DD and Mole draining

[tr250]

How do people get on moling and then direct drilling I've done a field last summer and drilled this spring it was cultivated to put cover in but it's still rough as hell to spray.

 

[Fuzzy]

I mole drain and then subsoil the wheelings. Let it dry out properly and then run over with heavy harrows at an angle.

 

[damaged]

Just drilled over autumn moles. Bit bumpy but ok running at slight angle. What a difference dranage made to no till on clay . Twice the growth. Very obvious in this picture.

 

[tr250]

View attachment 495292
Just drilled over autumn moles. Bit bumpy but ok running at slight angle. What a difference dranage made to no till on clay . Twice the growth. Very obvious in this picture.

Does this field have a modern drain layout or is it moled to the ditch

 

[damaged]

Its moled over a headland perforated pipe that then empties to the ditch. In an ideal world there would be graveled headland drainage all around a field so moling could be carried out in both directions saving time and also saving the problems of getting to the ditch.

 

[yellow belly]

I use a twin leg moler in the spring after planting a spring crop before it grows

single leg moler has to have the wheeling taken out if it is not too dry

 

[Badshot]

How do people get on moling and then direct drilling I've done a field last summer and drilled this spring it was cultivated to put cover in but it's still rough as hell to spray.

I have started moling, but using RTK, so i'm doing a mole every 7.5m, then the following year doing it again 2.5m over, and so on. then when I've done a mole every 2.5m, I intend to move it over 1.25m and start again.
moling a good distance apart makes it bearable.

 

[tr250]

I use a twin leg moler in the spring after planting a spring crop before it grows

single leg moler has to have the wheeling taken out if it is not too dry

I don't have a big enough tractor. Can you pull 2 with a wheel tractor or do you use a crawler?

 

[damaged]

It took all 200hp and more grip that 650/65/ 42s could deliver pulling just one 3.5" mole through the compacted clay area on the headland. However, the main of the field was easy going and perhaps two legs could have been pulled.

 

[mikep]

It took all 200hp and more grip that 650/65/ 42s could deliver pulling just one 3.5" mole through the compacted clay area on the headland. However, the main of the field was easy going and perhaps two legs could have been pulled.

Always be overpowered (and enough weight) with moling as a stall is no fun. It buggers that run and you will have to get the spade out to recover your mole in the toughest part of the field. Once you stop the mole will weld itself to the soil. Been there etc.

 

[Matt L]

As above always be over powered for moling.
Also, to get the best quality mole, you want a trailed mole that has two articulation points between the prime mover and the mole drainer itself. This will allow the mole to be smooth rather than having steps, especially when crossing tramlines at an angle.

We carried out a trial using a mounted mole versus a trailed mole and found the trailed mole to have a much better surface when crossing rough ground.
Hence why our own mole drainers we make are all trailed.

 

[yellow belly]

We used to mole with a single leg wheeled tractor 120 up full set of weights and water in tyres all round

Plenty of weight to get grip power only allows you to go faster which is bad 6 to 8 k is fast enough

With a twin leg I use 300 hp with wheel weights full front weight pack and an extra 1.6 tone on the rear link arms my plan is to have a 2.4 tonne weight for the back
Moleing in the spring is a lot easier than after harvest when it is usually too dry and a gear slower

The gps system has become an essential tool so that when we remove we can go in between the last times runs in no till the previous moving is visible for a couple of years
I also use the altitude reading to run moles into drains on the headland when there is no obvious slope

 

[Old John]

We used to mole with a single leg wheeled tractor 120 up full set of weights and water in tyres all round

Plenty of weight to get grip power only allows you to go faster which is bad 6 to 8 k is fast enough

With a twin leg I use 300 hp with wheel weights full front weight pack and an extra 1.6 tone on the rear link arms my plan is to have a 2.4 tonne weight for the back
Moleing in the spring is a lot easier than after harvest when it is usually too dry and a gear slower

The gps system has become an essential tool so that when we remove we can go in between the last times runs in no till the previous moving is visible for a couple of years
I also use the altitude reading to run moles into drains on the headland when there is no obvious slope

I was taught that you should mole slow, about horse speed, i.e. 3 mph.
That gives time for the clay to move without too much tearing, leaving a nice smooth, durable mole.
If you double the speed you need quadruple the power, another good reason to keep the speed down.
Originally they only moled uphill as any shattering ahead of the mole, on the drier surface would, in theory, feed towards the mole. Also it was the only way if you were dropping the leg in the ditch with no pipes in the field. Apparently, this was common before under draining was installed.

