Groundswell a bit pricey?

[The Ruminant]

practical thinking then practical application experience helps with the line of thought as well. my brain is no good academic thinking like the science of it all mind you.

with our paddock system theres no time spent on internal subdivision no labour spent on fettling internal subdividing electric fences water availiable to the whole field ,then they get moved just by opening the gate to the next one and shutting it after. ,what ever size the field is number of stock, how wet the the conditions are ect, could be a week could be 2 weeks .......... very easy to do.
...and it needs to be imo if a person wants to survive at /enjoy doing the job for a long time .
but then we do have an average field size of about 6 acres.

I think you're spot on - you have to enjoy it, otherwise what's the point?

The only change it may be worth you looking into is length of time the cattle spend in a paddock - if you can reduce it below a week, say, by stringing a single line across the field (so they spend half the time in each side) then that will help the grass no end. Grass has to use its energy reserves (stored in its roots) to grow another shoot. At this time of year it does this in less than a week (may even be as soon as only 3 days when it's grazeable again).

If your cattle nip off that new shoot, before it has photosynthesised enough to replace the energy taken from the root to grow it, then it has to draw down even more energy for another shoot. There's only a finite store of energy - the second regrowth will be slower, the third may kill the individual grass plant completely (it runs out of fuel). Do this often enough and your pasture runs out of steam and may need a costly reseed, or weeds start growing where the individual grass plants have died and you need to get the sprayer out.

(Of course the above may not apply, if you've got the stocking rate at a low enough level to mean there's still plenty of leaf left on each plant even after stock have been in the field for a couple of weeks)

 

[SilliamWhale]

He got mad at me on Twitter because I didn’t want to pay for his content before even knowing if I thought his content was worthwhile.

Guess you’re supposed to already know who he is

I'm not a big fan so of him. I think he makes too many unsubstantiated claims and over markets his potions.

 

[Huno]

I'm not a big fan so of him. I think he makes too many unsubstantiated claims and over markets his potions.

Stay at home then... pay or dont pay... turn up or dont turn up... you are but an algorithm after all with no face like the rest of us... rest easy.. stay safe.. stop learning... blahh

 

[Huno]

Americans over Market everything everyone... the rest of us in the UK including Wales have to graft for it now.. so FFS graft...

 

[Chae1]

I heard @SilliamWhale speak year we went. Enjoyed his presentation.

Also Ruby Wax. Didn't enjoy that so much.

 

[nails]

I heard @SilliamWhale speak year we went. Enjoyed his presentation.

Also Ruby Wax. Didn't enjoy that so much.

You paid to see Ruby Wax? I am speechless

 

[nails]

I think you're spot on - you have to enjoy it, otherwise what's the point?

The only change it may be worth you looking into is length of time the cattle spend in a paddock - if you can reduce it below a week, say, by stringing a single line across the field (so they spend half the time in each side) then that will help the grass no end. Grass has to use its energy reserves (stored in its roots) to grow another shoot. At this time of year it does this in less than a week (may even be as soon as only 3 days when it's grazeable again).

If your cattle nip off that new shoot, before it has photosynthesised enough to replace the energy taken from the root to grow it, then it has to draw down even more energy for another shoot. There's only a finite store of energy - the second regrowth will be slower, the third may kill the individual grass plant completely (it runs out of fuel). Do this often enough and your pasture runs out of steam and may need a costly reseed, or weeds start growing where the individual grass plants have died and you need to get the sprayer out.

(Of course the above may not apply, if you've got the stocking rate at a low enough level to mean there's still plenty of leaf left on each plant even after stock have been in the field for a couple of weeks)

Well that is not true for some of my old pastures which have not seen a plough since WW2 and have had all regimes of grazing done on them from over grazing to under grazing and still this year there is more grass in those pastures than ever. I will add that i have seen many a newer ley pack up. Why?

 

[Kiwi Pete]

Well that is not true for some of my old pastures which have not seen a plough since WW2 and have had all regimes of grazing done on them from over grazing to under grazing and still this year there is more grass in those pastures than ever. I will add that i have seen many a newer ley pack up. Why?

