Funding for education

[arcobob]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-50563833
It may seem miraculous to some that during austerity our ranking show a small overall improvement in educational standards. Compare the expenditure on education with that of other countries it is surprising to see that some of the lowest spenders are achieving the best results. It is also surprising to note that spending in Germany is considerably less than average and among the "wealthier" nations our record holds up well..
The moral of the story is that throwing money at public projects does not always produce results. Before they completely bankrupt us politicians and aspiring election winners please note

 

[Danllan]

Fist thing, education is the key to almost every ill and problem in society, get it right and the rest is easy.

You can extrapolate your point across most areas of public spending and the big problem is the socialist dogma that is tied to state education, the NHS etc., backed of course by the unions.*

Education... there are Scandinavian systems in which the money follows the child, the opposite of our system wherein the default is that the child goes to an allotted school. The Left claim that adoption of the Scandi' system would see the end of some schools... Well of course it f^cking would, that's the point! The better schools prospering and expanding.

There was a loony lefty (Momentum 'activist' I think) on the TV a few days ago, supporting Labour's education promises, plus she was advocating the end of all private schools and their resources being turned over to the state sector, along with the fees they get too which 'add xxx millions to resources every year'.

She was then asked if the state schools, in her ideal world, would charge fees to any of the pupils attending them. She answered that of course they would not, public funds paying for everything via taxation etc., fair enough. She was then asked what 'fees' would she be collecting 'to add millions to resources every year'... Her reply, 'that isn't the point'... Well, it isn't a point either, and with this sort of coherent thinking, what hope is there?

Bring back selection on the basis of ability, be it academic, artistic, practical or what have you. Age 11 is a bit young, say fourteen or fifteen. Put money into places that are targeted at given skills, we aren't all the same, we have different interests (and interest, in whatever, is extremely important) and abilities. Put like with like doing what they like and encourage them.


*On that tack, and apologies for a small digression, many unions claim that their actions are to protect 'public safety' or some other such important thing, with it being mere coincidence that their members' jobs are required to do this. But, where technology proves itself far less fallible than humans, they are never keen o see it brought in.

 

[alex04w]

I agree with many of your sentiments @Danllan .

I have advocated on here before for the return of 'technical' education. In the past we had genuine technical schools. Then they became technical colleges. Then they became Colleges of Further and Higher Education. Then they became Institutes of Further and Higher Education.

At the end they are acting like pseudo universities and no longer taught technical subjects like woodworking, engineering, etc.

The push was for more and more people to go to university. To get ones hands dirty was totally unacceptable. We no longer trained people for trades.

There is a movement against academic selection (at any age). It might damage the poor little snowflakes if they were labelled as 'failures'.

Some people are academic. Some people are practical / hands on. Very very few people are both - and that is where we find our brain surgeons!

The old junior technical school took pupils in at the age of 14. They gave them a good sound education in practical subjects, along with the necessary basics of English and maths. It provided fantastic tradesmen who were very skilled in their chosen field. It allowed the grammar schools to concentrate on teaching the brain boxes who could quote pi to 20 places, but could not tie their shoe laces as could not do anything practical.

Then people wonder why we are no longer a nation that manufactures things. It is simple - we tried to send everyone to university and abandoned technical education.

Return the junior technical colleges.

 

[arcobob]

I believe that we should provide free further education as appropriate with particular emphasis on those skills which are in most demand. The scattergun approach may catch a few votes but is totally wasteful and helps nobody in the long run.

 

[Danllan]

I believe that we should provide free further education as appropriate with particular emphasis on those skills which are in most demand. The scattergun approach may catch a few votes but is totally wasteful and helps nobody in the long run.

Yep, been advocating this for years. Free degrees in needed fields for those getting the right grades, dossers in those subjects and anyone doing 'luxury' courses should have to pay the full whack themselves.

 

[Muck Spreader]

I agree with many of your sentiments @Danllan .

I have advocated on here before for the return of 'technical' education. In the past we had genuine technical schools. Then they became technical colleges. Then they became Colleges of Further and Higher Education. Then they became Institutes of Further and Higher Education.

At the end they are acting like pseudo universities and no longer taught technical subjects like woodworking, engineering, etc.

The push was for more and more people to go to university. To get ones hands dirty was totally unacceptable. We no longer trained people for trades.

There is a movement against academic selection (at any age). It might damage the poor little snowflakes if they were labelled as 'failures'.

Some people are academic. Some people are practical / hands on. Very very few people are both - and that is where we find our brain surgeons!

The old junior technical school took pupils in at the age of 14. They gave them a good sound education in practical subjects, along with the necessary basics of English and maths. It provided fantastic tradesmen who were very skilled in their chosen field. It allowed the grammar schools to concentrate on teaching the brain boxes who could quote pi to 20 places, but could not tie their shoe laces as could not do anything practical.

Then people wonder why we are no longer a nation that manufactures things. It is simple - we tried to send everyone to university and abandoned technical education.

Return the junior technical colleges.

It is still a similar system in France. The kids make a decision around 15 y/o as to what sort of sixthform education they wish to pursue. So you could start an apprenticeship to be an engineer, musician, nurse etc from around that age, still doing the core subjects like Maths and French. But it still leaves you with the option of following it through at university level if required. However, what you also have to remember is, France also has a separate system for the elite (wealthy) future leaders in politics, law, sciences etc, which takes the brightest to a Prepa and then to a Grand Ecol.