Attracting employees in agriculture. (contracting)

[SteveHants]

You must bother, and do everything you can to improve your lot. Maybe you are a good example of what is wrong today "Why should I" attitudes stink !
Your parents weren't better off than you. You see a lending ratio of 3-3.5 x salary as low. When I first borrowed money for a house it was 1.75-2.0.
That is not the issue, it's about affordability, and what % of your income is required to make the mortgage payments. My guess is, that has not changed much, if at all.
There are no end of starter properties in City's for £150k, if your City averages £200k, and you can't afford it, then move !
Get a good education, get some great further education and skills, then make a target of what you want to do, and what you want out of life, then go for it !!

I have a mortgage and my house is worth more than that, thanks.

The point is, that the house my parents bought actually cost just over 3 times my dad's salary whilst my mum also worked.
When I bought my house, it cost 185K and I was earning 30k - do you see the discrepancy?

The only reason I could afford it was that I built a 500 ewe flock (on rented ground, thanks, so no help there), which I then sold when I took my job, so could then put down a massive deposit on that house.

If you look at the numbers in my post, the percentage of your income required to own a home has increased enormously, and it only drops back down once you actually get the mortgage, eg mine is not much over £600/month, but were I renting a similar house, it would easily be 1k a month.

I bought my house when I was 39. This is not unusual.

My parents are 75&6 respectively

 

[thesilentone]

I have a mortgage and my house is worth more than that, thanks.

The point is, that the house my parents bought actually cost just over 3 times my dad's salary whilst my mum also worked.
When I bought my house, it cost 185K and I was earning 30k - do you see the discrepancy?

The only reason I could afford it was that I built a 500 ewe flock (on rented ground, thanks, so no help there), which I then sold when I took my job, so could then put down a massive deposit on that house.

If you look at the numbers in my post, the percentage of your income required to own a home has increased enormously, and it only drops back down once you actually get the mortgage, eg mine is not much over £600/month, but were I renting a similar house, it would easily be 1k a month.

I bought my house when I was 39. This is not unusual.

My parents are 75&6 respectively

Basic house mortgage risk based lending has not changed much over the decades. With repayments of around 30% of your gross monthly income, as long as you are not saddled with other debts. the other thing you must remember is. When I had my first mortgage, interest rates went as high as 16%, your parents may well have experienced double digit rates, these have a massive impact on affordability.

 

[Werzle]

What hope is there for folk on minimum wage?

They havent got a cat in hells chance . After the monthy mortgage payment which could be £1400-1700 ,they have council tax of £200-270/ mth .

 

[thesilentone]

They havent got a cat in hells chance . After the monthy mortgage payment which could be £1400-1700 ,they have council tax of £200-270/ mth .

Who want's to live off min wage ??

From April, a basic 37.5hr working week is worth £22,288pa on min wage.

If, you apply this to those working 100 hours a week (see above) then it's £59,384, so, the reality is, somewhere in between there is defiantly a way for a two income family to live on min wage, and buy a house.

But as I say above, who wants to struggle on minimum wage, thier should be no such thing anyway ?

 

[SteveHants]

Basic house mortgage risk based lending has not changed much over the decades. With repayments of around 30% of your gross monthly income, as long as you are not saddled with other debts. the other thing you must remember is. When I had my first mortgage, interest rates went as high as 16%, your parents may well have experienced double digit rates, these have a massive impact on affordability.

Yes, and 16% on a 16k mortgage in the 80s (I think it was - they boughttheirfirsthouse late 70s) is nothing like as crippling 16% on an 160k mortgage would be today (although my mortgage is nothing like that much, would be a usual mortgage amount for a first time buyer outside of London).

