Beltex tup

[liammogs]

I have used a fully shedding Texel tup on Easycares. Most will shed but some will throw back to wool.

So there be more a 75/25 split than a 50/50 split in favour of shedding?

 

[neilo]

@Global ovine says that british farmers look at the back end of a ram whereas NZ farmers look at e front end.
No profit in a dead one and no pleasure pulling too many especially if lambing outside.

Just imagine if you could find something that had a reasonably narrow front end, a bit of length and a wide back end, in something of a natural wedge shape. Just saying......

 

[CharcoalWally]

Just imagine if you could find something that had a reasonably narrow front end, a bit of length and a wide back end, in something of a natural wedge shape. Just saying......

That's what I was thinking.

I fail to understand why this argument is polarised between "narrow , easy lambed and low value," and "good conformation , high value but buggers to lamb."

There is a middle ground where good lambs can be easily lambed by careful selection of traits.

 

[glensman]

Just imagine if you could find something that had a reasonably narrow front end, a bit of length and a wide back end, in something of a natural wedge shape. Just saying......

You might have to be less subtle!

 

[Nithsdale]

You might have to be less subtle!

Beware! It's snake oil talk!!

If it sounds too good to be true... it is!!

 

[Woolless]

So there be more a 75/25 split than a 50/50 split in favour of shedding?

Say 60/40, maybe 65/35. They certainly don't all shed, even though the Texel tup has no wool

 

[neilo]

You might have to be less subtle!

Not really. The breed doesn't matter for this point, just the structural shape and functionality.

 

[Global ovine]

That's what I was thinking.

I fail to understand why this argument is polarised between "narrow , easy lambed and low value," and "good conformation , high value but buggers to lamb."

There is a middle ground where good lambs can be easily lambed by careful selection of traits.

There absolutely is, but it requires technology to measure meat yield in the carcass, not carcass shape. However that may never become mainstream in the UK while most lambs are sold live and judged on shape.
In the 13 years Alliance group Ltd. (NZ's largest processor/exporter of sheep meat) has measured yield in lambs (VIA) and reported the results back to suppliers, lamb carcass meat yields have increased by 4%. Why, because the yield premiums have encouraged suppliers to put pressure on ram breeders to lift yields through an increased focus on ultrasound and CT scanning in their selection for trait goals and have the EBV's ranked to chose the genetics most suited to improve the deficiences. Over this time the sheep industry has become more concentrated in hill country where nil shepherding is the only option and industry statistics show that sheep per labour unit is increasing by 100 SSU per annum. Recent data is also showing significant decreases in lamb mortality (lambs weaned per lambs scanned).

 

[Man_in_black]

where nil shepherding is the only option

Can you please explain?

 

[Global ovine]

NZ hill country is either too extensive in acreage or too steep for people to get around, so shepherds don't go near ewes at lambing to prevent disturbance. Nobody lambs indoors in NZ. On more intensive farms where the SSU/ha are higher (say 8-16/ha) farmers may go around their lambing ewes in case of the occasional problem. Such properties usually have shelter provision, such as tree shelter belts or less common, hedges and are flat to rolling.

 

[neilo]

There absolutely is, but it requires technology to measure meat yield in the carcass, not carcass shape. However that may never become mainstream in the UK while most lambs are sold live and judged on shape.
In the 13 years Alliance group Ltd. (NZ's largest processor/exporter of sheep meat) has measured yield in lambs (VIA) and reported the results back to suppliers, lamb carcass meat yields have increased by 4%. Why, because the yield premiums have encouraged suppliers to put pressure on ram breeders to lift yields through an increased focus on ultrasound and CT scanning in their selection for trait goals and have the EBV's ranked to chose the genetics most suited to improve the deficiences. Over this time the sheep industry has become more concentrated in hill country where nil shepherding is the only option and industry statistics show that sheep per labour unit is increasing by 100 SSU per annum. Recent data is also showing significant decreases in lamb mortality (lambs weaned per lambs scanned).

I agree that IF/when we are paid on meat yield, the desired carcass shape will probably change, but we are still paid for confirmation via the EUROP grid (admittedly indirectly if via the live market). Where the industry is in the UK, there still has to be more weighting on carcass shape and hindquarter, where it's worthwhile doing so. Where that compromise point comes between shape, slower growth and lambing ease is open to (endless) debate.

 

[100percent]

I'm after a beltex tup to try and improve shape of lambs from shedding sheep.
Anything near Warwickshire for around £300? not after the best, just something solid.
I know mule ewes would improve them but I'm happy with easycare ewes.
Thanks

Slow maturing on slow maturing? We've dabbled a lot with Easycares and beltex but this year put to suffolks these lambs are 10 weeks old out of easycare X Scottish black face ewes

 

[Nithsdale]

Slow maturing on slow maturing? We've dabbled a lot with Easycares and beltex but this year put to suffolks these lambs are 10 weeks old out of easycare X Scottish black face ewesView attachment 358244

Those lambs look very good I'm quite impressed.