and politicians will decide how much money we get to keep and how much they will then waste on needless pc sh!t.
Do you actually understand what a communist state is? Talk to poles, czechs and east germans who actually lived under real communism. People who risked torture, deportation to gulags and execution. People here have have no idea how good life here is compared to what happened in Russia or China.

I'll moan about taxes as much as the next guy but I'll never try and compare the pampered life we live here compared to those who suffered under it.

In any case people are more nuanced on this than the media portray. https://options2040.co.uk/public-opinion-and-taxation-the-surprising-reality/ - the bit on framing is important.
 
All the youth do is complain and expect someone else to pay for everything or do everything for them. I was confronted by one chap handing out fliers campaigning to have buses made free of charge for students. I asked who he expected should pay for this: 'the government', where upon I informed him that the reality of his answer was in fact: 'the tax payer' and that because I am one I would not be campaining for free buses as I would be the one paying for it.

The government mind, has fostered this kind of mentality because of the rise of the nanny state. The second it snows the local councils are inundated by phone calls about how Wayne Kerr of number 3 Gofudgeyourself drive can't get his BMW X3 on 4 bald tyres out of his own drive.
 

serf

Member
Location
warwickshire
I don't think that attitude is particularly uncommon amongst the young. It does tend to change when they get older though, when it's them who are having to pay increased taxes.
" If Ur not Socialist when Ur young you've got no heart ,
If Ur not Conservative when your older you've got no head" ....

I've been a heartless b@stard all my life ...🤗
 

Swarfmonkey

Member
Location
Hampshire
In any case people are more nuanced on this than the media portray. https://options2040.co.uk/public-opinion-and-taxation-the-surprising-reality/ - the bit on framing is important.

The questions they ask are as important, if not more so, than the framing and from what I see there they've been really sneaky about what they asked, and how they asked it. You'll get a dramatically different result if you ask a person "should the tax YOU pay go up to increase funding for X, Y or Z" rather than "should tax go up to increase funding for X, Y, or Z".

It's with some chagrin that I note it's published by an organisation that's somehow managed to get itself registered as charity to dodge tax on it's income and dodge paying business rates
 

Steevo

Member
Location
Gloucestershire
All the youth do is complain and expect someone else to pay for everything or do everything for them. I was confronted by one chap handing out fliers campaigning to have buses made free of charge for students. I asked who he expected should pay for this: 'the government', where upon I informed him that the reality of his answer was in fact: 'the tax payer' and that because I am one I would not be campaining for free buses as I would be the one paying for it.

The government mind, has fostered this kind of mentality because of the rise of the nanny state. The second it snows the local councils are inundated by phone calls about how Wayne Kerr of number 3 Gofudgeyourself drive can't get his BMW X3 on 4 bald tyres out of his own drive.
Is there not a saying,

‘if you’re not socialist when you’re young you’ve got no heart, if you’re not conservative when your older you’ve got no head’

….or something like that.

A bit like banks - they hope people won't switch once hooked in. Easier to buy the votes of the young (who have little money) by making the older people pay for it.....until they wake up and realise that in a few years time it will be THEM paying for the yet further inflated promises made to the next generation.
 

ajd132

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Suffolk
Do you actually understand what a communist state is? Talk to poles, czechs and east germans who actually lived under real communism. People who risked torture, deportation to gulags and execution. People here have have no idea how good life here is compared to what happened in Russia or China.

I'll moan about taxes as much as the next guy but I'll never try and compare the pampered life we live here compared to those who suffered under it.

In any case people are more nuanced on this than the media portray. https://options2040.co.uk/public-opinion-and-taxation-the-surprising-reality/ - the bit on framing is important.
Every other thread on here now is just black and white attitudes. Tax rise = communism, high turnover = no profit, SFI = no crops.
 

David.

Member
Mixed Farmer
Location
J11 M40
" If Ur not Socialist when Ur young you've got no heart ,
If Ur not Conservative when your older you've got no head" ....

I've been a heartless b@stard all my life ...🤗
Tony Benn was the first time I heard it.
I believe that Dennis Healey was a card carrying member of the Communist Party, when he was young and silly.
I look on tax as a subscription you have to pay to live in a relatively democratic society.
But everyone should pay their fair share, not be allowed to take the benefits without contributing.
The shame is that only the squeezed middle have to, the really wealthy are able to exempt themselves.
 

Blank

Member
The questions they ask are as important, if not more so, than the framing and from what I see there they've been really sneaky about what they asked, and how they asked it. You'll get a dramatically different result if you ask a person "should the tax YOU pay go up to increase funding for X, Y or Z" rather than "should tax go up to increase funding for X, Y, or Z".

It's with some chagrin that I note it's published by an organisation that's somehow managed to get itself registered as charity to dodge tax on it's income and dodge paying business rates
I thought that was the point they were making and being open about it, how people answer is how it's asked. I wasn't pointing to it as 'people want higher' taxes, I was pointing to it as an example of what's asked matters.

On the specifics of should your taxes increase to fund 'x', its a fair enough question but not really how the system works. I mean I might support the armed forces but not putting the kids of officers through boarding school at my expense (although might agree with other ranks) or maybe not keen on aircraft carriers. No one would agree on anything.
 
Do you actually understand what a communist state is? Talk to poles, czechs and east germans who actually lived under real communism. People who risked torture, deportation to gulags and execution. People here have have no idea how good life here is compared to what happened in Russia or China.

I'll moan about taxes as much as the next guy but I'll never try and compare the pampered life we live here compared to those who suffered under it.

In any case people are more nuanced on this than the media portray. https://options2040.co.uk/public-opinion-and-taxation-the-surprising-reality/ - the bit on framing is important.
I want to pay more tax to subsidise arable farmers.

Then I can afford to pay my tax bill.
 

ajd132

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Suffolk
I thought that was the point they were making and being open about it, how people answer is how it's asked. I wasn't pointing to it as 'people want higher' taxes, I was pointing to it as an example of what's asked matters.

On the specifics of should your taxes increase to fund 'x', its a fair enough question but not really how the system works. I mean I might support the armed forces but not putting the kids of officers through boarding school at my expense (although might agree with other ranks) or maybe not keen on aircraft carriers. No one would agree on anything.
There was lots of RAF kids boarding at my school, also loads of farmers kids. Could argue both taxpayer funded!
 

Blank

Member
Every other thread on here now is just black and white attitudes. Tax rise = communism, high turnover = no profit, SFI = no crops.
Ah the interwebs, find a wedge issue and drive it hard.

There are informative posts here, its helpful in understanding what's going on and I want to be educated on what's happening in the farming industry so its a better forum than most.

I react to the 'communism' or 'fascism' stuff after reading up on what happened. I'm genuinely thankful we live somewhere where people can post what they do here.
 

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