Interesting reading about Angus Australia

[Samcowman]

http://www.angusaustralia.com.au/images/ASBP-Progeny_Performance_Report-Cohort_1_FULL_FINAL.pdf
http://www.angusaustralia.com.au/images/ASBP-Progeny_Performance_Report-Cohort_2_FULL_FINAL.pdf

These 2 reports from the Australia Angus progeny test don't make very good reading for our supposedly top English AI Bulls.

 

[Newguy]

http://www.angusaustralia.com.au/images/ASBP-Progeny_Performance_Report-Cohort_1_FULL_FINAL.pdf
http://www.angusaustralia.com.au/images/ASBP-Progeny_Performance_Report-Cohort_2_FULL_FINAL.pdf

These 2 reports from the Australia Angus progeny test don't make very good reading for our supposedly top English AI Bulls.

Skim read a bit of it...
I didn't see many UK bulls? Netherton Mr Radar, nightingale ploughman and lorabar mighty prince.
Wouldn't call them "top English Ai bulls" ( and not just beacause they are British...)
All 3 are resonable calving ease bulls though (I think?)

 

[Newguy]

Half way through it...

You are not wrong - Netherton Mr Radar is not doing very well in the test. However, he scored well in eye muscle carcase. Yet not as good in eye muscle scan? He also scored well in net feed intake and "MSA ossification"?

Not that surprised. Kind of hard to compete with countries that can do performance recording on such a massive scale. Australian breeders - te mania angus have an impressive operation. And they have several trait leading bulls.
http://abri.une.edu.au/online/cgi-b...C3A5E003B0D01385805011309170D18200D3D350B1231 -9.9 days for gestation

http://abri.une.edu.au/online/cgi-b...C0E390B0F06260017130D1F111D2E0839070731171E3D his son

 

[Samcowman]

Skim read a bit of it...
I didn't see many UK bulls? Netherton Mr Radar, nightingale ploughman and lorabar mighty prince.
Wouldn't call them "top English Ai bulls" ( and not just beacause they are British...)
All 3 are resonable calving ease bulls though (I think?)

Yeah they are the only 3 English. I noticed no more English Bulls were used after the second cohort.
They would have the most Angus progeny sired in this country so numbers wise they would be the top AI Bulls over here. Maybe other Bulls should have been used other than ones used for dairy cows. The Aussies and kiwis wouldn't neccessarily know their use over here and would think they were the quality we had over here.

 

[Samcowman]

Half way through it...

You are not wrong - Netherton Mr Radar is not doing very well in the test. However, he scored well in eye muscle carcase. Yet not as good in eye muscle scan? He also scored well in net feed intake and "MSA ossification"?

Not that surprised. Kind of hard to compete with countries that can do performance recording on such a massive scale. Australian breeders - te mania angus have an impressive operation. And they have several trait leading bulls.
http://abri.une.edu.au/online/cgi-b...C3A5E003B0D01385805011309170D18200D3D350B1231 -9.9 days for gestation

http://abri.une.edu.au/online/cgi-b...C0E390B0F06260017130D1F111D2E0839070731171E3D his son

Yeah some big set ups over there. Hoping to be in NZ when there bull testing station has their open day in March. Trouble is over here even with our smaller scale we don't even have any bull testing stations. Then our cattle are made to look poorer when our best performing Bulls semen isn't even used on a big progeny test in Australia.

 

[Newguy]

Yeah they are the only 3 English. I noticed no more English Bulls were used after the second cohort.
They would have the most Angus progeny sired in this country so numbers wise they would be the top AI Bulls over here. Maybe other Bulls should have been used other than ones used for dairy cows. The Aussies and kiwis wouldn't neccessarily know their use over here and would think they were the quality we had over here.

I suppose they probably would be the most used angus bulls. Which makes me wonder who the top (most used) angus bulls are in the pedigree world in the UK?

Have finished looking through it. Strangely, all 3 did well in the net feed intake. Lorabar even ranked number 1!

 

[Samcowman]

I suppose they probably would be the most used angus bulls. Which makes me wonder who the top (most used) angus bulls are in the pedigree world in the UK?

Have finished looking through it. Strangely, all 3 did well in the net feed intake. Lorabar even ranked number 1!

Just a quick scan through on the Angus website on the semen catalogue. Bulls such as The Moss Mr Eshton, Rawburn Elysium and Netherton Figo have 300 + pedigree progeny registered.

@Alistair McLaren may know more about this progeny test.

 

[multi power]

Skim read a bit of it...
I didn't see many UK bulls? Netherton Mr Radar, nightingale ploughman and lorabar mighty prince.
Wouldn't call them "top English Ai bulls" ( and not just beacause they are British...)
All 3 are resonable calving ease bulls though (I think?)