Take the street that I grew up in - 4-5 bed ,(mostly) houses built in the 80s (we moved there 1989ish, I think). My parents still live there, hardly any families in that road of 35 odd houses with kids, when I was young there were loads of us.
Why?
Those houses are now worth 8-900k

 

[thesilentone]

Yes, and 16% on a 16k mortgage in the 80s (I think it was - they boughttheirfirsthouse late 70s) is nothing like as crippling 16% on an 160k mortgage would be today (although my mortgage is nothing like that much, would be a usual mortgage amount for a first time buyer outside of London).

Take the street that I grew up in - 4-5 bed ,(mostly) houses built in the 80s (we moved there 1989ish, I think). My parents still live there, hardly any families in that road of 35 odd houses with kids, when I was young there were loads of us.
Why?
Those houses are now worth 8-900k

I accept that, but that is because the market has changed, and supply and demand dictates. You must take onboard affordability today is no different to 40 years ago. I built a house in 1985, it cost me £35k, I sold it in 1992 for £75k, it sold recently for £325k.

However, we are getting off topic now.

 

[Blaithin]

Any advice? Alot of guys having sales and giving up the ag contracting game. We don't plan on doing that and have a healthy business doing predominantly grass silage for dairy farms, slurry pumping/spreading and ag construction work.
Happy to pay good wages for good people.
I have friends and family who work for local big cement works, chemical factory's etc that work all sorts of fancy shift patterns.... 4 days on 4 days off etc etc and overtime after so many hours or on weekends etc. i am not against trying any of that but wouldn't know how to do it.
Basically i want to bring being employed by an agri contractor into the modern ways of the world.
Any body doing it already? on farms or contractors?

At the moment......it sounds a bit harsh.....but i feel we just get all the erm.....leftovers of staff.....if you sort of get what i mean.

Any tips for attracting, keeping and encouraging staff appreciated
thankyou

Regarding fancy schedules.

My job used to have a fancy modified work schedule. Now we're back to pain in the ass old 8 hour days, 5 days a week. Used to do 3 days 13.3 hours a day. Long days, lots of days off.

In agriculture a lot of employees are lost due to the status symbol of your worth is directly related to how much you're willing to work. Well sorry old fella's, most of us aren't willing to work that much anymore. In fact just this week my boss annoyed me by saying my priority should be my job, I shouldn't tell the higher ups that I have other work lined up on my days off. bulls**t. They're my days off, I can do as I wish. My priority of my days off should not have anything to do with my normal job. Lots of people have priorities for their days off. Family, Yardwork, another job, etc.

Having a consistent schedule is very beneficial to this and highly appreciated by employees.

Being flexible about schedules is highly appreciated by employees. If you are small enough to have a variety of of schedules for your staff, you may see a lot of benefits.

Example.

Someone has to drop their kids off at school so starting at 7 am doesn't work for them. Starting at 8:30 is ideal. So, give them a shift 8:30 - 3:30. No paid lunch break, eat on the go. Now they can drop off and pick up their kids.

If you have a crew interested in the modified work schedules like 4 days of 10 hours or 3 days of 13 hours, this can be a great way to get around overtime pay. You need 2 equipment operators at a time? Hire 4 people for 3/13's. Now you're running 13 hour days, 6 days a week, nobody is over 40 hours (overtime is paid after 40 hours here). If your staff are fine with longer days but have other things on the go, these shifts give them the opportunity to do so while also giving you the hours to dedicate to your business.

Lots of business are stuck in the 8-4/9-5/get up early and spend every weekday at work approach. Some people prefer afternoon or evening shifts. Some people like Tuesday - Saturday. It's easier to just hire an employee and force them into the mold you've been using, but during interviewing you can also see what schedules may work best for them and end up with a crew that has complimenting preferences and can run extended times and work happily in weird schedules. With a smaller crew its not as easy as the generic mold but it's still manageable to be customized.


