Lamb ewes or gimmer lambs

[valtraman]

We put off our flock of sheep few years ago for various reasons one being they weren’t paying as they should. I wasn’t at the helm then and now looking back I can see where the faults were with too much feeding thrown at them from early pregnancy for one and basically bad management but not getting into all that on here. So we would annually buy few hundred mule and Texel ewe lambs run them on and sell almost the full year later as gimmers. Thought this was decent enough with no lambing and not such huge costs but u still get losses and getting the right stock to sell on at decent money is hard. Basically last year sold 300 to make £8500 before costs. What should I expect to make if lambed 300 ewes? I have any amount of ground to run them on so hope I could keep feed costs to a minimum. Weather dependable I know.hoping for some constructive ideas here and thoughts

 

[Al R]

When did you buy them and when were they sold? £8500 divided by 300 is £28/head? Tack taken off then whatever other costs like dosing/Bolus/heptavac/shearing/dipping etc is there any profit in that? At least by lambing them the costs are pretty much covered by the ewes When sold so only tack/added labour/vet/meds of the lambs is to come off their selling price?

 

[valtraman]

No do t think there is much profit if any in it. We buy August September sales and sell on again 12 month later basically so very long keep compared to lambing and get lambs away for better cash flow and surely bit of profit . Our main deal here is suckler Angus cows which contrarory to what others may think does make us decent money but place needs sheep as well .im still thinking of buying. Some ewe lambs to run on as gimmers and keep my replacements. All lambs out of ewes will be fattened hopefully off grass

 

[Al R]

If you have experience with stock like you do then it’s obviously easier.. i’d lamb them, wean at 10-12 weeks and sell the mothers, like a flying flock of draft ewes but their value is going up a lot more from them being experienced and proven breeders. Hopefully they will be an appreciating asset and not a depreciating asset and the lambs will give you a fair margin if they don’t have to cover the ewes feed/vet/meds for a further year.

 

[valtraman]

If you have experience with stock like you do then it’s obviously easier.. i’d lamb them, wean at 10-12 weeks and sell the mothers, like a flying flock of draft ewes but their value is going up a lot more from them being experienced and proven breeders. Hopefully they will be an appreciating asset and not a depreciating asset and the lambs will give you a fair margin if they don’t have to cover the ewes feed/vet/meds for a further year.

What happens the next year though? Stock all sold

 

[Al R]

What happens the next year though? Stock all sold

Buy again? Disease risk is a problem then though, depending on your financial situation you could retain the ewe lambs that are born on your farm while selling the males and the yearlings, or sell half? Obviously you need to buy a breed of ewe lamb that you can put to a maternal breed of ram to produce females. Like buying mules, put texel rams on and you’ve got texel x ewe lambs to keep back?

 

[valtraman]

Currently have 300 scotch mules that I would keep . Have 80 texels and 50 Cheviot mules that I will sell as gimmers and they would be replaced by ewe lambs probably go all scotch mules then pick my replacements and sell remainder as gimmers . Choice of tup would probably be a tex/beltex tup and just plan to fatten all lambs regardless of sex. I do actually have some blackie ewes that are producing scotch mule lambs fit replacements but will probably phase them out

 

[Al R]

It all depends on cash flow and if you can keep that many back that you’d forecast to sell? I retained 48% of ewe lambs born from a flying flock for the past 3 years, isn’t the easiest way of doing it financially compared to retaining 20% on the other flocks but filling land as quick as possible with home bred replacement’s so know exactly how they were produced is a big plus. Sourcing draft ewes only from 1 holding is a big positive to in terms of knowing what is coming in and not buying problems in from multiple marts (scab and foot problems)

 

[valtraman]

It all depends on cash flow and if you can keep that many back that you’d forecast to sell? I retained 48% of ewe lambs born from a flying flock for the past 3 years, isn’t the easiest way of doing it financially compared to retaining 20% on the other flocks but filling land as quick as possible with home bred replacement’s so know exactly how they were produced is a big plus. Sourcing draft ewes only from 1 holding is a big positive to in terms of knowing what is coming in and not buying problems in from multiple marts (scab and foot problems)

The batch of mules I’m planning on keeping were bought in big batches of 3 different places and have so far thrived and as good as bought over the years so that’s a good start.i know what u mean about keeping / breeding ure own stock we are that way with cattle and find nothing does as well as homebred stock.

 

[liammogs]

Tup the ewe lambs? Texel x ewe lambs tup with a beltex tup, sell the best with lambs at foot, wean lambs little early get a bit of nick back on ewes ready to sell on as yearling lambed ewes, your left then with the lambs sell as store or finish, lambs should be gone before you buy next batch in? Beltex lambs shouldn't pull the ewes down too much, easy to lamb and always looking good if you want to hit the couple trade

 

[farmerm]

No do t think there is much profit if any in it. We buy August September sales and sell on again 12 month later basically so very long keep compared to lambing and get lambs away for better cash flow and surely bit of profit . Our main deal here is suckler Angus cows which contrarory to what others may think does make us decent money but place needs sheep as well .im still thinking of buying. Some ewe lambs to run on as gimmers and keep my replacements. All lambs out of ewes will be fattened hopefully off grass

There is a very strong possibility that any sheep you buy this August will be making at least £30 a head less in a years time. I would say if you buy 100 sheep this autumn it is very much like taking £7,500 to the casino betting £4000 of it on black and then coming straight home. Much the same ratio of risk to reward but for far less effort

 

[valtraman]

Tup the ewe lambs? Texel x ewe lambs tup with a beltex tup, sell the best with lambs at foot, wean lambs little early get a bit of nick back on ewes ready to sell on as yearling lambed ewes, your left then with the lambs sell as store or finish, lambs should be gone before you buy next batch in? Beltex lambs shouldn't pull the ewes down too much, easy to lamb and always looking good if you want to hit the couple trade

Yeah that is a thought but would need to be super kind to the ewe lambs getting them in lamb and feeding afterwards. Trying to stay away from a high input of feed system . My experience in lambing Hoggs it can turn into a disaster quick but haven’t lambed to beltex so cant comment on them

 

[valtraman]

There is a very strong possibility that any sheep you buy this August will be making at least £30 a head less in a years time. I would say if you buy 100 sheep this autumn it is very much like taking £7,500 to the casino betting £4000 of it on black and then coming straight home. Much the same ratio of risk to reward but for far less effort

So I’m probably better keeping them lambing them and getting something out them that way

 

[liammogs]

Yeah that is a thought but would need to be super kind to the ewe lambs getting them in lamb and feeding afterwards. Trying to stay away from a high input of feed system . My experience in lambing Hoggs it can turn into a disaster quick but haven’t lambed to beltex so cant comment on them

Could even tease them, tup them for 3 weeks anything that doesn't hold sell dry next summer anything that holds sell as couples! Youll have 2 cash lumps not just the one turning them over twice a year not just the one lump come summer