Cover crop on clay for spring barley

[yellow belly]

The worms can take a few years to build up in no till
Drainage needs to be maintained and I find moleing regularly helps
Worms cannot cope with water logging but do not suffer too badly in tight land where the drainage is good
In notill fields the deep burrowing worm cast are 4 inches apart where as cultivated field I took on last year had a foot or more between deep burrowing worms

Currently I am balling straw with a 1 foot stubble after wheat the layer of dense chopped straw can be more of a hindrance than a benefit although I would like to spread the straw without chopping ,this leaves a more open soil surface
I now aim to have a dense covercrop where we bale straw as I think the roots in the top 4 inches of soil are more benefit than the chopped straw

 

[yellow belly]

The lighter fields we have seem fine whatever we do to them, plough or direct drill, the couple of heavier fields that we have not ploughed since 2014 have improved markedly, but always room for improvement. The more problem fields are those that have been ploughed in the last 3 years (contract for our 1st wheats stipulated ploughing although we have now got that changed for this year) hence lack of soil improvement overall. This coupled with a few drainage issues, a lack of added OM (1st wheat contract also stipulates no compost, manure, biosolids etc for 3 years prior to the wheat so basically meant we couldn't use any imported OM) and I've got a feeling there are some high Magnesium issues as well making the soil less workable. Add this to years of ploughing and powerharrowing and as said certain fields are a bit rubbish, even then only in places rather than whole fields.

My concern with thinner lighter soils that do not crack and do not mole will get to hard if the worms cannot survive and thrive in dry summer weather as the cannot just go deeper like worms do on heavy land
Whatever soil drainage needs to be good for notill but we all know better drained fields alway yield higher whatever cultivation

 

[Farmer_England]

Thinking of doing 3 field trials (15 ha in total) summer 24 into spring 25 with White Mustard only. (heavy clay)

Establish the mustard DD after combine , hope no harsh frosts until December / January & then spray off.
1 field disc and drill, other mow, ploug , drill & other spray & DD into it when all is died off.

I have a KRM direct drill with the SM coulters (I am hoping the tine will deal with the trash)
How have people got on with hard frosts in November and constant rain?

Have people been able to get spring crops in when the mustard has died off (or once it has died the ground has got too wet ?)
TIA.

 

[Wigeon]

Thinking of doing 3 field trials (15 ha in total) summer 24 into spring 25 with White Mustard only. (heavy clay)

Establish the mustard DD after combine , hope no harsh frosts until December / January & then spray off.
1 field disc and drill, other mow, ploug , drill & other spray & DD into it when all is died off.

I have a KRM direct drill with the SM coulters (I am hoping the tine will deal with the trash)
How have people got on with hard frosts in November and constant rain?

Have people been able to get spring crops in when the mustard has died off (or once it has died the ground has got too wet ?)
TIA.

I had a rape and companion crop cover crop on clay a couple of yrs ago, before trying DD spring barley (wasnt enough rape in it to keep).

Cost 2.5t/ ha of barley, at £270 per tonne.

Not doing that again....

I don't think in alone in this either

 

[Lincsman]

Thinking of doing 3 field trials (15 ha in total) summer 24 into spring 25 with White Mustard only. (heavy clay)

Establish the mustard DD after combine , hope no harsh frosts until December / January & then spray off.
1 field disc and drill, other mow, ploug , drill & other spray & DD into it when all is died off.

I have a KRM direct drill with the SM coulters (I am hoping the tine will deal with the trash)
How have people got on with hard frosts in November and constant rain?

Have people been able to get spring crops in when the mustard has died off (or once it has died the ground has got too wet ?)
TIA.

There is no way you can plough clay after January and hope to get a seedbed without severe frosts.

 

[Farmer_England]

There is no way you can plough clay after January and hope to get a seedbed without severe frosts.

Some really heavy bits we leave over winter and then plough in the spring (feb onwards) for spring barley.
I just want to experiment with a cover crop, rather than leaving soil bare or stubble bear over winter

 

[BigBarl]

Our experience on clays is not to bother with cover crops - you’ll get a yield deficit more often than a yield lift. The theory checks out, reality is a different matter. If you do cover crop on heavy land they want destroying the first opportunity you get after your Christmas dinner has gone down. The no-till purists will say I’m doing it wrong , which I could well be and they are very welcome to come and prove me wrong. I’d love to be proved wrong in this instance! I think that CC’s on heavy land still benefit from a light cultivation to start the breakdown process of heavy residues before any following crop is drilled

 

[Lincsman]

Some really heavy bits we leave over winter and then plough in the spring (feb onwards) for spring barley.
I just want to experiment with a cover crop, rather than leaving soil bare or stubble bear over winter

Your clay is different to mine then! I would get a slab 14"" x field length.