 

[mikep]

I was taught that you should mole slow, about horse speed, i.e. 3 mph.
That gives time for the clay to move without too much tearing, leaving a nice smooth, durable mole.
If you double the speed you need quadruple the power, another good reason to keep the speed down.
Originally they only moled uphill as any shattering ahead of the mole, on the drier surface would, in theory, feed towards the mole. Also it was the only way if you were dropping the leg in the ditch with no pipes in the field. Apparently, this was common before under draining was installed.

If you ever run direct to ditches push a length of suitable plastic downpipe up the mole entrance it will stop it collapsing. Also if you want to run both ways whilst directly into a ditch you can pull the downhill into the uphill one on the headlands but only if close spaced.

 

[Feldspar]

Was having a debate with our very conservation ag minded agronomist. He was questioning the need to mole under a well-managed no-till system. Does anyone one deep clays actually think this would work? Certainly that picture above would suggest not. The problem we have is our moling contractors use steel tracked crawlers and a single leg mole. If dry it can make not too much of a mess, but sometimes you need a pretty aggressive cultivation (realistically ploughing in some cases) to sort out the results.

 

[Feldspar]

View attachment 495292
Just drilled over autumn moles. Bit bumpy but ok running at slight angle. What a difference dranage made to no till on clay . Twice the growth. Very obvious in this picture.

What is the history of this field? What type of clay? What's the subsoil composition? How long has it be zero-tilled for? Previous rotation?

 

[Old John]

Was having a debate with our very conservation ag minded agronomist. He was questioning the need to mole under a well-managed no-till system. Does anyone one deep clays actually think this would work? Certainly that picture above would suggest not. The problem we have is our moling contractors use steel tracked crawlers and a single leg mole. If dry it can make not too much of a mess, but sometimes you need a pretty aggressive cultivation (realistically ploughing in some cases) to sort out the results.

We are finding that we do not need to mole anywhere as often as we used to since reducing cultivations to zero or near zero.

 

[mikep]

Was having a debate with our very conservation ag minded agronomist. He was questioning the need to mole under a well-managed no-till system. Does anyone one deep clays actually think this would work? Certainly that picture above would suggest not. The problem we have is our moling contractors use steel tracked crawlers and a single leg mole. If dry it can make not too much of a mess, but sometimes you need a pretty aggressive cultivation (realistically ploughing in some cases) to sort out the results.

I think anyone who is of the mindset that one size fits all should keep their opinions to themselves. Your agronomist should get out a bit more and open his thinking, if you need to mole/plough/subsoil then you need to finished. Keeping up with an empty mantra helps no-one and indeed may damage the reputation of notill.

 

[Feldspar]

I think anyone who is of the mindset that one size fits all should keep their opinions to themselves. Your agronomist should get out a bit more and open his thinking, if you need to mole/plough/subsoil then you need to finished. Keeping up with an empty mantra helps no-one and indeed may damage the reputation of notill.

He wasn't saying do that for definite. He was rather saying think about why you're doing it, and whether it is still necessary under a system using a lot less ploughing. My feeling is that at the moment it still is, but I might leave a few bits to see.

 

[Badshot]

He wasn't saying do that for definite. He was rather saying think about why you're doing it, and whether it is still necessary under a system using a lot less ploughing. My feeling is that at the moment it still is, but I might leave a few bits to see.

I'm finding the longer my heavy land is left undisturbed the more it requires moling. My neighbours are moling permanent pasture, it does seem to be making a difference, standing water wise.
I'm a bit disappointed really after reading how everyone's land dries up and they get less standing water, if permanent pasture is going to.puddle I guess I've no.hope.