Expectation ruins a lot of chances

Remember Dad telling me that when I was learning to shoot, either way, our results are our results.
Undergrazing and overgrazing are not the end of the world with older pastures as they tend to be fairly "plastic" in a lot of environments. Not many of us are waiting 3 years for the first rains

 

[Bury the Trash]

Well that is not true for some of my old pastures which have not seen a plough since WW2 and have had all regimes of grazing done on them from over grazing to under grazing and still this year there is more grass in those pastures than ever. I will add that i have seen many a newer ley pack up. Why?

bigger better roots systems that survive over the years , tougher / more suited plant types.

same here weve got sheep walk thats never been touched not even during the War . Its still the same even with set stocking.

rabbits are the biggest test, survive their persistant nibling and it will survive anything

 

[nails]

Expectation ruins a lot of chances

Remember Dad telling me that when I was learning to shoot, either way, our results are our results.
Undergrazing and overgrazing are not the end of the world with older pastures as they tend to be fairly "plastic" in a lot of environments. Not many of us are waiting 3 years for the first rains

Eh? The point was made that over grazing would kill a pasture and i am telling you ,it must be the wrong sort of pasture for the area as the right pasture will survive.

 

[Henarar]

Eh? The point was made that over grazing would kill a pasture and i am telling you ,it must be the wrong sort of pasture for the area as the right pasture will survive.

I am glad My Dad didn't have time to farm this farm "properly" it means I can carry on the same
Cut a field yesterday that has not been reseeded since the war, the pasture is still good and will most likely see me out.

 

[Ffermer Bach]

We should all be working together.

yes very god speakers but flying people everywhere to speak isn’t the answer. We need to start actually thinking about all the causes of pollution not just the conventional farmers 🫣

Flying to Groundswell pales into insignificance when compared to pollution that occurs during a war, so if we really want to save the planet, we better make sure we don't trip into another world war.

 

[Ffermer Bach]

I heard @SilliamWhale speak year we went. Enjoyed his presentation.

Also Ruby Wax. Didn't enjoy that so much.

I wasn't impressed with her either

 

[Ffermer Bach]

Well that is not true for some of my old pastures which have not seen a plough since WW2 and have had all regimes of grazing done on them from over grazing to under grazing and still this year there is more grass in those pastures than ever. I will add that i have seen many a newer ley pack up. Why?

not seeing a plough, so the soil biome is undisturbed maybe?

 

[soapsud]

You need to listen to all his podcasts before you listen to Mr Kempf in person

117 podcasts at 90 minutes ish each!
I don't tink so!
Give as a one sentence summary like

"Forget the soil health it's the plant health you should be chasing"

 

[Huno]

117 podcasts at 90 minutes ish each!
I don't tink so!
Give as a one sentence summary like

"Forget the soil health it's the plant health you should be chasing"

Fair enough!! I have heard a few... plant health does equal soil health i guess!!

 

[Bury the Trash]

Fair enough!! I have heard a few... plant health does equal soil health i guess!!

hydroponics

 

[Kiwi Pete]

Eh? The point was made that over grazing would kill a pasture and i am telling you ,it must be the wrong sort of pasture for the area as the right pasture will survive.

It may, and likely would kill a tiller.

A whole pasture, well, I'm yet to see that.

Your older pastures will be several generations deep, there will be old tired plants and younger tired plants as well as newer ones, tiny seedlings, and seed... for each species present and a few more.

Compared to a "well managed" ley where everything is the same age and size, it'll tolerate a lot more flak; your older tired plants will grow slower and use less of their root reserves to regrow, so overgrazing tends to affect the more vigorous ones first.

"Pasture run out" or "weed grass ingress" are classic symptoms of this happening, because people think pastures are good to go again before they're recovered.

It's too-frequent interruption of succession and sometimes easier to spot in different communities than pastures, for example the disastrous 'one child policy' or world wars ? We can see cause and effect reasonably clearly in both examples, but we are not extinct yet

A lot of waffle is talked about "diverse pastures" but complexity seems to be forgotten about.. we can easily sell diversity in a bag but complexity requires looser management and many farmers are control freaks, a much harder "sell"

 

[Kiwi Pete]

I am glad My Dad didn't have time to farm this farm "properly" it means I can carry on the same
Cut a field yesterday that has not been reseeded since the war, the pasture is still good and will most likely see me out.

Pastures should be improving for 50-70+ years after establishment, if not, some checks [management][expectations][intentions] are required.

 

[Bury the Trash]

Yes there's fields here that are that old and far older, not sure what improved means bit they are the same as they always were since grandfather and great grandfather farmed them
thaticanrememberayway.


Ask the arable farmers (inthiscountry)what weed they fear most and i bet most times it will be grass

Grass will cover andpersisteasily here , mostly probably by the 30 odd meadow grass varieties who can have both fi s leaves and/or rhizomatous root system that keeps it going over the years
Seed growing in a covered environment is rare, bare patches yes that's if t
He creeping roots of surrounding b plants havnf got thefe first.
Some of the Bents are here big time as well.