Do you offer benefits and vacation time? This is an area where agriculture is highly lacking here. Some are starting to have better coverage in case of accidents, workers compensation coverage and the like, but a good benefit plan can be very helpful. Dentist, massage, chiropractor, etc. This is what established companies offer that farming work doesn't. Paid vacation is also great, here the standard is 3 weeks a year. I work parallel to agriculture and work asks us to not use our vacation during busy time - harvest - but the rest of the year is fine. If you're a silage contractor then be clear that vacation during silage season isn't encouraged, emergencies not withstanding, but that using those vacation times during slow times of the year is fine and good.

From a management standpoint if you can find a good payroll/bookkeeper that's familiar with alternate types of scheduling that may be the best way to try and approach it and learn of the possibilities.

 

[oldoaktree]

What hope is there for folk on minimum wage?

They have less to spend

 

[Derrick Hughes]

No one wants work anymore
I've got two good lads , not sure what I would do if they left

 

[WiltsLad]

It annoys me a bit as a young guy people saying no one wants to work. I do, for a start. Yes there are 10 lazy tossers to every decent worker but what are we going to do about that? Give up and rant about it? No, offer a decent pay packet, employ someone and tell them whats expected. I have had my fair share of crap labourers but that's no reason to give up and generally speaking if I look at where I could have done better it's making it clear what the expectations are from the start.
I'm an employee as well as running a weekend/evenings self employed job, by no means the perfect worker im sure but I'm not lazy and more than half the people I work with are also under 30, and are not slackers by any stretch of the imagination.

 

[Ivorbiggun]

There’s plenty of jobs out there paying 50k a year working on large farms or big contractor, but you’ll never be at home.

 

[steveR]

I've seen it with the youth of today, the 20-somethings.

No mortgage, no kids, not saving up for anything, just working enough hours to cover phone & car costs (a maybe rent) and using the rest of their hours for leisure time.

Many of them seem content to tickle along doing 40hrs a week on minimum wage.

YOLO's.....

I would like to be able to admire them and the simplicity of their lives, but just can't. But as long as they remain child-free, that is something!

 

[DRC]

I don’t see where this idea that every young person is lazy. All my friends children and mine all work hard in good jobs, and have progressed quickly up the ladder in their 20s and early 30s. A good education and support at home is the key.

 

[SteveHants]

It annoys me a bit as a young guy people saying no one wants to work. I do, for a start. Yes there are 10 lazy tossers to every decent worker but what are we going to do about that? Give up and rant about it? No, offer a decent pay packet, employ someone and tell them whats expected. I have had my fair share of crap labourers but that's no reason to give up and generally speaking if I look at where I could have done better it's making it clear what the expectations are from the start.
I'm an employee as well as running a weekend/evenings self employed job, by no means the perfect worker im sure but I'm not lazy and more than half the people I work with are also under 30, and are not slackers by any stretch of the imagination.

It OK, its a cliche that people have been repeating for years, I wouldn't take any notice of it.

 

[Magnus Oyke]

There’s plenty of jobs out there paying 50k a year working on large farms or big contractor, but you’ll never be at home.

There was someone on here a few weeks ago saying he works 55 hours a week as an employee. I don't mind putting a shift in, but sod that

 

[daveydiesel1]

There was someone on here a few weeks ago saying he works 55 hours a week as an employee. I don't mind putting a shift in, but sod that

There will be plenty doing more especially when talking about contracting

 

[Magnus Oyke]

There will be plenty doing more especially when talking about contracting

he said he was doing that off season. Utterly rediculous.

 

[daveydiesel1]

he said he was doing that off season. Utterly rediculous.

I must say if i was looking for a job i would want 5 12 hour days all year apart from christmas and for a couple of weeks off during the year

 

[AndrewM]

It OK, its a cliche that people have been repeating for years, I wouldn't take any notice of it.

Yup, more like people don't want the shitty jobs of the time.

 

[Pieces_of_Eight]

From April, a basic 37.5hr working week is worth £22,288pa on min wage.

Student debt doesn't start getting paid back until earnings are £27k, so that's another disincentive to work & earn.