 

[Humble Village Farmer]

Thinking of doing 3 field trials (15 ha in total) summer 24 into spring 25 with White Mustard only. (heavy clay)

Establish the mustard DD after combine , hope no harsh frosts until December / January & then spray off.
1 field disc and drill, other mow, ploug , drill & other spray & DD into it when all is died off.

I have a KRM direct drill with the SM coulters (I am hoping the tine will deal with the trash)
How have people got on with hard frosts in November and constant rain?

Have people been able to get spring crops in when the mustard has died off (or once it has died the ground has got too wet ?)
TIA.

Why only mustard?

 

[Farmer_England]

Our experience on clays is not to bother with cover crops - you’ll get a yield deficit more often than a yield lift. The theory checks out, reality is a different matter. If you do cover crop on heavy land they want destroying the first opportunity you get after your Christmas dinner has gone down. The no-till purists will say I’m doing it wrong , which I could well be and they are very welcome to come and prove me wrong. I’d love to be proved wrong in this instance! I think that CC’s on heavy land still benefit from a light cultivation to start the breakdown process of heavy residues before any following crop is drilled

I have 3 fields In mind which are all next to each other, 5ish ha each
Could be a good experiment.

 

[Farmer_England]

Why only mustard?

cheap and cheerful for a taster

Thinking 15kg/ha max , would be £710, but I would possibly go to 10kg/ha after doing some research and speaking to others.
Cheap experiment

 

[Humble Village Farmer]

cheap and cheerful for a taster

Thinking 15kg/ha max , would be £710, but I would possibly go to 10kg/ha after doing some research and speaking to others.
Cheap experiment

My only comment would be that linseed and vetch (or birseme clover if you are worried about seed size) would all cost about the same, to give you a 3 way mix for the same cost.

 

[Farmer_England]

My only comment would be that linseed and vetch (or birseme clover if you are worried about seed size) would all cost about the same, to give you a 3 way mix for the same cost.

thanks. I will have a look at that option. Another reason for the Mustard is to get a natural die off with frosts, although a sprayer would be going through before drilling for any grass weeds

 

[Nitrams]

Our experience on clays is not to bother with cover crops - you’ll get a yield deficit more often than a yield lift. The theory checks out, reality is a different matter. If you do cover crop on heavy land they want destroying the first opportunity you get after your Christmas dinner has gone down. The no-till purists will say I’m doing it wrong , which I could well be and they are very welcome to come and prove me wrong. I’d love to be proved wrong in this instance! I think that CC’s on heavy land still benefit from a light cultivation to start the breakdown process of heavy residues before any following crop is drilled

Do you attribute the yield defecit to poor spring seed beds or unwanted alleapothy?

 

[BigBarl]

Do you attribute the yield defecit to poor spring seed beds or unwanted alleapothy?

Unwanted alleapothy but also all the rotting cover crop taking away N if you can’t get it destroyed early enough

 

[Humble Village Farmer]

thanks. I will have a look at that option. Another reason for the Mustard is to get a natural die off with frosts, although a sprayer would be going through before drilling for any grass weeds

Buckwheat is another similarly priced option which will die off early.

 

[ajd132]

Cover crops work fine on clay, you just need to pick the right things and spray it off early enough.
No till is extremely hit and miss for spring barley, even worse if cover crop wasn’t sprayed in time or was green.
We broadcast a cover off the topdown and don’t get a yield deficit. Just drill straight in like you would a cultivated soil without a cc.
I have tried all sorts of methods over quite large areas over multiple years so hopefully speak with some decent experience.

 

[Wombat]

Unwanted alleapothy but also all the rotting cover crop taking away N if you can’t get it destroyed early enough

For us its the bloody water you just cannot get the surface dried out in any semblance of time with a cover crop on it

 

[ajd132]

For us its the bloody water you just cannot get the surface dried out in any semblance of time with a cover crop on it

Depends what you grow but this is definitely a big problem

 

[Farmer_England]

Depends what you grow but this is definitely a big problem

Do you find it a problem with direct drilling straight into it or do you plough it in?
I don't particular want a winter / spring we are experincing this year with a dead cover crop. Could do more harm than good, as most of it would have died off and wont be sucking the moisture out. On the plus side the worms will be helping with the drainage