Commercial Grenadier at last

[Cowabunga]

An email this morning from Grenadier which accidentally admits that their ‘certified commercial’ versions were never actually such a thing. They have now announced a blind van that actually meets the legal criteria for tax purposes. The second row doors have been blacked out and made inoperative, which I believe is the main difference to the previous van which did not qualify for VAT reclaims. However, their Quartermaster pickup has not a hope in hell of qualifying.
They made several fundamental mistakes in their original marketing and this van design replaces the previous non-qualifying similar van.

Here’s the content of the email….

Introducing Grenadier Commercial. With a flat floor and a full-height cargo barrier behind the front seats, you’ll have over 2,000 litres of loadspace, and be able to carry a standard Euro pallet.

Aimed at businesses that need a capable 4X4, it boasts the same great capability and specification as the original 2-seater Utility Wagon it replaces. But with specific changes that mean HMRC has confirmed you’ll be able to reclaim VAT.

 

[mf7480]

An email this morning from Grenadier which accidentally admits that their ‘certified commercial’ versions were never actually such a thing. They have now announced a blind van that actually meets the legal criteria for tax purposes. The second row doors have been blacked out and made inoperative, which I believe is the main difference to the previous van which did not qualify for VAT reclaims. However, their Quartermaster pickup has not a hope in hell of qualifying.
They made several fundamental mistakes in their original marketing and this van design replaces the previous non-qualifying similar van.

Here’s the content of the email….

Introducing Grenadier Commercial. With a flat floor and a full-height cargo barrier behind the front seats, you’ll have over 2,000 litres of loadspace, and be able to carry a standard Euro pallet.

Aimed at businesses that need a capable 4X4, it boasts the same great capability and specification as the original 2-seater Utility Wagon it replaces. But with specific changes that mean HMRC has confirmed you’ll be able to reclaim VAT.

Why have they made the rear doors innoperative? Vans are allowed/ need side doors.

 

[Cowabunga]

Why have they made the rear doors innoperative? Vans are allowed/ need side doors.

No idea but I believe that the LR Defender and Discovery commercials may be similarly hobbled. Also the glass is blanked out in the passenger doors. If it was otherwise the original existing Grenadier van would have qualified for VAT and commercial vehicle tax, but it didn’t.

 

[mf7480]

No idea but I believe that the LR Defender and Discovery commercials may be similarly hobbled. Also the glass is blanked out in the passenger doors. If it was otherwise the original existing Grenadier van would have qualified for VAT and commercial vehicle tax, but it didn’t.

Defender and Discovery commercials have operational rear doors, but not windows.

 

[Cowabunga]

Defender and Discovery commercials have operational rear doors, but not windows.

That may be the case here then. They don’t go into any detail on the modifications they are forced to make to make the vehicle potentially attractive to business users. They went out of their way to avoid the subject for the first two years and even though they claimed they were ‘certified commercial vehicles’, none of the rear panel-sided vehicles actually were, until now. They still have no hope of getting the ones with a second row of compromised seats with load dividers to qualify, nor will it ever be possible for their double cab pickup, which cannot hope to be made to legally carry the required ton or more cargo, so it has a very very limited range of potential customers in the UK and many other countries.

 

[Cowabunga]

They do claim it is possible to carry a standard Euro-pallet but it can’t be loaded by a standard yard forklift due to the rear doors opening backwards. However, the narrow left hand door helps the lifter to get closer than otherwise and at least it will apparently fit in the door’s width, which is more than can be said for Defender.

 

[RJ1]

It's pretty amazing how many design flaws you can cram into one project!

I anticipate depreciation to be huge. What are the early second hand ones doing? I guess VAT us less of a consideration in that market once the hit has been taken by somebody else.

 

[Lakesdigger]

It's pretty amazing how many design flaws you can cram into one project!

I anticipate depreciation to be huge. What are the early second hand ones doing? I guess VAT us less of a consideration in that market once the hit has been taken by somebody else.

Especially considering that the whole idea behind the grenadier was to build a land rover without the flaws

 

[Nearly]

Especially considering that the whole idea behind the grenadier was to build a land rover without the flaws

The only ones to do that were Britains.

 

[Cowabunga]

It's pretty amazing how many design flaws you can cram into one project!

I anticipate depreciation to be huge. What are the early second hand ones doing? I guess VAT us less of a consideration in that market once the hit has been taken by somebody else.

AutoTrader consistently has over 100 very low mileage ‘used’ ones for sale, most at seriously over-ambitious target prices. I suspect that there were a whole lot of early adopters that intended to flip the vehicles for a quick profit and are finding that to be problematic.

 

[Wellytrack]

Maybe someone could explain the appeal of this machine over and above a LR product. I have tried but I just can’t see it. I’d rather have a 20 year old 3 litre X5 over this and it still looks better.

