Grain maize questions

[Pilatus]

How do the economics of grain mai stand up compared to the SFI cropping payments that are available for late plantedSFI spring crops.?
Apparently grain maize makes a mess of the internals on the combine as usually so wet when the grain is harvested.Someone I know combines quite a lot of grain maize and has the job of cleaning,overhauling the combine for the next season.The rats play hell if not thoroughly cleaned immediately at the end of the season, which he said was a nightmare last autumn/this spring

 

[davidroberts30]

How do the economics of grain mai stand up compared to the SFI cropping payments that are available for late plantedSFI spring crops.?
Apparently grain maize makes a mess of the internals on the combine as usually so wet when the grain is harvested.Someone I know combines quite a lot of grain maize and has the job of cleaning,overhauling the combine for the next season.The rats play hell if not thoroughly cleaned immediately at the end of the season, which he said was a nightmare last autumn/this spring

No sfi option in wales

 

[som farmer]

How do the economics of grain mai stand up compared to the SFI cropping payments that are available for late plantedSFI spring crops.?
Apparently grain maize makes a mess of the internals on the combine as usually so wet when the grain is harvested.Someone I know combines quite a lot of grain maize and has the job of cleaning,overhauling the combine for the next season.The rats play hell if not thoroughly cleaned immediately at the end of the season, which he said was a nightmare last autumn/this spring

chap that combined ours, does a lot, didn't think it was a problem, his own maize is cut dec/jan.

 

[davidroberts30]

is there any PGR for maize in uk?
would it shorten the plant to give better cob/stalk ratio

 

[Brisel]

is there any PGR for maize in uk?
would it shorten the plant to give better cob/stalk ratio

Are you a member of the Maize Growers Association? They may have some research on this. They have a good database of trials work but only members can access it.

 

[davidroberts30]

Are you a member of the Maize Growers Association? They may have some research on this. They have a good database of trials work but only members can access it.

no, i'm not
google is short on uk results

 

[warksfarmer]

Just thinking aloud here..

Getting on for spring barley,maybe better off with something else.
Thinking a couple of ton of grain maize off the 10a might be better.
Would be all fed in house to beef.

Can sow it with the combi,
Have small conventional combine header to cut it(if it will do it)
What sort of date does it come fit to cut?
Can you glypho a crop to ripen it?

Storage-
Can it be propcorned?
Thinking I could store it in ton bags as not set up for it.

Feeding
Thinking a few 00 kgs rolled into the barley and fed to the beasts

Like I said, just ideas at the moment

Tried it about 12 years ago.

1. Yield was variable but particularly poor on the headlands even though we had subsoiled. I think it was the traffic turning from the other passes.
2. Cloddy areas did not come well so you need to power harrow unless on very nice soil.
3. We put it under plastic to have a earlier harvest date which was mid september but I know variety difference today would probably get round that.
4. Average yield was about 4t/acre but it varied between 0 and 7 on the yield maps.
5. Load of trash to deal with after harvest but no ruts because the trash carried the trailers very well.
6. The trash however caused mycotoxin levels in the following wheat so it had to go for feed and not milling which lost us at the time £50/t premium.
7. Establishing the following wheat was costly as we had to disc twice before ploughing to get the trash down.
8. Price wise at the time is was about £25/t under the feed wheat price.

Didn't grow it again as at the time factoring in the high establishment costs of the maize, the variable yield, the lost of milling premium in the following wheat and then high costs of getting that wheat in, it just wasn't worth the hassle.

Also the weed pressure under the plastic was high even though it was pre-emed under the plastic at planting. Once the crop had broken through the plastic we ended u p spraying it a couple more times from memory.

 

[davidroberts30]

Tried it about 12 years ago.

1. Yield was variable but particularly poor on the headlands even though we had subsoiled. I think it was the traffic turning from the other passes.
2. Cloddy areas did not come well so you need to power harrow unless on very nice soil.
3. We put it under plastic to have a earlier harvest date which was mid september but I know variety difference today would probably get round that.
4. Average yield was about 4t/acre but it varied between 0 and 7 on the yield maps.
5. Load of trash to deal with after harvest but no ruts because the trash carried the trailers very well.
6. The trash however caused mycotoxin levels in the following wheat so it had to go for feed and not milling which lost us at the time £50/t premium.
7. Establishing the following wheat was costly as we had to disc twice before ploughing to get the trash down.
8. Price wise at the time is was about £25/t under the feed wheat price.

Didn't grow it again as at the time factoring in the high establishment costs of the maize, the variable yield, the lost of milling premium in the following wheat and then high costs of getting that wheat in, it just wasn't worth the hassle.

Also the weed pressure under the plastic was high even though it was pre-emed under the plastic at planting. Once the crop had broken through the plastic we ended u p spraying it a couple more times from memory.

