Constant pressure with a 7600 series MF

[moretimeforgolf]

You shouldn't be running a timer on the coulter pressure, it should be on constant pumping. If you don't keep it pumping constantly you run the risk of loosing pressure on the coulters which on an ISO drill can cause the drill to stop metering, you can't tell that it's stopped unless you're lucky enough to realise that either the black box stops pulsing or that the pressure gauge has dropped. Otherwise you'll only notice when strips don't germinate in your crops.

I haven't a clue how the hydraulics work on the 7618 but that set up works. When the drill was on the 6499, I had the electric spool on constant and then I used to lose the fan sometimes when it dropped into work. I don't confess to be a mechanic , it baffles me! All I can say is that the crops have come just the same since swapping drilling tractors, hence, the hydraulic system must work differently on the 7618.

 

[cows sh#t me to tears]

If you are losing pressure through the tractor valves fit a pilot operated lock valve and it will cure it 100%. You can get a double acting one for about £20 and put it on your outlets. My tractors would not hold pressure through the valves for any time but with the valves fitted they will hold it indefinitely.
PS keep a spanner handy as they will not release pressure unless operated against so sometimes you need to crack the valves to separate, you can get a bleed but I never bothered.

Local independant tractor mechanic/ hydraulic shop , leant me a double acting pilot op valve today to try. Had one on the shelf that he had made up for some one that didn't need it . Hoses with male couplers on one side and female couplers on other. Just plug n play...Observation so far ...Normally if i park up the drill overnight with gang up , it has dropped a bit by next day (even though one hose will still have pressure on it). This afternoon with gang up, their was no pressure on tractor side of valve (hoses could easily be rotated/ moved in coupler), yet drill side of valve both hoses were tight in their couplers...Fingers crossed

 

[cows sh#t me to tears]

Sowing barley ATM. Results. Valve is no good. Fluctuates constantly, then if you cross a bank and the gangs push the pressure up, it stays there. Removed and now running spool on infinite flow and at 28% down force. Only pita is having to remember to double tap lever to take it out of constant flow and either lift or lower. 28% should be less than 50 LPM. So see how this goes. At that flow rate the gangs drop at a reasonable rate. Just takes a little longer to push them in.

 

[Will Blackburn]

Once the gangs are down it shouldn't make any difference what % flow because it will only flow when required, and not enough to affect fan speed?

 

[RTK Farmer]

I never understood the constant pumping bit on a MF 165 (being a Ford man). Seems MF hydraulics haven't changed much.

 

[mikep]

Sowing barley ATM. Results. Valve is no good. Fluctuates constantly, then if you cross a bank and the gangs push the pressure up, it stays there. Removed and now running spool on infinite flow and at 28% down force. Only pita is having to remember to double tap lever to take it out of constant flow and either lift or lower. 28% should be less than 50 LPM. So see how this goes. At that flow rate the gangs drop at a reasonable rate. Just takes a little longer to push them in.

Must be a movement of oil in the drills internal circuits in that case as the valve will stop any movement back to the tractors circuit. Is there a prv involved that may allow this as that would explain the movement when pushed up. Seems a pretty crap arrangement as an accumulator would be better in that case.

 

[cows sh#t me to tears]

I don't know why it is so. All i know is when i was using the valve. it seemed to lose pressure in slight dips (because there was no constant pumping to make up the difference) , but crossing check banks on headlands it went up where i have never seen it go....and didn't come back until i lifted the gangs. Much happier with it at the 28% mark. But as i said the only pita is the double tapping, which i can see being a problem when fatigued . I'll ask him when i take it back if he has an alternative...

 

[Will Blackburn]

I don't know why it is so. All i know is when i was using the valve. it seemed to lose pressure in slight dips (because there was no constant pumping to make up the difference) , but crossing check banks on headlands it went up where i have never seen it go....and didn't come back until i lifted the gangs. Much happier with it at the 28% mark. But as i said the only pita is the double tapping, which i can see being a problem when fatigued . I'll ask him when i take it back if he has an alternative...

If you set it up on the headland management system then you could reduce it to one press of that button?

 

[Simon Chiles]

If you set it up on the headland management system then you could reduce it to one press of that button?

This is what I do. I also program both the coulter up and down into the same function. As I do the same distance on every loop turn it means you only have to hit the button once for a turn.
That pilot operated valve was never going to work. You need to keep a constant flow to maintain coulter pressure as the drill crosses uneven terrain.
I'm not sure why you have to limit the flow to the coulters, they don't take much flow at all until you raise or lower them and then they need the max. I set the coulter flow at max. It's never been a problem on any of the JDs I've run. What would be the problem with this? Don't worry about the fan slowing as you lift and lower the coulters. From the tractor seat it sounds alarming but if you look at the fan speed on the screen you'll see that the fluctuation isn't anywhere near as bad as it sounds.

