First foray into rotational grazing. Question.

[neilo]

Yes our average are about 12 acres so would need splitting. How many would you reckon to graze on 60 acres roughly.

How long's a piece of string?

One field (4-5ac) is taken out for maincrop turnips each year, then reseeded after 2 years. 100 twin ewes lamb down there, then another 150 twins join them until weaning, when all the lambs are taken elsewhere and the rest of the ewes go down there. In May, 150 or so Charollais ewes and their lambs go down there for a month or so too. Dry hoggs run on that block until October too. We take hay/haylage cuts off anything that looks like excess (15ac cut last year). Come October, all the ewes go back to the main farm and the ewe lambs (220 last year) rotate round those fields until New Year, when they go onto those maincrop turnips for the winter.

I'll let you work out how many 'graze that block', 'cos I can't.

 

[scholland]

FeedSmart - sheep and cattle feed and allocation calculator

The FeedSmart calculator allows you do determine sheep and cattle feed demand, and work out paddock allocations

www.feedsmart.co.nz

That's a very handy tool for working out rotations, mob size etc

 

[Kernowkid]

For me it’s complicated when bringing cattle into the rotation. Purely sheep or cattle is simple enough. But now turning out different age groups of cattle and having some sucklers about the place makes my head hurt. Dairy boys have it nice and easy. Big group of cows and maybe heifers separate. I’ve got 4 sheep mobs, sucklers, forward steers, yearlings, heifers, it all gets a bit tricky.
Giving the sheep a paddock for a few days, move them on and bring a group of cattle on behind to clean it up seems to work, but ideally the cattle might go in 1st then the sheep. Creates work mind. Having to move the cattle troughs. Which are a buggar to move. Be easier if purely grass fed cattle

 

[Ffermer Bach]

For me it’s complicated when bringing cattle into the rotation. Purely sheep or cattle is simple enough. But now turning out different age groups of cattle and having some sucklers about the place makes my head hurt. Dairy boys have it nice and easy. Big group of cows and maybe heifers separate. I’ve got 4 sheep mobs, sucklers, forward steers, yearlings, heifers, it all gets a bit tricky.
Giving the sheep a paddock for a few days, move them on and bring a group of cattle on behind to clean it up seems to work, but ideally the cattle might go in 1st then the sheep. Creates work mind. Having to move the cattle troughs. Which are a buggar to move. Be easier if purely grass fed cattle

Kiwitech Micro Trough — Progressive Farming Company

Portable water trough. Cost effective solution for watering cattle. Kiwitech Microtrough is perfect for cattle on a rotational grazing system. Easy to move, suitable for all ground types.

www.progressivefarming.co.uk

 

[Hesstondriver]

i've heard it said, to put the cattle in when grass is the same length as a beer can , and take them out when its the height of a coke can. crude but i think the principle sum arises the above quite nicely

 

[hendrebc]

For me it’s complicated when bringing cattle into the rotation. Purely sheep or cattle is simple enough. But now turning out different age groups of cattle and having some sucklers about the place makes my head hurt. Dairy boys have it nice and easy. Big group of cows and maybe heifers separate. I’ve got 4 sheep mobs, sucklers, forward steers, yearlings, heifers, it all gets a bit tricky.
Giving the sheep a paddock for a few days, move them on and bring a group of cattle on behind to clean it up seems to work, but ideally the cattle might go in 1st then the sheep. Creates work mind. Having to move the cattle troughs. Which are a buggar to move. Be easier if purely grass fed cattle

Put your forward steers, yearlings and heifers in one mob and maybe put tjem in with one of the sheep mobs they all want high quality grass so they may as well be together.

 

[unlacedgecko]

For me it’s complicated when bringing cattle into the rotation. Purely sheep or cattle is simple enough. But now turning out different age groups of cattle and having some sucklers about the place makes my head hurt. Dairy boys have it nice and easy. Big group of cows and maybe heifers separate. I’ve got 4 sheep mobs, sucklers, forward steers, yearlings, heifers, it all gets a bit tricky.
Giving the sheep a paddock for a few days, move them on and bring a group of cattle on behind to clean it up seems to work, but ideally the cattle might go in 1st then the sheep. Creates work mind. Having to move the cattle troughs. Which are a buggar to move. Be easier if purely grass fed cattle

Why have you got 4 sheep mobs? Simplify and reduce number of mobs as much as possible. Like @hendrebc says, combine where possible based on stock class.

1 mob of growing stock (ewes and lambs, growing cattle) get the priority and then set residual with something more robust (dry gimmers, spring calved cows).

