Dropping OSR

[Brisel]

You'd know long before January if you had a viable crop. On bad Blackgrass land you'd have lost it without any intervention before then. Volunteers from the previous crop would have caused a lot of competition unless you had the combine slowed right down.

There's the small issue of the slugs that might need dealing with...

Can't see many large scale arable businesses taking that advice.......they laugh when I say more spring cropping!

They won't be laughing when they are forced to make major changes to their farming having lost hundreds of thousands due to blackgrass. Must be a serious dilemma when you can't persuade your clients to move away from an unsustainable system.

 

[franklin]

So, we already have more spring crops. But rape offers us the chance to get something in the shed before the third week in August. Yes, we grow some early wheats, but they arent really fit in the 2nd week in August are they? Not really.

You cant get away with a dose of Kerb in Jan to remove enough BG.

I have no problem spending money on it once it had got to 4 true leaves in any case - its the full rate Elk + Centium that I dislike. We are making good savings simply by going down the post-em Crawler / Astrokerb route.

Certainly we are reducing acreage year on year, and hopefully by doing it better and cheaper, we are increasing profit.

Those on an Elk+ Centium / Centuion Max + Crawler / Astrokerb program better be pryaing for some 5t/ha crops though.

 

[franklin]

They won't be laughing when they are forced to make major changes to their farming having lost hundreds of thousands due to blackgrass. Must be a serious dilemma when you can't persuade your clients to move away from an unsustainable system.

Dont know what it's like in your part of the world, but up here if you have 2000ac, then you probably have (or have in planning) for an AD plant. BG land is just going to be hybrid rye and grass leys in the near future.

 

[cricketandcrops]

You'd know long before January if you had a viable crop. On bad Blackgrass land you'd have lost it without any intervention before then. Volunteers from the previous crop would have caused a lot of competition unless you had the combine slowed right down.

There's the small issue of the slugs that might need dealing with...



They won't be laughing when they are forced to make major changes to their farming having lost hundreds of thousands due to blackgrass. Must be a serious dilemma when you can't persuade your clients to move away from an unsustainable system.

They are starting to come round to the idea, thankfully only the minority! Got one who has drilled 30ac of spring wheat for first time having sprayed crop of winter wheat off, hope I'm proved right in it being most profitable 30ac on farm

 

[cricketandcrops]

So, we already have more spring crops. But rape offers us the chance to get something in the shed before the third week in August. Yes, we grow some early wheats, but they arent really fit in the 2nd week in August are they? Not really.

You cant get away with a dose of Kerb in Jan to remove enough BG.

I have no problem spending money on it once it had got to 4 true leaves in any case - its the full rate Elk + Centium that I dislike. We are making good savings simply by going down the post-em Crawler / Astrokerb route.

Certainly we are reducing acreage year on year, and hopefully by doing it better and cheaper, we are increasing profit.

Those on an Elk+ Centium / Centuion Max + Crawler / Astrokerb program better be pryaing for some 5t/ha crops though.

Agree more AstroKerb now and less reliance on residuals for less cost per ha. Gonna have to try some clearfield this year as hedge mustard becoming a big problem on heavy land

 

[Badshot]

They are starting to come round to the idea, thankfully only the minority! Got one who has drilled 30ac of spring wheat for first time having sprayed crop of winter wheat off, hope I'm proved right in it being most profitable 30ac on farm

It might have been had he not already spent on establishing a winter crop........

 

[cricketandcrops]

Crop would have been fine if pre em was applied however wet weather prevented it, field next door is fine, spray man didn't want to get stuck so didn't do it

 

[cricketandcrops]

It might have been had he not already spent on establishing a winter crop........

Also 200kg/ha of FSS isn't that expensive in the grand scheme of things

 

[Badshot]

Also 200kg/ha of FSS isn't that expensive in the grand scheme of things

Still got 2 lots of seed and drilling costs against this current spring wheat though, it all adds up at current returns. You need to convince him to plan for some spring crops.

 

[cricketandcrops]

Still got 2 lots of seed and drilling costs against this current spring wheat though, it all adds up at current returns. You need to convince him to plan for some spring crops.

