Keeping my calves as bull

[NorthumbrianFarmer]

Thinking of keeping my bull calves whole this year instead of castrating and taking them right through to fat. Is there much to consider when doing this? I’m going to have plenty barley this next year to feed them on and I know they need to be gone by 16 months old.

what’s the best way to make it the most efficient system as possible, should I just have them on ad lib barley soon as I can get on it? Also what age would the need pulled off from heifer calves without it being a problem? What else is there to consider?

 

[Northeastfarmer]

I’d run them seperate to the heifers if possible .

get them on adlib as soon as possible and keep them on it till you kill them

make sure your water troughs and gates are substantial cos they’ll wreck them

 

[Stewartry hill]

Don't go in bedside them when bedding up

 

[NorthumbrianFarmer]

I’d run them seperate to the heifers if possible .

get them on adlib as soon as possible and keep them on it till you kill them

make sure your water troughs and gates are substantial cos they’ll wreck them

Do they need much protein to grow a frame or does it not really matter for bulls?

 

[Northeastfarmer]

Do they need much protein to grow a frame or does it not really matter for bulls?

I would have them on a higher protein diet till spaning then onto a finishing ration

 

[Anymulewilldo]

On the cow till 5/6m, creep the last month on 18%, I don’t bother splitting heifers and bulls as I think it does the heifers good to have a push at that age. wean into bull proof pens and drop to 14% at 10 months. 12% will do the job after 13m. But if you feed them right you can start drawing them 12/13m anyway. Don’t bother about the 16m age thing. It’s rubbish, there’s plenty of bull firms out there who couldn’t care less about the age as long as the beef is right.

 

[NorthumbrianFarmer]

On the cow till 5/6m, creep the last month on 18%, I don’t bother splitting heifers and bulls as I think it does the heifers good to have a push at that age. wean into bull proof pens and drop to 14% at 10 months. 12% will do the job after 13m. But if you feed them right you can start drawing them 12/13m anyway. Don’t bother about the 16m age thing. It’s rubbish, there’s plenty of bull firms out there who couldn’t care less about the age as long as the beef is right.

Ah perfect thanks. What would you class as bull proof also would you say it’s more efficient and cost effective then rearing bullocks? Want to make sure I’m doing the right thing

 

[Werzle]

Thinking of keeping my bull calves whole this year instead of castrating and taking them right through to fat. Is there much to consider when doing this? I’m going to have plenty barley this next year to feed them on and I know they need to be gone by 16 months old.

what’s the best way to make it the most efficient system as possible, should I just have them on ad lib barley soon as I can get on it? Also what age would the need pulled off from heifer calves without it being a problem? What else is there to consider?

Split cows with hfr calves away from the cows with bull calves no later than 5mths old, wean at 10mths. Bull calves will have days when they just ride a hfr calf or cow to a standstill and drive you bonkers. When you wean then keep them well away from cows and hfrs as the distraction will cause them to stop eating and have days where they ride each other and then gorge on grub causing problems. When you transition from the growing/creep diet to the fattening adlib diet do it very slowly or you will have more problems. Do not let the adlib run out or they will bloat once you fill up the feeder .

 

[Timbo]

Do they need much protein to grow a frame or does it not really matter for bulls?

18% to begin with at creeping time and as they pass 400kg / 6-7 months ish, start dropping it down to around 13-14% as they get closer to being ready to go.

If you arent killing the best of them at 12-13 months you need to shape up.

 

[Timbo]

Split cows with hfr calves away from the cows with bull calves no later than 5mths old, wean at 10mths.

wtf, they ought to be weaned off the cow at 5 -6 months!!

 

[NorthumbrianFarmer]

18% to begin with at creeping time and as they pass 400kg / 6-7 months ish, start dropping it down to around 13-14% as they get closer to being ready to go.

If you arent killing the best of them at 12-13 months you need to shape up.

I presume it will be very easy for bulls to go over weight or do most places not really care currently?

 

[Werzle]

wtf, they ought to be weaned off the cow at 5 -6 months!!

If your weaning at a true 5-6 mths your might as well sell the cows . How you stopping the mastitis or dont they milk a spark?

 

[Anymulewilldo]

I presume it will be very easy for bulls to go over weight or do most places not really care currently?

Weight doesn’t matter. Once they come good and are over 12m get them away. We keep all our bull calves entire. Growth rates are grand, 13/14m lim x bulls £1400-1600+ this time.

 

[Anymulewilldo]

Ah perfect thanks. What would you class as bull proof also would you say it’s more efficient and cost effective then rearing bullocks? Want to make sure I’m doing the right thing

Concrete walls, strong gates, strong water troughs

 

[Anymulewilldo]

If your weaning at a true 5-6 mths your might as well sell the cows . How you stopping the mastitis or dont they milk a spark?

We calve (mainly) Feb-April. Wean mid/late October before it goes too wet. So that’s 8 month ish. I counted wrong before Then the cows can stay out longer (came in this afternoon) creep for the last month. Then in on ad-lib and as said above don’t let that trough empty

 

[Werzle]

We calve (mainly) Feb-April. Wean mid/late October before it goes too wet. So that’s 8 month ish. I counted wrong before Then the cows can stay out longer (came in this afternoon) creep for the last month. Then in on ad-lib and as said above don’t let that trough empty

Yeah we all got are different systems, cows and farms that might not work for others but work for us.

 

[Anymulewilldo]

Yeah we all got are different systems, cows and farms that might not work for others but work for us.

Exactly, we tried native bred cows a few years ago because we could keep them cheaper. Turned out all it did was shrink our calves and the feed savings didn’t make up the shortfall So I’ve started swapping back to 600-650kg conti x dairy cows which seem to work best for us here.

 

[NorthumbrianFarmer]

Exactly, we tried native bred cows a few years ago because we could keep them cheaper. Turned out all it did was shrink our calves and the feed savings didn’t make up the shortfall So I’ve started swapping back to 600-650kg conti x dairy cows which seem to work best for us here.

I’m currently trying to get more sim x diary heifers to make into cows. There currently as rare as hens teeth

 

[Werzle]

Exactly, we tried native bred cows a few years ago because we could keep them cheaper. Turned out all it did was shrink our calves and the feed savings didn’t make up the shortfall So I’ve started swapping back to 600-650kg conti x dairy cows which seem to work best for us here.

I started out with black hfds and now got bbx fri and lim x fri, my first creep feeders are in the scrap pile and i cant believe how small they are compared to my modern ones. Stock frame/size has grown over the years without really realising it. Im due to start calving from the 11th Jan , only way to keep the cows correct in bag and wean oct/nov is to calve early. Been down the route of keeping back hfrs for cows but usually only get problems , mostly too wild and /or not milky enough.

 

[Anymulewilldo]

I’m currently trying to get more sim x diary heifers to make into cows. There currently as rare as hens teeth

Grandad used to have all sim x dairy sucklers when I was a little kid. That was what he swapped for the natives. When I came to swap back, same problem as you! Decent cow making types are nigh on impossible to source!