 

[cows sh#t me to tears]

I was more worried about overheating the oil . Or am I looking at it wrong? Even my dealer recommended 10 to 15% and no more??. As for headland management. That would work if the tractor actually had a datatronic display. Most ones imported to Australia don't have it. They leave it as an option for you to installed at around $4000+.....
I am enquiring about it though as I find that with running the fan through the other electric spool, it is very easy to disengage the fan when lifting and lowering..

 

[Simon Chiles]

I was more worried about overheating the oil . Or am I looking at it wrong? Even my dealer recommended 10 to 15% and no more??. As for headland management. That would work if the tractor actually had a datatronic display. Most ones imported to Australia don't have it. They leave it as an option for you to installed at around $4000+.....
I am enquiring about it though as I find that with running the fan through the other electric spool, it is very easy to disengage the fan when lifting and lowering..

I think you're worrying about it for nothing, I've never managed to get the trans oil above 80 c even when the ambient temp was 35 c ( we call this a heat wave even if it only lasts for a day ).
I also wouldn't spend 4000 dollars on the datatronic, the drill will have an alarm if you try seeding with it switched off. If you aren't getting the alarm make sure it's switched on in the settings.

 

[cows sh#t me to tears]

This is true. But unfortunately when running the agtron isobus blockage kit through the same screen.( and the GPS) I find the alarm takes a while to activate , especially if the seeder page is not the one you have as the main one open.

 

[Tractor Boy]

This is what I do. I also program both the coulter up and down into the same function. As I do the same distance on every loop turn it means you only have to hit the button once for a turn.
That pilot operated valve was never going to work. You need to keep a constant flow to maintain coulter pressure as the drill crosses uneven terrain.
I'm not sure why you have to limit the flow to the coulters, they don't take much flow at all until you raise or lower them and then they need the max. I set the coulter flow at max. It's never been a problem on any of the JDs I've run. What would be the problem with this? Don't worry about the fan slowing as you lift and lower the coulters. From the tractor seat it sounds alarming but if you look at the fan speed on the screen you'll see that the fluctuation isn't anywhere near as bad as it sounds.

Do you not have to turn the oil flow down to the coulters then? I just assumed that you would be pumping a shed load of oil for no reason round the circuit whilst on constant. If this isn't the case then yes I can see no reason to dial the flow down and that will definitely mean we can raise and drop the coulters quicker.

 

[Tractor Boy]

If you set it up on the headland management system then you could reduce it to one press of that button?

I'm not sure you can. I tried this but there didn't seem to be an option to switch the spool on and off constant pumping in the management sequence. The only option seemed to be a timed amount of spool. Or am I doing something wrong with my HMS setup?

 

[Will Blackburn]

I'm not sure you can. I tried this but there didn't seem to be an option to switch the spool on and off constant pumping in the management sequence. The only option seemed to be a timed amount of spool. Or am I doing something wrong with my HMS setup?

I assumed all types of function would be supported, not worth spending 4K Aussie on then.

 

[mushnt grummmble]

Is it actually pumping when in 15% flow
The mf is ccls hydraulics so when the line is at full pressure the pump will shut down

 

[Tractor Boy]

Is it actually pumping when in 15% flow
The mf is ccls hydraulics so when the line is at full pressure the pump will shut down

Oh ok. That would make sense that you don't actually need to restrict it down then. I don't really understand what closed centre meant. Would definitely help speed up coulter drop if I could leave it in constant at the full flow rate.

 

[cows sh#t me to tears]

I shall make another enquiry today.

 

[Simon Chiles]

Do you not have to turn the oil flow down to the coulters then? I just assumed that you would be pumping a shed load of oil for no reason round the circuit whilst on constant. If this isn't the case then yes I can see no reason to dial the flow down and that will definitely mean we can raise and drop the coulters quicker.

Not to the coulters, certainly not on a JD and I can't see why a MF load sensing pump should be any different. You only need to restrict the flow to the fan at the tractor end and not the fan motor to stop that circuit dumping a shed load of oil as you put it and not leave enough flow for other functions.

 

[cows sh#t me to tears]

Enquiry made. The above is correct. It is safe to run at 100% the load sensing line will run the pump as required and not constantly. So now I am down to one problem. The double tap to take it out of constant flow then again to lift or lower.