Grazing rental aggro

[scatterbrainedlass]

I am currently renting some land off a horsey person. She had too much grass, needed help keeping it down. Originally 1 field, when I offered a price she said I could use a 2nd field in rotation for a bit extra a month. It's probably just shy of 3 acres all in, and I currently have 15 gimmers on there, which cannot keep on top of the grass. This morning I mentioned to her (being the decent sort and keeping her in the loop) that I'd probably shove about 40 on there for a few weeks pre-tupping, get it eaten off and then rest it, tupping elsewhere, and see how it looked. She said it'd cost me more if I put more sheep on. Now I assumed that I was paying for the land, and it was up to me how I use it (within reason). She wants grazing per head despite the fact that the 15 I have now will not do the job she wants doing. She's heard from someone else that they have to pay per head for grazing, and wants the same, but couldn't remember how much he was paying. I was under the impression that you pay EITHER land rent or grazing per head. Unfortunately, due to other issues right now, I can't go elsewhere for another couple of months, so I am going to have to be nice and try to keep on the right side of her for the time being. Is she being a bit unreasonable here, or am I being naive?

 

[llamedos]

Wait till she comes back to you with a price per head, & say thanks, then pay that price for the 15 you have there.
40 + the 15 on 3 acres wont last them more than a few days, and not much good for flushing pre tupping.

 

[scatterbrainedlass]

They're knee deep, would have been about 40 total, so was hoping they'd clean it up a bit. Am going to see what price she comes back with. TBH, I don't think she knows how many I've got there now or how the grass is looking. Serves me right for renting off of non-farming landowners, nothing but aggro!

 

[CopperBeech]

I had this before. . . . . they said they wanted paying per head. . . . . on a couple of horse paddocks.

I left.

They rang me back when the grass got out of control and they'd have to pay someone to top it . . . .

 

[Goweresque]

If you need the grass and can't afford to lose it right now, pay up and swallow the words that would undoubtedly be spilling out of my mouth for sure! Then store the whole thing in your memory for next year when she's got too much grass and drive a hard bargain then. It'll cost her money to get a contractor in to top it, so the difference between getting a bit of rent in and paying out will be even greater.

 

[scatterbrainedlass]

@CopperBeech @Goweresque she's already had 3 of her 4 paddocks topped and asked a friend of mine if she would graze her goats on it. Goats would have demolished the hedges, so she put us forward instead. We're doing her a favour, or so I thought. Going to have to pay up for now and keep quiet (keep husband away from her!!) and like you said, see what happens in the future.

 

[unlacedgecko]

In future, get grazing agreements in writing.

 

[jade35]

Wait till she comes back to you with a price per head, & say thanks, then pay that price for the 15 you have there.
40 + the 15 on 3 acres wont last them more than a few days, and not much good for flushing pre tupping.

Not much good for flushing but the larger number will eat out and tread down the waste grass far better. The paddocks will be in much better condition for being tightly grazed and will probably produce a much better crop of grass next year

I may be wrong but I iirc a lot of the headage basis grazing is for winter keep and generally the sheep are looked after as well by the landlord and this is included in the price

 

[Y Fan Wen]

I may be wrong but I iirc a lot of the headage basis grazing is for winter keep and generally the sheep are looked after as well by the landlord and this is included in the price

That's right. Don't get any summer grazing let by the head round here.

 

[IH 684]

Normally small paddocks which otherwise would need topping should be grazed for free. It benefits the owner of not having to buy a topper or pay a contractor. If the land owner is keeping an eye on them and you only need to attend once a week a fee of around 50p per week per head would be reasonable

 

[Adam@Rumen]

Just put an extra one or two in a week, see how long it takes for her to notice

 

[pappuller]

tell her to shove it !!!!

 

[Woolless]

I am paying 30p/ewe and lambs /week on some pretty ordinary grazing, although it is next door. Not been grazed in a while, so we didn't know how much stock it would carry. Seemed the fairest way.

 

[Shadow]

I'm going to raise my head above the parapet as a "horsey person"!

I think she is very off moving the goalposts on you but from her point of view she may not realise she is doing this as grazing for horses is always charged per head.

It may be worth having a frank chat with her about usual terms and alternative options (cost of topping etc as per above posts) and you may find you can iron this out.

Of course, if stock numbers were discussed at the initial negotiation ignore everything I have said and ahe must be a typical horsey bitch

 

[glasshouse]

She should be paying you.

 

[Pasty]

How are you 'renting' the land? What sort of agreement do you have? I assume a proper grass license? That should set out the terms. If you don't have that then I suggest you depart ASAP and find a friendlier face somewhere else.

 

[AGN76]

Pile all the sheep on now, and when she gets back to you with a price take them all off again!

 

[Giles1]

I'm going to raise my head above the parapet as a "horsey person"!

I think she is very off moving the goalposts on you but from her point of view she may not realise she is doing this as grazing for horses is always charged per head.

It may be worth having a frank chat with her about usual terms and alternative options (cost of topping etc as per above posts) and you may find you can iron this out.

Of course, if stock numbers were discussed at the initial negotiation ignore everything I have said and ahe must be a typical horsey bitch

I go along with this,we rent out ground for a couple of horses and it is per head.We take grazing for cattle,some is per head and some per acre.This person may just figure livestock grazing works the same as horsey standard practice.You'd better pray she doesn't charge horse rates though,slight difference between 30p/week for a ewe and £20/week for a horse............

 

[scatterbrainedlass]

She wanted it grazing off, basically grass control. I can't remember if numbers were discussed at the start, but I only had 15 then anyway. I have some others elsewhere, and will be getting some more next week, and wanted to throw them all on there to get the grass down, which is what I thought she wanted. As I'm already paying per month for the fields, it seems odd that she wants per head as well, especially as my 15 aren't doing the job she wants? Unfortunately no contract, and tbh I didn't expect this to be the issue anyway!! I don't know that she's seen the fields since I put sheep on, and I don't know if she knows how many are on there, so am tempted to stick some more on and see what happens... at least let them get their fill before having to move on

*Edit* - sorry @Giles1 , I know some 'horsey' people are decent, but others don't seem to have the faintest idea how the other half live!

 

[GrannyAching]

Horsey people are like the rest of us, some good, some bad but as I cover both sides of the fence, I will say too many of them tend to be of the mind set that will spend £5000 on a horse and then quibble over 10p on a bale of hay or over the size of the bale even after they have seen the bales and agreed the price (had one this week - £1.20 off the field FGS she'd seen it evn asked if she could have more then when it came time to getting the cash out..........) So the only way to deal with it is to go head on IMO "I'm doing you a favour. I'm paying by the month as we agreed. I'm managing the sheep to do you the service you want. If the grass had not supported 15 I wouldn't have been coming back asking for a discount. and anything else in a similar vein."

If it's still no go walk away (whatever your circs - I got the matches out once over a load of hay), they usually see sense once you make them look outside the "me bubble".