Large scale fraud and criminality on Pembrokeshire mega-herd farm.

[Pistonbroke]

The case was on Wales Online last week. The judge didn't go too hard on them because he believed their claim that they were very busy and it was no more than administrative errors rather than financial gain. Said they'd been altering the freeze brands to match the tags. Not sure you can do that by accident . Quote was something like " You are excellent farmers but poor book keepers"

 

[puppet]

I am not clear if they are still farming as how can they still have a milk contract?
I hate all the gold plating of RT but this is why we have assurance schemes to try and weed out the cowboys. And exactly why the rules get tougher because every time a chancer finds a loophole it has to be closed.
Keeping reactors for 20years will also have embedded TB in the wildlife population as well as spreading it to other farms making eradication difficult.
One answer would be if nobody dealt with them. You have no guarantee on the status of the stock so why would anyone buy them

 

[d williams]

I am not clear if they are still farming as how can they still have a milk contract?
I hate all the gold plating of RT but this is why we have assurance schemes to try and weed out the cowboys. And exactly why the rules get tougher because every time a chancer finds a loophole it has to be closed.
Keeping reactors for 20years will also have embedded TB in the wildlife population as well as spreading it to other farms making eradication difficult.
One answer would be if nobody dealt with them. You have no guarantee on the status of the stock so why would anyone buy them

But it’s not the assurance scheme that’s picked up on it it’s the local authority

 

[Spudley]

They are still milking.

 

[puppet]

But it’s not the assurance scheme that’s picked up on it it’s the local authority

I was not clear how they picked up on the issues. Maybe there were some missing tags to alert them.
Compared to other inspections assurance is fairly light touch so what is the alternative. Annual inspections by Animal Health and Trading Standards?
I would find that much worse.

 

[som farmer]

Wow.

They got a very nice judge didn't they, if I did a stunt like that in little old lawless NZ I'd be subject to a higher fine as an employee than they got as owner operators of a fairly substantial operation. And "owner-operators" they sound to be. f**k btb

Dairy workers here could get smacked with up to that quoted £24k, for letting effluent get "close" to a waterway, let alone managers or owners.

Do they like to make light of fraud over there, if so it seems like a reasonable risk ?

if you are very senior business people, or top bankers, you pretty well get away with anything, their underlings get fined.
one law for the very rich business people, and another for the rest.

 

[d williams]

I was not clear how they picked up on the issues. Maybe there were some missing tags to alert them.
Compared to other inspections assurance is fairly light touch so what is the alternative. Annual inspections by Animal Health and Trading Standards?
I would find that much worse.

What do you mean by much worse ??
They can only inspect to the rules and conditions that are set why would inspectors from another agency do their jobs any differently??

 

[som farmer]

What do you mean by much worse ??
They can only inspect to the rules and conditions that are set why would inspectors from another agency do their jobs any differently??

eartag inspection, NVZ inspection, even a cross compliance one, all preferable to RT.

EA one though, def worse.

 

[d williams]

eartag inspection, NVZ inspection, even a cross compliance one, all preferable to RT.

EA one though, def worse.

Don’t enter red tractor scheme then if your not rewarded for the input they expect

 

[som farmer]

Don’t enter red tractor scheme then if your not rewarded for the input they expect

dairy, no choice, won't pick the milk up without it.

 

[SilliamWhale]

I am not clear if they are still farming as how can they still have a milk contract?
I hate all the gold plating of RT but this is why we have assurance schemes to try and weed out the cowboys. And exactly why the rules get tougher because every time a chancer finds a loophole it has to be closed.
Keeping reactors for 20years will also have embedded TB in the wildlife population as well as spreading it to other farms making eradication difficult.
One answer would be if nobody dealt with them. You have no guarantee on the status of the stock so why would anyone buy them

It is a regulatory issue not a RT issue. Its easy to fool the RT people and they also have no legal teeth.

Our regulators are supported to do the job on behalf of everyone

 

[Ffermer Bach]

if you are very senior business people, or top bankers, you pretty well get away with anything, their underlings get fined.
one law for the very rich business people, and another for the rest.

I think Fred the shred should have ended up after being banged up, in a housing association house.

 

[Whitey !]

My understanding is that when a reactor is tagged with the DEFRA tissue /DNA tag that’s also to prevent fraud SO obviously NOT being checked
you have to wonder if there hasn’t been some back handed deals 🫣

more ammunition for the Welsh government to do feck all about TB

 

[glasshouse]

My understanding is that when a reactor is tagged with the DEFRA tissue /DNA tag that’s also to prevent fraud SO obviously NOT being checked
you have to wonder if there hasn’t been some back handed deals 🫣

more ammunition for the Welsh government to do feck all about TB

At the end of the day its govt causing the problem.
Shoot thr badgers and save millions

 

[Henarar]

At the end of the day its govt causing the problem.
Shoot thr badgers and save millions

can't argue with that

 

[Ffermer Bach]

At the end of the day its govt causing the problem.
Shoot thr badgers and save millions

Just put them on the general licence, and to make sure Wales are different, they have added the requirement to read the general licence here, not sure if they want me to read it to a crow as a miranda right!

 

[Johnnyboxer]

So it's the Badgers fault and not these particular farmers, then
Astounding.............

 

[JP1]

So it's the Badgers fault and not these particular farmers, then
Astounding.............

Every NGO will make sure it's never seen as the badger's fault but it is every farmer's

That's the big issue from where I can see

 

[Henarar]

So it's the Badgers fault and not these particular farmers, then
Astounding.............

No both

 

[suffolksmallholder]

If they retain or regain Farm Assurance status after this, the Farm Assurance is an even bigger farce than I already believe it to be [for different reasons]. No milk company will surely take their milk after this, particularly because they specifically sold milk from known TB infected cattle, undermining the reputation for quality of the milk processor customer.
In truth I am both amazed and appalled at the criminality , and the scale and audacity of it, over decades, involved in this case. I feel very strongly about this as one of the vast majority of farmers that dot the ‘I’ and cross the ’T’ of some quite absurd gold plated ridiculous demands made upon us, only to find this case which really upsets me .

One has to think of the timescale. That’s the really scary part. It’s not like this was a decision made last week or even last year.

SS