Designer Dirt Anyone? - Artificially created soils

[Daniel Larn]

Last week I was fortunate enough to be invited back to my old university, here in Plymouth, for their 'Healthy Landscapes' day. The day was focussed primarily on soils, and there were a number of interesting talks from various speakers, including representatives of the Soil Association, Sustainable Soils Alliance and the Environment Agency.

However, in my opinion, the most interesting talks of the day were given by Dr Rachel Warmington of the Eden Project and Dr Mark Fitzsimmons and Dr Jenny Rhymes of Plymouth University. These talks were geared toward something they called FABSoil, an artificially manufactured (FABricated) soil.

These fabricated soils were used to great effect by the Eden Project to deliver the required soil structure, and makeup, for the various different types of plants found in each 'biome'.

They went on to explain how these FABSoils could be incorporated into existing soils to change the dynamic of agricultural land, even going to the extreme of including key bacteria/ mycorrhizae to optimise nutrient uptake/release for target crops.

More details:
https://www.plymouth.ac.uk/research/institutes/sustainable-earth/a-recipe-for-soil

How many TFFers would consider importing such soils to change the dynamics of their land?

What problems would you have with such a scheme?

Would TFFers even go so far as to pay for soil improvements of this nature?

Just trying to see how people feel about it, that's all.

 

[Gong Farmer]

Sounds interesting. Would need to cost about 2p per tonne though, given the amount needed in the real world outside.

 

[Bury the Trash]

whats with the calling it 'dirt' bit? another Americanism ?
even 'soil' can be a bit dirty ie soiled yer pants or a type drain pipe.......

i prefer 'earth'

 

[Daniel Larn]

Sounds interesting. Would need to cost about 2p per tonne though, given the amount needed in the real world outside.

don't know what the costs would be, but probably not that low. I'd say between 5p and 10p per tonne is more likely. maybe as much as £400 per acre I'd have thought would be a reasonable price point.

 

[Daniel Larn]

whats with the calling it 'dirt' bit? another Americanism ?
even 'soil' can be a bit dirty ie soiled yer pants or a type drain pipe.......

i prefer 'earth'

It was more for the catchy title, I elaborated a bit and clarified I was talking about 'soil', but I see your point. I don't know why 'earth' seems to have lost favour.

 

[7610 super q]

I could do with some new soil, as I've destroyed mine with a power harrow.

 

[Doc]

Er, seems like compost from waste OM with a catchy title. Nowt special.
They should probably pay you to take it away because it’ll cost them to dispose of it in a hole somewhere else otherwise.

 

[Daniel Larn]

Er, seems like compost from waste OM with a catchy title. Nowt special.
They should probably pay you to take it away because it’ll cost them to dispose of it in a hole somewhere else otherwise.

by my understanding it is more likely to be actual topsoil, that will be treated and conditioned, with more sand/OM/clay etc. added to suit the order. I don't think this will be straight up compost from organic waste.

 

[Doc]

Ok.
I read the ‘recipe’. That’s what it read like to me. It’s always the sprinkle of fairy dust that makes these things seem more than they are. Folk always pay for that special dust.
Sorry, science led skeptic here.

 

[neilo]

There’s little new in this farming job. Years back, clay used to be dug from ‘marl pits’ to spread on sandy soils, and sand was carted onto clay soils. Even today, it is common to alter balances of Calcium and Magnesium in the top soil, or adding muck/compost to increase OM levels.

They’ve just found a fancy name for doing similar to what has always been done, in order to make it more marketable, whether as a product, or as a concept to sell tickets at conferences.

 

[Daniel Larn]

Ok.
I read the ‘recipe’. That’s what it read like to me. It’s always the sprinkle of fairy dust that makes these things seem more than they are. Folk always pay for that special dust.
Sorry, science led skeptic here.

It seemed like that to me at first, one of the reasons I was a bit surprised by the actual talk.

They are mostly looking at saving earth from development excavations, so that none of the viable soil will be dumped to landfill.

They plan to screen it and sterilise it somehow then use it as a base for the recipe that gets ordered by a farmer/ landscaper/ other developer.

 

[Bogweevil]

Already done - many landscape 'soils' manufactured mainly from sieved quarry overburden and composted municipal waste, plus fertiliser and lime as required.

 

[Daddy Pig]

cant see the costs been in pence per tonne somehow, transport costs going to bump it up to ££££££

 

[Doc]

If they sterilise it they will deplete the microbes. That’s counterproductive. Leave the microbes to find their own balance would be better.
Microbes are the good bit, and as Neilo says clay is colloidal, sand is inert. Soil needs both. The balance of them is the key to provide scaffold, structure, available minerals and water infiltration to then support the biome so the enzymes/proteins in the plant can be made to then enable the wonder of chlorophyll to exist and turn simple water and CO2 into C6 H12 06 with a bit of sunlight energy as catalyst.
It’s well marketed recycling with a story.
These things sell well though.
It would be more sensical for recycling centres to separate OM, compost it and make it freely available via a levy on non OM waste ( basically plastic and ferrous) so that the rubbish is buried for our grandchildren to deal with but at least the OM has a chance to re enter the carbon cycle and be resequestered in plants via soil.
This is just rebranding and up selling of compost.

 

[Daniel Larn]

If they sterilise it they will deplete the microbes. That’s counterproductive. Leave the microbes to find their own balance would be better.
Microbes are the good bit, and as Neilo says clay is colloidal, sand is inert. Soil needs both. The balance of them is the key to provide scaffold, structure, available minerals and water infiltration to then support the biome so the enzymes/proteins in the plant can be made to then enable the wonder of chlorophyll to exist and turn simple water and CO2 into C6 H12 06 with a bit of sunlight energy as catalyst.
It’s well marketed recycling with a story.
These things sell well though.
It would be more sensical for recycling centres to separate OM, compost it and make it freely available via a levy on non OM waste ( basically plastic and ferrous) so that the rubbish is buried for our grandchildren to deal with but at least the OM has a chance to re enter the carbon cycle and be resequestered in plants via soil.
This is just rebranding and up selling of compost.

Like I say though, there's *no* plastic or ferrous waste to deal with. sterilisation may be a bit extreme, but it would likely be to eliminate the possibility of issues such as Blackgrass etc. being imported onto farms. The soil would then have a new 'culture' added.

Soil structure can be adjusted carefully so that when incorporated with your own soils, you get the desired soil type as an end result.

I'm not trying to defend it here, as I say I have no interest, I'm just playing devil's advocate.