2. will combi sow it
4. i would aim for 3 anything else is bonus
5. as being cut conventionally thinking to bale the haulm and use first to clear field ( if conditions allowed)
6. might follow with winter barley if lucky or spring barley (feed) otherwise
7. as 5

8. was wondering how the price compared to other grain

 

[warksfarmer]

2. will combi sow it
4. i would aim for 3 anything else is bonus
5. as being cut conventionally thinking to bale the haulm and use first to clear field ( if conditions allowed)
6. might follow with winter barley if lucky or spring barley (feed) otherwise
7. as 5

8. was wondering how the price compared to other grain

I wouldn't use a combi because seed spacing for maize is critical to achieve the number of seeds on the corn heads. Just look at what they do in the states and its always a precision seeder of some description.

And I'd check that the haulm will go through a baler before swathing it all. The combine chopper struggled due to the size of the stalks and the mass of it so do a test run and see otherwise you'll have an even bigger problem. I think it probably was good for the OM content of the soil though as we must of put back at least 20t/ac of biomass.

 

[Brisel]

What moisture did you cut it at and how did you dry it please @warksfarmer ?

 

[warksfarmer]

What moisture did you cut it at and how did you dry it please @warksfarmer ?

I think it was around 25-28% from memory. Dried some on an underfloor system and some went for crimping. I should add the crimping price was £25/t under feed wheat not the dried price.

 

[davidroberts30]

I wouldn't use a combi because seed spacing for maize is critical to achieve the number of seeds on the corn heads. Just look at what they do in the states and its always a precision seeder of some description.

And I'd check that the haulm will go through a baler before swathing it all. The combine chopper struggled due to the size of the stalks and the mass of it so do a test run and see otherwise you'll have an even bigger problem. I think it probably was good for the OM content of the soil though as we must of put back at least 20t/ac of biomass.

combi sowed works fine

only reason they precision drill in rows is for the corn heads to strip the cobs

 

[warksfarmer]

combi sowed works fine

only reason they precision drill in rows is for the corn heads to strip the cobs

Where we had bunching of seed due to the precision seeder missing a drop of sticking the bunched plants were 10 times smaller than the correctly spaced plants. It is definitely not just for corn heads. I wasnt referring to the row widths ....... I meant the seed spacing within the row like with root crops.

 

[som farmer]

2. will combi sow it
4. i would aim for 3 anything else is bonus
5. as being cut conventionally thinking to bale the haulm and use first to clear field ( if conditions allowed)
6. might follow with winter barley if lucky or spring barley (feed) otherwise
7. as 5

8. was wondering how the price compared to other grain

we combi drilled a field, good crop, but, we lost a calf in it, and once you are in the maize, with no rows to follow, you are completely disorientated. Son came out on a completely different side, than he expected to. Calf was with the cow few hours later.

gave us a good laugh though !

we d/d w/wheat straight into the maize stubble, and this year, d/d IRG as well.

thought we might have trouble this winter with microtoxins, we crimped the wheat, bit of mould on the ramp of the pit, so micro-sorb, as we went in, no mould, so stopped adding it, no trouble.

 

[davidroberts30]

Where we had bunching of seed due to the precision seeder missing a drop of sticking the bunched plants were 10 times smaller than the correctly spaced plants. It is definitely not just for corn heads. I wasnt referring to the row widths ....... I meant the seed spacing within the row like with root crops.

ive tried it loads of ways over the years for ensiling
best way was to just sow it on normal cereal 12.5cm rows

 

[davidroberts30]

we combi drilled a field, good crop, but, we lost a calf in it, and once you are in the maize, with no rows to follow, you are completely disorientated. Son came out on a completely different side, than he expected to. Calf was with the cow few hours later.

gave us a good laugh though !

we d/d w/wheat straight into the maize stubble, and this year, d/d IRG as well.

thought we might have trouble this winter with microtoxins, we crimped the wheat, bit of mould on the ramp of the pit, so micro-sorb, as we went in, no mould, so stopped adding it, no trouble.

yeah takes some walking through once it gets over head height!!!

 

[Brisel]

I think it was around 25-28% from memory. Dried some on an underfloor system and some went for crimping. I should add the crimping price was £25/t under feed wheat not the dried price.

What moisture was needed for crimping? £25/t is what my back-of-fag-packet costs are to dry 7% out of maize with a mobile batch drier that is intensive in terms of fuel, labour and a tractor tied up on the front of it. Your well depreciated drying floor should be a lot cheaper per tonne depending on stirrers and what heat you had to put into the air.

 

[davidroberts30]

What moisture was needed for crimping? £25/t is what my back-of-fag-packet costs are to dry 7% out of maize with a mobile batch drier that is intensive in terms of fuel, labour and a tractor tied up on the front of it. Your well depreciated drying floor should be a lot cheaper per tonne depending on stirrers and what heat you had to put into the air.

i think you would be at 14l a ton for propcorn so £20 there

 

[Badshot]

What moisture was needed for crimping? £25/t is what my back-of-fag-packet costs are to dry 7% out of maize with a mobile batch drier that is intensive in terms of fuel, labour and a tractor tied up on the front of it. Your well depreciated drying floor should be a lot cheaper per tonne depending on stirrers and what heat you had to put into the air.

You should only cut in a day what you can dry, otherwise it gets high mycotoxins and is no good.
Fast drying is essential
Crimping obviously negates that risk entirely.

 

[Against_the_grain]

Grain Maize gives us as good a margin as a 1st wheat. Growing over 1000t/year now and can only see this increasing