I know and I do, however it's his business not mine. Just like the thread where a good agronomist should stand in front of the drill to prevent them from drilling.........I would end up in Casualty!

 

[franklin]

Still got 2 lots of seed and drilling costs against this current spring wheat though, it all adds up at current returns. You need to convince him to plan for some spring crops.

Ah, but next year s/he can FSS some spring wheat :0

 

[Badshot]

I know and I do, however it's his business not mine. Just like the thread where a good agronomist should stand in front of the drill to prevent them from drilling.........I would end up in Casualty!

We can be a stubborn bunch, but he will thank you eventually if he has BG, keep pouring on £££££££ to get a not really satisfactory result and an ever increasing seedbank is quite simply madness and mainly done so we can keep up with the Jones's.
You can only advise, strongly, and often enough to keep it in his mind. I've seen the light just before the sh!t really hit the fan, many round here are not seeing it and the sh!t has hit the fan already.

 

[Brisel]

Dont know what it's like in your part of the world, but up here if you have 2000ac, then you probably have (or have in planning) for an AD plant. BG land is just going to be hybrid rye and grass leys in the near future.

Not big blackgrass country around here but it's not far away either. there are a few AD plants around here but for most growers they are too far away & the EA are about to make life difficult for those that use food waste by preventing spreading digestate in certain sensitive catchments. AD isn't a magic bullet for everyone.

Getting back on topic, osr isn't the only break crop. Perhaps Greening will do some good in the end.

 

[Feldspar]

Point is leaving it until January could be too late as BG could have rooted too deep for Kerb to be effective

Agreed. We didn't do anything to our BG from mid-August drilled rape until we put on Crawler in mid-November and that was way too long. Plants were huge. Luckily the Crawler f/b Kerb sequence has done amazingly well as it did last year.

 

[Brisel]

Would you say it has killed more than 98%? That's the threshold for a net reduction or increase in BG.

 

[Feldspar]

Would you say it has killed more than 98%? That's the threshold for a net reduction or increase in BG.

Yes, I think it has at the moment. The problem that almost happened last year was that a carpet of spring germinating BG appeared. Luckily the crop was pretty even last year and choked the spring BG of light. This year is more gappy so we may have a problem.

 

[Badshot]

Would you say it has killed more than 98%? That's the threshold for a net reduction or increase in BG.

That depends on your background seed bank though, 98% of 10 plants/m is OK, 98% of 100, 1000 plants is not. To be honest if it is resistant then 1 plant/m is too many if they are returning 1000 seeds.

 

[franklin]

Would you say it has killed more than 98%? That's the threshold for a net reduction or increase in BG.

One field I had was a bit knobbly, so I ran the tyned press infront of the drill. Bad mistake as the resulting BG control = worse than where I left it be. Will be wub 97% in that field, hence will be left to green up and get its first visit from Mr Plough since 2005.

 

[warksfarmer]

Would you advise that on black grass land?

If some of your customers have bad bg then you hadn't ought to be advising them to grow osr. You'll be using glyphosate pre drilling not doubt, then kerb. Then in the following wheat crop you'll be using avadex, atlantis, Broadway star etc etc.

That land is pretty much rubbish'ed because you have no chemicals left in your armoury so what will you do in a few years time when bg beats those chemicals?

And as the agronomist it'll be your fault not doubt .......

 

[cricketandcrops]

If some of your customers have bad bg then you hadn't ought to be advising them to grow osr. You'll be using glyphosate pre drilling not doubt, then kerb. Then in the following wheat crop you'll be using avadex, atlantis, Broadway star etc etc.

That land is pretty much rubbish'ed because you have no chemicals left in your armoury so what will you do in a few years time when bg beats those chemicals?

And as the agronomist it'll be your fault not doubt .......

Keep banging the drum about spring cropping, however they are still finding OSR profitable and have had good BG control.

Long term wheat/rape rotation not sustainable I know that, however when they are averaging 4.5-5t/ha on OSR and 10 t/ha on wheat they take some convincing otherwise

And yes suspect when it all goes wrong will be agronomists fault, isn't it always? Good yield is result of the weather, bad yield is the fault of the agronomist!