Dreaded 400m ruling

[Deba]

Hello,
Getting lots of conflicting information about a new livestock barn we hoping to build...its within 400 meters of a dwelling.
We have just purchased 20 acres from a landowner/new neighbour where we have been keeping cattle for the past 15 years. He is more than happy for us to have a barn but at the same time has just started
work on a granny annex right on our new boundary. This annex is some distance from his mainhouse/barns etc. but close to where we intended to place our new barn. We believe we have to go for full planning as we are within 3 km of an aerodrome (only used for gliders).
We have been advised by one professional to apply for a 'general purpose agricultural building' and to keep quiet about its intended use and by another to come clean and say its to keep cattle in over winter.
We are small scale (15 - 20 head) but doubt if that means anything in planning terms.
Will they consider that our neighbours are quite happy for us to build a barn? Would they consider too that we have had to pay to have covenants changed to read 'permitted to build a 300 square meter barn'. This convenant put in place some years ago by a previous landowner...we had to pay him for the change.

 

[Pan mixer]

I had a similar dilemma, neighbour is 380 m from my latest cattle shed. I had an idea that it was measured from the neighbours curtilage (garden) rather than the buildings but I might be wrong.

Anyway I applied for full planning for an animal building, got it no bother, a little more money than a determination in my case but not much for a 120 x 45 shed. I was expecting a much bigger planning bill as a mate had to pay c£11K for his (admittedly much bigger) shed.

I sleep straight in my bed at nights, my neighbour made no objections and I don't have to worry in the future about this coming back to bite my butt. I too wondered about the GP building route but decided that it was best to do things right.

 

[flyonthewall]

I’d pd it personally. I had to go for full planning on a 6 bay calving barn due to a grant, but the amount of nonesense we had to write was unreal inc a 98 pg report on manure!

 

[midlandslad]

Is the nearby house a farmhouse, in which case the 400m rule does not apply?

 

[flyonthewall]

Yes technically correct, but what happens if farm house is sold off? Surely it then becomes a “protected” dwelling, unfair really.

 

[Nearly]

I've a neighbour with a special tape measure that you can borrow if you want.

 

[Pan mixer]

Yes technically correct, but what happens if farm house is sold off? Surely it then becomes a “protected” dwelling, unfair really.

It could be sold off, but what matters is the status of it when the application goes in.

We have 3 houses within a 150m circle of my beef shed, they are all part of the farm and therefore didn't count.

 

[flyonthewall]

But you still own these?

 

[Pan mixer]

But you still own these?

Yes

 

[br jones]

Are you in Wales ,? As the new phosphate rules will knock a new barn back ,

 

[e3120]

If you're within 3km of the gliders, then surely that trumps any debate about the status of the other property or chancing it?

 

[teslacoils]

I think the issue is that they want it for moos, but someone has suggested they just put general purpose store on the application.

 

[7610 super q]

I remember the kerfuffle getting planning for my poultry house.
First application goes in...... sorry sir it's within 400 M of a holiday cottage ( mine ).
Second application goes in ...... ( I moved it further over on the map ) sorry sir, it's within 400 M of your neighbours cottage.
Third application goes in......( I moved it up a bit on the map ) sorry sir but it's within 400 M of an archaeological feature ( WW 2 air raid shelter ). I recall dad getting cross and exclaiming " I'm older than that bloody shelter " ).
Anyhoo, forth time's a charm, and found a patch of ground with nowt within 400 M

 

[James Cameron]

Hello,
Getting lots of conflicting information about a new livestock barn we hoping to build...its within 400 meters of a dwelling.
We have just purchased 20 acres from a landowner/new neighbour where we have been keeping cattle for the past 15 years. He is more than happy for us to have a barn but at the same time has just started
work on a granny annex right on our new boundary. This annex is some distance from his mainhouse/barns etc. but close to where we intended to place our new barn. We believe we have to go for full planning as we are within 3 km of an aerodrome (only used for gliders).
We have been advised by one professional to apply for a 'general purpose agricultural building' and to keep quiet about its intended use and by another to come clean and say its to keep cattle in over winter.
We are small scale (15 - 20 head) but doubt if that means anything in planning terms.
Will they consider that our neighbours are quite happy for us to build a barn? Would they consider too that we have had to pay to have covenants changed to read 'permitted to build a 300 square meter barn'. This convenant put in place some years ago by a previous landowner...we had to pay him for the change.

Where about in the UK are you ?

 

[Deba]

Where about in the UK are you ?

We are in east midlands. We have decided to go for full planning as someone else says the aerodrome trumps everything else. We have no choice. however the barn is backed up to some trees which is taller than the intended barn and another neighbour has just got planning for an extension bigger than our barn and closer to the aerodrome.
Current neighbours happy for the barn to be built and is happy to state that to planning. But is that enough? Still dithering as to wether to quote for livestock use or agricultural use

 

[Deba]

I’d pd it personally. I had to go for full planning on a 6 bay calving barn due to a grant, but the amount of nonesense we had to write was unreal inc a 98 pg report on manure!

have to go for full planning because of the aerodrome 2.5 miles away

 

[Wombat]

We are in east midlands. We have decided to go for full planning as someone else says the aerodrome trumps everything else. We have no choice. however the barn is backed up to some trees which is taller than the intended barn and another neighbour has just got planning for an extension bigger than our barn and closer to the aerodrome.
Current neighbours happy for the barn to be built and is happy to state that to planning. But is that enough? Still dithering as to wether to quote for livestock use or agricultural use

If the aerodrome comes up on the planning constraints for that area then if you do a PD it will be rejected anyway and they will keep the money as you are within 3km of an aerodrome and the max height is 3m under PD, so you are right this overrules everything so don;t waste your money on PD

Just remember the full fee structure is based on the old sizes so what you can get for PD is much bigger for the fee tham the base full, so take that into consideration.

As an example we are looking at a 140'x60' and the fees are close to £1800 vs £96 or whatever it is for PD. Bloody airfield has a lot to answer for

 

[flyonthewall]

That’s a real bugger. One would like to think the only extra material consideration will be the local aerodrome and not a ton of likely to be irrelevant paperwork, I honestly would still start with it being for forage, it’s not as if you’re planning an intensive operation. Little steps not big leaps, I learnt the hard way by losing £5.5k in planning fees!

 

[James Cameron]

We are in east midlands. We have decided to go for full planning as someone else says the aerodrome trumps everything else. We have no choice. however the barn is backed up to some trees which is taller than the intended barn and another neighbour has just got planning for an extension bigger than our barn and closer to the aerodrome.
Current neighbours happy for the barn to be built and is happy to state that to planning. But is that enough? Still dithering as to wether to quote for livestock use or agricultural use

Far from Burton/Derby? I am a RICS Ag Surveyor in Uttoxeter..