2 mobs, done.

 

[Oldmacdonald]

Would I be easier, for my first year to operate a strip graze and back fence system?

Or is there a reason its not comptible with sheep rotational grazing?

 

[Ffermer Bach]

Would I be easier, for my first year to operate a strip graze and back fence system?

Or is there a reason its not comptible with sheep rotational grazing?

I would get fed up with moving a strip fence system, I would rather set up the paddocks, then it's easier to just move the stock every three days. I just know that if I was moving a back fence every day, I would give up by the end of the season! I would say bite the bullet and set up for three day moves the first year, then in subsequent years you can subdivide again.

 

[Bob the beef]

Would I be easier, for my first year to operate a strip graze and back fence system?

Or is there a reason its not comptible with sheep rotational grazing?

Strip graze and back fence ok for cattle behind a single wire, not a lot f fun shifting a 3 wire fence daily

 

[Jonp]

Why have you got 4 sheep mobs? Simplify and reduce number of mobs as much as possible. Like @hendrebc says, combine where possible based on stock class.

1 mob of growing stock (ewes and lambs, growing cattle) get the priority and then set residual with something more robust (dry gimmers, spring calved cows).

2 mobs, done.

Gradually going to split 10acre fields into 5 acre fields with permanent fences. Combine sheep and lambs with sucklers and calves in one mob and move them every three days or so spring/early summer. Wean lambs off in August and send ram lambs away to cattle winter field as the grass slows down. Will then run a hot wire around so I can further subdivide if needed.

 

[Ffermer Bach]

Gradually going to split 10acre fields into 5 acre fields with permanent fences. Combine sheep and lambs with sucklers and calves in one mob and move them every three days or so spring/early summer. Wean lambs off in August and send ram lambs away to cattle winter field as the grass slows down. Will then run a hot wire around so I can further subdivide if needed.

I would split everything with semi permanent poly wire, so you can move it if you change your mind

 

[Kernowkid]

Why have you got 4 sheep mobs? Simplify and reduce number of mobs as much as possible. Like @hendrebc says, combine where possible based on stock class.

1 mob of growing stock (ewes and lambs, growing cattle) get the priority and then set residual with something more robust (dry gimmers, spring calved cows).

2 mobs, done.

Have 2 groups of doubles. 250 ewes per bunch. That’s a lot of lambs to handle single handed at a time.
Then a mob of singles I can push harder.
I’ve a mob of 250 ewe hoggs with younger lambs on I can give the best grass.
could maybe put the 2 mobs of 250 doubles together but then you’d be getting onto a 1000 lambs in that mob!
Cattle wise they’re different ages and on different grain rations. A 650kg steer is needing a lot more grain a day than a 350kg yearling.
I’ve got some cows and calf going round with the doubles as they get no hard feed so is an easy one.
But I think really they need separate rotations. 28 days on each rotation then switch it so the cattle have the sheep rotation and vice versa, try to keep the worm burden under control a little.
That’s the plan. Just need a bit more grass growth yet to meet demand. Been a cold spring so far here. Until then 75% of the cattle will stay in the shed and use up some silage. Straws cheap and home grown and will make some good fym for when needed.

 

[unlacedgecko]

Have 2 groups of doubles. 250 ewes per bunch. That’s a lot of lambs to handle single handed at a time.
Then a mob of singles I can push harder.
I’ve a mob of 250 ewe hoggs with younger lambs on I can give the best grass.
could maybe put the 2 mobs of 250 doubles together but then you’d be getting onto a 1000 lambs in that mob!
Cattle wise they’re different ages and on different grain rations. A 650kg steer is needing a lot more grain a day than a 350kg yearling.
I’ve got some cows and calf going round with the doubles as they get no hard feed so is an easy one.
But I think really they need separate rotations. 28 days on each rotation then switch it so the cattle have the sheep rotation and vice versa, try to keep the worm burden under control a little.
That’s the plan. Just need a bit more grass growth yet to meet demand. Been a cold spring so far here. Until then 75% of the cattle will stay in the shed and use up some silage. Straws cheap and home grown and will make some good fym for when needed.

Simplify the system.

I'd put all those ewes and lambs together, and get extra help in when you need to handle them. Realistically, the extra grass grown will outweigh the cost of contract labour.

Don't push singles, as they will have the heaviest weaning weights, so will be best set up to finish fastest. Days to slaughter is a major profit driver.

If you're not grass finishing those cattle for a premium scheme, what about sending them to a contract finisher? Or selling as forward stores?