Ploughman is not what I would call easy calving

 

[Newguy]

Ploughman is not what I would call easy calving

From personal experience?
Genus give him full marks for use on cows. And he ranked 15th for birthweight in the Australian progeny test.
However, genus don't rate him so well for hefers.

 

[multi power]

From personal experience?
Genus give him full marks for use on cows. And he ranked 15th for birthweight in the Australian progeny test.
However, genus don't rate him so well for hefers.

Maybe about ten or fifteen of his calves here and I had to pull maybe half of them

 

[Newguy]

Maybe about ten or fifteen of his calves here and I had to pull maybe half of them

What sort of cows or heifers were they out of?
Were they mostly bull calves?

 

[multi power]

Dairy cows, all good big strong cows. They had slipped from the rest of the block and were culled hard too so only were the best of the bunch
They were good calves but definitely not the small little calves that heifers would just squirte out like the Angus was twenty years ago. I guess they are now focusing on carcass rather than easy calving

 

[Newguy]

Just a quick scan through on the Angus website on the semen catalogue. Bulls such as The Moss Mr Eshton, Rawburn Elysium and Netherton Figo have 300 + pedigree progeny registered.

@Alistair McLaren may know more about this progeny test.

Netherallan Peter Pershore
http://abri.une.edu.au/online/cgi-b...&5=2B3C2B3C3A&6=275D5B265923252526&9=5B505D58

1337 progeny
Check (chess)

 

[Newguy]

Dairy cows, all good big strong cows. They had slipped from the rest of the block and were culled hard too so only were the best of the bunch
They were good calves but definitely not the small little calves that heifers would just squirte out like the Angus was twenty years ago. I guess they are now focusing on carcass rather than easy calving

Sorry to hear that. I would definetly agree that you can't assume that an Angus is easy calving.

 

[Samcowman]

Dairy cows, all good big strong cows. They had slipped from the rest of the block and were culled hard too so only were the best of the bunch
They were good calves but definitely not the small little calves that heifers would just squirte out like the Angus was twenty years ago. I guess they are now focusing on carcass rather than easy calving

Looking at the results of the progeny test you wouldn't say either LMP or ploughman were easy calving compared to the others in that cohort. So may back up what you found.

 

[Newguy]

Looking at the results of the progeny test you wouldn't say either LMP or ploughman were easy calving compared to the others in that cohort. So may back up what you found.

Nightingale Ploughman came 15th for birthweight and 17th for gestation length. Which looks resonable to me.

Where as Lorabar came 35th for both. With a 5 day longer gestation length.

 

[Samcowman]

Nightingale Ploughman came 15th for birthweight and 17th for gestation length. Which looks resonable to me.

Where as Lorabar came 35th for both. With a 5 day longer gestation length.

If they are marketed as easy calving then they should be coming top or very close I would have thought.
On those results mighty prince shouldn't be sold as easy calving.
Looking at those results for the first cohort I would probably choose Ardrossan Direction for calving ease and he gives good 200 day growth as well

 

[Newguy]

If they are marketed as easy calving then they should be coming top or very close I would have thought.
On those results mighty prince shouldn't be sold as easy calving.
Looking at those results for the first cohort I would probably choose Ardrossan Direction for calving ease and he gives good 200 day growth as well

Genus ranks lorabar as being above avereage. However, they have several bulls that rank far better.

Compared to ploughman, Adrossan Direction's calves are only 1.4kgs lighter. However, birthweight isn't the same as calving ease.
Adrossan's 200 day growth is only 10kgs better. And that goes down to 3.5kgs by 400 days.

*looks at 600 day growth of Adrossan Direction*

....nevermind

 

[Newguy]

Based purely on figures

I would choose Millah Murrah Equator.
Or the similarly named Ardrossan Equator.

 

[M-J-G]

Half way through it...

You are not wrong - Netherton Mr Radar is not doing very well in the test. However, he scored well in eye muscle carcase. Yet not as good in eye muscle scan? He also scored well in net feed intake and "MSA ossification"?

Not that surprised. Kind of hard to compete with countries that can do performance recording on such a massive scale. Australian breeders - te mania angus have an impressive operation. And they have several trait leading bulls.
http://abri.une.edu.au/online/cgi-b...C3A5E003B0D01385805011309170D18200D3D350B1231 -9.9 days for gestation

http://abri.une.edu.au/online/cgi-b...C0E390B0F06260017130D1F111D2E0839070731171E3D his son

Yes many animal's will be kept on a bigger scale in big commercially run pedigree herds.

I think it backs up the theory that without large scale commercial herds and flock included in EBVs the system is flawed. Dairy, pigs and poultry have large recorded commercial enterprises, this is where figures were designed for, not 50 individual pedigree animals in a separate lambing/calving season and management system from commercial animals on the same farm.