Highlanders

[Jop]

Anyone got much experience with highlanders? Interested as from what Innovis say they seem to fit the bill but is this really the case on farms in the UK? Spoke to a kiwi about them and he reckons that most farmers hate them in New Zealand, so why have they been a success here? Also how would they compare with say a Romney or a Lleyn? Thanks

 

[Poorbuthappy]

I've got some.
Variable, is what I would say.
I wonder if part of the problem is that people have kept too many ewe lambs and not been selective enough due to being promised an outlet via Focus.
Innovis are keen to rectify this, so it will be interesting to see how they progress.

More prolific than the Romney.
I found them more prolific than the lleyn, but that's another breed I've found with a lot of variation.
But that's true of any breed I guess. Some people rave about mules, but I've seen some pretty awful ones. Sheep that ought to have been hung up as lambs can give any breed a bad name.

@neilo has a decent flock of them. Perhaps because he's bred up from something that had already been heavily selected.

 

[Spartacus]

I heard that the New Zealanders did as good a sales job on us UK folk as possible to try to export every single last bit of highlander blood over here

 

[Global ovine]

Your Kiwi contact has obviously very fixed opinions about breeds in NZ. But from where I sit in the NZ industry I believe I can be a bit more objective. Highlanders are one of the several Composite breeds which were developed from the improved modern NZ Romneys by introducing other breeds such as Finn and/or East Friesian for earlier onset of puberty, hence better hogget lambing, and higher litter size at lower body weights and Texel to improve hardiness carcass meat yields. Like all breeds these have a steady demand from farmers who are exploiting their advantages. Highlanders happened to be one of the first Composites on the NZ market, therefore having the largest Composite market.
The continuous genetic development of the other main NZ maternal breeds (especially from the leading breeders on SILACE) has kept their productivity inline with the Composites. However it will take many generations of selection to catch the Composites for traits such as hogget lambing. It is interesting to note that most of the top Romney, Coopworth and Perendale stud flocks have included MyoMAX genes thereby negating the carcass yield advantage once held by Composites only.
It is a question of "horses for courses". So firstly sort out your course.

I work with farmers running several Composite options and all the breeds I have mentioned above. The top performer per stock unit (ewe equivalent) is another Composite option followed by a mix of Coopworths and Romneys. Highlanders are found in the top half, but more reflect their numbers compared to say Romneys which are still the most numerous.

 

[Jop]

So with a Composite breed such as Highlander is it fine to keep breeding ewes to a Highlander ram for many generations or do you need to cross them to another breed occasionally to still benefit from the Hybrid vigour? Or would it be a better option to have say a nucleus flock of a pure breed such as a Romney and cross them to a Highlander ram so that you are not breeding your ewes too pure?

 

[sherg]

You probably need to go out and have a look at a few flocks that have got them see if you like them and see what kind of results they are getting don't think they're everyone's cup of tea but they've got a place personally i'd have a closed flock of highlanders before i'd buy mules in, heard they might be using they're abertex line in them as well reckon that would make a really good ewe

 

[Big Al]

I've got some.
Variable, is what I would say.
I wonder if part of the problem is that people have kept too many ewe lambs and not been selective enough due to being promised an outlet via Focus.
Innovis are keen to rectify this, so it will be interesting to see how they progress.

More prolific than the Romney.
I found them more prolific than the lleyn, but that's another breed I've found with a lot of variation.
But that's true of any breed I guess. Some people rave about mules, but I've seen some pretty awful ones. Sheep that ought to have been hung up as lambs can give any breed a bad name.

@neilo has a decent flock of them. Perhaps because he's bred up from something that had already been heavily selected.

I've bought some shearling ewes this year and two shearling rams with the intention of gradually replacing my existing flock of continental crosses.
Can't really comment on performance yet but they do seem to be more economical with grazing.

Which aspects do you find variable?

 

[Poorbuthappy]

I've bought some shearling ewes this year and two shearling rams with the intention of gradually replacing my existing flock of continental crosses.
Can't really comment on performance yet but they do seem to be more economical with grazing.

Which aspects do you find variable?

Quality of lamb produced.
My heaviest lamb at weaning this year was a pure highlander single. But if I were to go through my smallest lambs, there would be a high proportion of highlanders (& lleyns) amongst them.

Good points
- prolific. My bunch of 4T's scanned at over 200% last time, when everything else was below normal.
Obviously not everyone wants this level of prolificacy.
- yes certainly agree on the grazing front. Plus they also seem to be less fussy eaters, with the result that they are easier to keep in. - my neighbour prefers I bring Highlanders to graze his ground than mules.
- easy lambing. Vigorous lambs.