 

[William G]

Looks like us peasants are of some relevance now they’ve discovered the yuppies aren’t interested in it. To little to late I’d say.
Can we still say yuppies nowadays

 

[Cowabunga]

Maybe someone could explain the appeal of this machine over and above a LR product. I have tried but I just can’t see it. I’d rather have a 20 year old 3 litre X5 over this and it still looks better.

They are actually heavy duty vehicles aimed at commercial, explorer, leisure and utility markets. Except that the lack of commercial status for business tax purposes makes it highly uncompetitively priced and there are fewer yuppies that are willing to spend so much for what is a very compromised vehicle for the mainly leisure and commuting use they have for it.

 

[essexpete]

They are actually heavy duty vehicles aimed at commercial, explorer, leisure and utility markets. Except that the lack of commercial status for business tax purposes makes it highly uncompetitively priced and there are fewer yuppies that are willing to spend so much for what is a very compromised vehicle for the mainly leisure and commuting use they have for it.

Especially when their cash is diverting to EV SUVs!

 

[Wellytrack]

They are actually heavy duty vehicles aimed at commercial, explorer, leisure and utility markets. Except that the lack of commercial status for business tax purposes makes it highly uncompetitively priced and there are fewer yuppies that are willing to spend so much for what is a very compromised vehicle for the mainly leisure and commuting use they have for it.

Yes, but is it actually any better than what LR are offering as isn’t that what the whole point of the venture was, to make a New ‘old’ defender.

 

[deleted user 837354]

Maybe someone could explain the appeal of this machine over and above a LR product. I have tried but I just can’t see it. I’d rather have a 20 year old 3 litre X5 over this and it still looks better.

I can't see it will appeal to previous Green oval owners, what with it not having a bent crankshaft and sundry pieces falling off it won't have the feel of a truly British 4x4?

 

[Drillman]

I had a sit in a grenadier a while back. The windscreen was a bit small but otherwise it looked well screwed together with lots of chunky clunky switches, it also looked to have some substance to it and I would think it would make a decent tow motor

 

[Cowabunga]

I had a sit in a grenadier a while back. The windscreen was a bit small but otherwise it looked well screwed together with lots of chunky clunky switches, it also looked to have some substance to it and I would think it would make a decent tow motor

They will make great farm trucks after they have lost half their value and teething troubles have been sorted out. Probably at their third birthday. I can’t see many doing vast annual miles with their first owners. Half price at three with 30k miles sounds reasonable to me even though it will only be marginally cheaper than a new high spec pickup after VAT and tax relief is taken into account.

 

[Tubbylew]

An email this morning from Grenadier which accidentally admits that their ‘certified commercial’ versions were never actually such a thing. They have now announced a blind van that actually meets the legal criteria for tax purposes. The second row doors have been blacked out and made inoperative, which I believe is the main difference to the previous van which did not qualify for VAT reclaims. However, their Quartermaster pickup has not a hope in hell of qualifying.
They made several fundamental mistakes in their original marketing and this van design replaces the previous non-qualifying similar van.

Here’s the content of the email….

Introducing Grenadier Commercial. With a flat floor and a full-height cargo barrier behind the front seats, you’ll have over 2,000 litres of loadspace, and be able to carry a standard Euro pallet.

Aimed at businesses that need a capable 4X4, it boasts the same great capability and specification as the original 2-seater Utility Wagon it replaces. But with specific changes that mean HMRC has confirmed you’ll be able to reclaim VAT.

About time, it was an amateurish oversight in the first place, I feel sorry for folk who have bought one in the first instance and tried to claim the VAT.

 

[Cowabunga]

About time, it was an amateurish oversight in the first place, I feel sorry for folk who have bought one in the first instance and tried to claim the VAT.

For all their marketing bull, it doesn’t look like they had anyone on board the development team that really understood the markets worldwide. Also they have yet to come good on their promise of superior dealers, the supply of spares or indeed opening workshop manuals for use by owners and independent garages.

They may have been desperate for dealers but around here they only have one dealer in Wales and that is a vast multi-franchise Ford/Peugeot/Fiat dealer that is as inadequate with their service side as any other main dealer can be. I reckon they could have persuaded some tractor dealers to take them on, such as TAG or one of the Evans’s [One North, one South] or similar that provide a superior parts and service experience. On the other hand I can see why these dealers might not be receptive in the UK considering that absolutely zero model variants offered until now are financially business-friendly even though the vehicle design is basically aimed at industry.

Yes, a number of critical almost-basic mistakes have been made throughout the range. Maybe the future smaller Fusilier will meet the business user’s criteria better? I’m not holding my breath.