Defra now looking at capping SFI

[warksfarmer]

The irony is that if they hard cap SFI (ie no one can claim more than £X) they'll have the NT & RSPB et al screaming blue murder, so every cloud has a silver lining!

I've been wondering a while how the sums added up. I calculated I could more than double my BPS by stopping all food production on my farm and just putting the lot into various SFI options. If I can do that so can everyone else. So given we all got £90/acre before, there's not enough money for us all to get double. The sums only add up if loads of people claim nothing or significantly less than they used to, or the payments are capped in some way.

It sounds like the penny is dropping, and the new message will be - keep working peasants, we need the food so don't think you can just sit back and collect the eco-payments and do nothing. My guess is they will quite rapidly cap SFI payments at a level of £X per acre farmed, where X is less than the old BPS rate. This allows the big boys to claim more than the little ones, so they don't cut up rough, but caps the budget at less than BPS was.

Yep and all those people who got in early will be trapped in a 3 year deal with much reduced payments than what they signed up for.

 

[BrianV]

The irony is that if they hard cap SFI (ie no one can claim more than £X) they'll have the NT & RSPB et al screaming blue murder, so every cloud has a silver lining!

I've been wondering a while how the sums added up. I calculated I could more than double my BPS by stopping all food production on my farm and just putting the lot into various SFI options. If I can do that so can everyone else. So given we all got £90/acre before, there's not enough money for us all to get double. The sums only add up if loads of people claim nothing or significantly less than they used to, or the payments are capped in some way.

It sounds like the penny is dropping, and the new message will be - keep working peasants, we need the food so don't think you can just sit back and collect the eco-payments and do nothing. My guess is they will quite rapidly cap SFI payments at a level of £X per acre farmed, where X is less than the old BPS rate. This allows the big boys to claim more than the little ones, so they don't cut up rough, but caps the budget at less than BPS was.

Don't be surprised if as soon as all the big boys are signed up then any cap will only apply to new applicants.

 

[farmerm]

Iirc on the paperwork/online, their side of the contract allowed for changes at will. This has been highlighted in past threads. (I'm sure @JP1 mentioned it before?) (Probably @Goweresque too)

But if they go down this road, then what little trust is there.....Will completely evaporate!

Edit. Just to add, we haven't, and weren't intending, to sign up.

See, enough folk like you and the budget will fit . My plan gives a claim of 120% of our BPS 2020 but that comes before not insignificant costs, takes a whopping 50% of the farm out of production (but the least profitable/loss making part and should increase profitability on the other part) All in all it means a budget that looks financially far worse than 2020 but for us looks the least worst option, perhaps only beatable by letting out the lot and retraining to be a full time plumber

 

[farmerm]

Yep and all those people who got in early will be trapped in a 3 year deal with much reduced payments than what they signed up for.

If they do that we will be fully justified to go full French!

 

[farmerm]

You need more SBI not holdings.

Then you will see more artificial SBI separations….

 

[lloyd]

Oh dear between this and the prospect of following the EU
Anyone for a cheap dd?

 

[Goweresque]

Yep and all those people who got in early will be trapped in a 3 year deal with much reduced payments than what they signed up for.

I'm not so sure. I think anyone with an accepted SFI agreement will be sitting pretty. If a cap comes in it'll be for new applications one suspects. Retrospective reductions in payments for extant agreements would leave open them to legal action. At the very least if there were retrospective reduced payments then the claimants would be able to leave the SFI as the terms had changed. No one is going to be forced to plant hundreds of acres of bird food but only get paid a fraction of what they signed up to.

I've said on here already that this looked like far too generous a scheme, and people should fill their boots while it lasted. Looks like it may not last even until the first schemes start!

 

[serf]

Don't be surprised if as soon as all the big boys are signed up then any cap will only apply to new applicants.

Think this sounds more the case than the other suggestion...

 

[farmerm]

Would be better if farmgate produce paid a fair price, would be no worry about maintaining food production then.

If we banned the consumption as well as production of food produced using banned chemicals, GMO, and other practices not permitted in the UK, we would have a thriving farm sector.

The French are taking a step towards this.

WTO rules init….

 

[stroller]

The irony is that if they hard cap SFI (ie no one can claim more than £X) they'll have the NT & RSPB et al screaming blue murder, so every cloud has a silver lining!

I've been wondering a while how the sums added up. I calculated I could more than double my BPS by stopping all food production on my farm and just putting the lot into various SFI options. If I can do that so can everyone else. So given we all got £90/acre before, there's not enough money for us all to get double. The sums only add up if loads of people claim nothing or significantly less than they used to, or the payments are capped in some way.

It sounds like the penny is dropping, and the new message will be - keep working peasants, we need the food so don't think you can just sit back and collect the eco-payments and do nothing. My guess is they will quite rapidly cap SFI payments at a level of £X per acre farmed, where X is less than the old BPS rate. This allows the big boys to claim more than the little ones, so they don't cut up rough, but caps the budget at less than BPS was.

If us peasants don't grow anything the supermarkets won't have any carbon credits to nick, no doubt the politicians masters had a word.

 

[Flatland guy]

Obviously DEFRA have not got a clue what it actually wants, I thought they wanted to champion the environment and farmers were just following the brief.
Or have certain sectors possibly been up in arms in certain of Government ears moaning they wasn't going to sell anything(AIC etc.)

Surprise surprise.

£3 billion won't go far if everyone goes en mass into SFI.

The problem is the civil service have probably blowed half the budget on computer programs/ training/ seminars and whatever else to come up with SFI.

 

[Flatland guy]

So to paraphrase the above - Doomed to fail ...

Which the begs the question was this intentional or have Government departments not got the intelligence of joined up thinking.....

 

[MrNoo]

I hope not as I've just ordered all my grass/flower seed!!

 

[Jackov Altraids]

Defra minister hints at SFI cap to maintain food production - Farmers Weekly

Defra farming minister Mark Spencer has suggested the government would consider capping the amount of environmental incentives farmers in England can

www.fwi.co.uk

What about the SFI payments to organisations such as NT and RSPB who produce no food at all?

 

[Right-arm fast]

Did anyone go to this meeting in Norfolk? Looks like its going to cost too much and they are back tracking ? I personally dont think its to do with too much land being taken out by farmers taking the mickey, or food security - i think they have just realised how much is going to / could cost and they dont have the money.

Farm minister says environment incentives could be capped to maintain food production

Farm minister Mark Spencer told the Norfolk Farming Conference that Defra is considering capping the amount of SFI environmental incentives…

www.edp24.co.uk

 

[MrNoo]

I think it more to do with the potential public outcry of being paid to not produce food. Shame it's not worth growing at the current prices. What are we Wheat £167/t???

 

[BrianV]

What about the SFI payments to organisations such as NT and RSPB who produce no food at all?

You can be sure those won’t be capped.

 

[David.]

Good.
Should be an absolute cap of probably £100k; and nothing at all on Offshore owned land.
There should be no incentives for absentee landlords to hoof their tenants.

 

[serf]

Is admin going to mesh all these threads together on this subject....

 

[curlietailz]

How about the idea that the Govt are looking at how SFI and other such payments for not farming are taxed

I’m thinking that they’ll Cap the payment
Then tax it as un earned income
Maybe