 

[Jop]

They sound just like Lleyns! How pure are your highlander ewes? I would be worried having scanning % that high for lambing outdoors, do you flush yours? I guess there just like most sheep breeds, there's good and bad ones!

 

[Johnny400]

Weve been using them for 5 years now. They doing a good job for us, but Dad has been quite picky in the type of tup weve bought. We still have a very mixed bunch of ewes but that reflects more the lleyns we had for a start. Was very disappointed with the selection of rams on offer this year and the head Innovis lad picked that up from our conversation with him. He mentioned along the lines that they needed some of his breeding in them! This year ive kept a couple of our own ram lambs to use. Next year i may look more seriously at an NZ texel or abertex or even back to lleyn again

 

[Big Al]

- yes certainly agree on the grazing front. Plus they also seem to be less fussy eaters, with the result that they are easier to keep in.

Agree with that, moved them onto a field that had got a bit too far ahead. It's pp and has got quite alot of couch and other weed grasses in it. A week later stocked at 25 to the acre and it looks like it's been topped they have grazed it down so evenly.

 

[Global ovine]

So with a Composite breed such as Highlander is it fine to keep breeding ewes to a Highlander ram for many generations or do you need to cross them to another breed occasionally to still benefit from the Hybrid vigour? Or would it be a better option to have say a nucleus flock of a pure breed such as a Romney and cross them to a Highlander ram so that you are not breeding your ewes too pure?

Some of the hybrid vigour in a fixed Composite is retained. But like all new breeds, variability exists until the gene pool becomes more homozygous.
If you are keen on getting a free lunch (hybrid vigour) I suggest criss-crossing the breeds which tick your boxes. The most important decision is your vision and then using whatever genetics fit. But be careful not use a breed which may add something but brings in problems elsewhere.

 

[NZDan]

Some of the hybrid vigour in a fixed Composite is retained. But like all new breeds, variability exists until the gene pool becomes more homozygous.
If you are keen on getting a free lunch (hybrid vigour) I suggest criss-crossing the breeds which tick your boxes. The most important decision is your vision and then using whatever genetics fit. But be careful not use a breed which may add something but brings in problems elsewhere.

I've always thought that a rotational cross breeding system involving Highlanders and Lleyns would be a good system both breeds are very similar in performance and looks. Heterosis with out the variation.

 

[neilo]

I've always thought that a rotational cross breeding system involving Highlanders and Lleyns would be a good system both breeds are very similar in performance and looks. Heterosis with out the variation.

I bet that damned Finn blood will still show through every now & again though.

 

[Poorbuthappy]

I've always thought that a rotational cross breeding system involving Highlanders and Lleyns would be a good system both breeds are very similar in performance and looks. Heterosis with out the variation.

Have thought about this myself, having both breeds here.

 

[NZDan]

I bet that damned Finn blood will still show through every now & again though.

ahhhh Finns the not so secret, 'Secret weapon'

 

[Devil's advocate]

Neighbour has 4,000 Highlander ewes graded up from NC Mules. Winter on poor grazing & waste onions, lamb themselves mostly, at 225% he removes the 3rd lamb which is sold or reared on machine. Lambs grow well on good summer grazing which is very heavily stocked. Was told he topped the market this week with Texel cross lambs which had been feedlot finished.

I've Hartlines seem nice sorts with less wool.

 

[Jop]

I would be worried if I scanned that high! Does he lamb them outdoors? I basically want a ewe that will lamb herself be able to rear two good lambs off grass alone and be able to keep a closed flock. Highlanders seem to fit but I'm thinking a scanning percentage like that generally means lots to triplets and lots of work. I like dans idea of rotational cross breeding them, and this could be to a breed like a Romney just to hold that scanning percentage back a bit but not losing sight of the other targets, also getting the free lunch of hybrid vigour as GO puts it!

 

[Devil's advocate]

I would be worried if I scanned that high! Does he lamb them outdoors? I basically want a ewe that will lamb herself be able to rear two good lambs off grass alone and be able to keep a closed flock. Highlanders seem to fit but I'm thinking a scanning percentage like that generally means lots to triplets and lots of work. I like dans idea of rotational cross breeding them, and this could be to a breed like a Romney just to hold that scanning percentage back a bit but not losing sight of the other targets, also getting the free lunch of hybrid vigour as GO puts it!

Inside, few staff though, think one shepherd & Polish helpers. Every ewe has a pair to go out with, can't believe how few poor milkers he has.

 

[NZDan]

Interesting to see that the Belclare is basically the same as a Highlander, Finn and Texel with a wee splash of some thing else.