Is there a link between Ergot and BSE???

[Rob Holmes]

Was thinking about that conformed case of BSE a couple of weeks ago and I've been wondering where it came from, and I wondered, has it ever been investigated whether the cause is the animal was fed Ergot invested corn?

 

[chaffcutter]

Isn’t Ergot a precursor of LSD? I’m sure I’ve read about it being responsible for many deaths years ago when food was short, haven’t looked it up but it’s stuck in my memory from somewhere.

 

[KMA]

defintely a thought, Salem witch trials were sparked off by ergot infected rye.

 

[Courier]

Could be something displaying similar symptoms to BSE but not BSE per se.

 

[chaffcutter]

Just read wiki on ergotism, the mental symptoms are remarkably similar to what could be diagnosed as BSE.

 

[Tarw Coch]

Just read wiki on ergotism, the mental symptoms are remarkably similar to what could be diagnosed as BSE.

You would hope with the amount of investigation that has been done into BSE that similar symptoms to a layman would be easily differentiated under lab analysis.

 

[som farmer]

you have now pleased a whole heap of scientists, they can now apply for funding to investigate this, if they can cause enough controversy, they can keep it up for years

 

[Pieces_of_Eight]

The amount of ergot entering commercial feed mills is negligible.

If a particular feed mill had an ergot contamination, many cattle across different herds would be affected, not just an odd one. The symptoms would be physical and not just mental.

http://www.apsnet.org/edcenter/intropp/lessons/fungi/ascomycetes/pages/ergot.aspx

 

[glasshouse]

The amount of ergot entering commercial feed mills is negligible.

If a particular feed mill had an ergot contamination, many cattle across different herds would be affected, not just an odd one. The symptoms would be physical and not just mental.

http://www.apsnet.org/edcenter/intropp/lessons/fungi/ascomycetes/pages/ergot.aspx

What about fatm saved feed?

 

[Pieces_of_Eight]

Home mill & mix would be a logical source of ergot, but the quantity required to send adult cattle loopy would be 0.2-0.5%

0.2% of an artic load would be 58kg of ergot, which would stand out a mile in wheat, oats or barley.

 

[glasshouse]

Home mill & mix would be a logical source of ergot, but the quantity required to send adult cattle loopy would be 0.2-0.5%

0.2% of an artic load would be 58kg of ergot, which would stand out a mile in wheat, oats or barley.

Its quite possible

 

[Pieces_of_Eight]

Possible yes, but not probable.

And if ergot was entering a single herd's feed by the dustbin-full, many animals would be affected.

 

[glasshouse]

If wholecrop wheat was going into the pit and fed, ergot would never be seen
Growing wheat in wet areas with lots of grass is exactly where you find ergot

 

[Exfarmer]

but for ergot to give its psycho hallucinogenic features it needs to be fermented as in a sour dough or some such.

 

[KMA]

OK so what were they doing in Salem to get the problem? I'd always thought they'd just made bread with the rye, I've never heard of rye beer, although all things will ferment given the right conditions and wild yeast is everywhere anyway.

 

[Happy]

OK so what were they doing in Salem to get the problem? I'd always thought they'd just made bread with the rye, I've never heard of rye beer, although all things will ferment given the right conditions and wild yeast is everywhere anyway.

Know a few farmers in Aberdeenshire(just as likely anywhere) that we’re getting surplus silage from AD plants to see them through the tail end of last winter.

Would be plenty fermented rye in some of that.

 

[Derrick Hughes]

Would there be much wheat in calf pellets . That's where it came from .
Feeding young dairy calves infected bone meal

 

[KMA]

I have my own idea about which calf weaner pellets were involved, company was taken over and now disappeared entirely. Feck knows what was in those pellets but they were widely fed to dairy calves, very rarely to any other cattle.

 

[Farmer Fin]

There is no link to BSE and LSD. Both affect the brain but in different ways, LSD short term and BSE long term chronic. Your right about LSD / ergot / rye and witches the interest point is were the witches on LSD or the villagers who thought these people were witches!

The BSE case in Scotland was a random case the cause will probably not be identified but there will be a genetic susceptibility then some sort of environmental trigger ie ergot / virus / chemical etc. This was how BSE started and then spread through improper processing of meat and bone meal.

As far as I’m aware the current case didn’t present with signs of BSE. She was either a sudden death or a casualty cull for another reason and routine brain stem testing identified BSE. It has happened before and will probably happen again.

 

[Gulli]

If post mortem testing can't tell the difference between ergot poisoning and bse then we're in a bit of strife i reckon