Lib Dem’s commercial landowners tax. How would that work for farmers then

[curlietailz]

It says ““By only taxing land and not the productive capital above it, this reform would remove a major disincentive to investment, boosting productivity and contributing to a necessary revival in UK industry.”

further in the blurb it says “
The Commercial Landowner Levy tax rate would be 59p per £1 of land rental value in England and a 67.5p rate if introduced in Wales
• Alternatively, a tax on capital values would need to be around 3% per year in England and around 3.4% in Wales
• These figures would represent a tax cut initially, as part of a detailed package of policies, but are likely to be at least revenue-neutral in the long-term
”
I’m hoping there’s an Agriculture Rebate but I can’t find it in the blurb
If tax is 59p per £1 of rental value ..... rental value will increase by 59p

 

[Swarfmonkey]

What it is, is daylight robbery.

The Commercial Landowner Levy tax rate would be 59p per £1 of land rental value in England and a 67.5p rate if introduced in Wales

Say you rented land out for £200 per acre, the state would send you a tax bill of £118 per acre in England and £135 in Wales. Ouch.

Alternatively, a tax on capital values would need to be around 3% per year in England and around 3.4% in Wales

That's even worse. If you had land worth, say £8k per acre, you'd see a yearly tax bill of £240 per acre on it in England and £272 in Wales. Double ouch.

 

[Yale]

There would be a peasants revolt.....because the peasants can‘t afford to pay it.

I certainly wouldn‘t be cutting any roadside hedges or favours unblocking roads in the winter.

I would be expecting every penny back in better services and more.

 

[Farmer_Joe]

i read that document too,

as its to replace business rates which farmers dont pay anyway i was not sure if it was applicable to farmers?

would a killer if it is as above! well realistically i could not afford to pay it?

 

[Swarfmonkey]

Limp Dems have been on about LVT and other land taxes for donkey's years. There was some merit in the idea of LVT back when the likes of Henry George were dreaming it up 150 odd years ago, but these days there are so many distortions to it that it would be political suicide to try and impose it.

Wee Nickie Sturgeon and The Shortbread Senate north of the border has been looking at LVT for a fair while now, but the report they commissioned on it has been quietly shelved for a number of reasons. The first being that it would massively change the balance of property/land taxation, with those in residential property picking up 80% of the total bill, compared to the 50% they currently pay under the present system. The second being that owner occupiers won't vote for a party that supports a tax where they'd get hammered and those in social housing wouldn't pay a penny (LVT is paid by the owner, not the tenant).

And here endeth the rant about LVT.

 

[Yale]

Suppose there’s a cat in hells chance of the Lib Dem’s getting anywhere with the election so they can promise all they like......a bit like Jeremy.

 

[Bill the Bass]

Suppose there’s a cat in hells chance of the Lib Dem’s getting anywhere with the election so they can promise all they like......a bit like Jeremy.

That’s true, but I think all the major parties apart from the Tories are now talking about a land tax of some form in their manifestoes. It is only a matter of time before there is either a land tax on farm land like business rates, or a land value tax or wealth tax is lumbered on us.

If you really want a laugh have a look at the green parties manifesto, launched today, it really is laugh outloud funny.

 

[teslacoils]

Tax on capital double the return on capital? Excellent idea.

None of these promises will become law.

 

[SilliamWhale]

What it is, is daylight robbery.



Say you rented land out for £200 per acre, the state would send you a tax bill of £118 per acre in England and £135 in Wales. Ouch.



That's even worse. If you had land worth, say £8k per acre, you'd see a yearly tax bill of £240 per acre on it in England and £272 in Wales. Double ouch.

f**king hell. That's £87k in tax a year for me for the pleasure of growing crops at the cost of production!

 

[Swarfmonkey]

Welcome to the bat$hit crazy world of the Limp Dems. I read their 52 page document on land tax - "Taxing Land, Not Investment". Not once does it mention anything about exempting farmland.

 

[teslacoils]

fudgeing hell. That's £87k in tax a year for me for the pleasure of growing crops at the cost of production!

Aye, versus the attractive alternative of £15 an hour for a 32 hour, four day week. And nap breaks.

 

[spin cycle]

Welcome to the bat$hit crazy world of the Limp Dems. I read their 52 page document on land tax - "Taxing Land, Not Investment". Not once does it mention anything about exempting farmland.

i've just read a report by the chartered institute of taxation that says farmland would be exempt.......but the scary bit is replacing iht with a recipient allowance of £250k...then tax the rest at income tax rates ....eye wateringly scary

 

[yellow belly]

values will drop to a level that the tax can be paid
or there will be the abandonment of 20 million acres and the port infrastructure up grade to import 20 million tonnes of food

rural small businesses get rate reductions now farm land is also exempt now
any increase will come out of the rent or farmers will just walk off their farms and farm over seas of find another job

 

[Swarfmonkey]

values will drop to a level that the tax can be paid

The lower the value, the lower the tax receipts. That presents quite a problem for those promising huge amounts of tax would be generated by land tax for the state to spend waste.

 

[roscoe erf]

Well that’s me f**ked then

 

[Bald Rick]

What it is, is daylight robbery.



Say you rented land out for £200 per acre, the state would send you a tax bill of £118 per acre in England and £135 in Wales. Ouch.



That's even worse. If you had land worth, say £8k per acre, you'd see a yearly tax bill of £240 per acre on it in England and £272 in Wales. Double ouch.

Have to get our English paymaster to bail us out.

WTF why are they picking on Wales? Don’t they know we are a disadvantaged nation under EU determination?

 

[Yale]

I’d rather vote for Jeremy,at least if he nationalises my farm he can pay me a managers wage.

£70k and a BMW,that’ll do nicely.

 

[Goweresque]

Aye, versus the attractive alternative of £15 an hour for a 32 hour, four day week. And nap breaks.

Forget 32 hours work. All you need is 16 hours work at minimum wage in order to qualify for Tax Credits. It actually makes no sense to work a full week on MW if you have any kids, you might as well do 2 days a week and make the same money as someone who works a full week. Its utter madness.

 

[Farmer_Joe]

i've just read a report by the chartered institute of taxation that says farmland would be exempt.......but the scary bit is replacing iht with a recipient allowance of £250k...then tax the rest at income tax rates ....eye wateringly scary

ha ha you could just share the wealth if you had hundreds of recipients in you will surely there would be no tax!

to be fair farm land needs to drop to its profitable value but how to achieve that is not really tax, prob best off been much stricter on who claims sub and actally have to be a real farmer to claim apr

 

[Goweresque]

values will drop to a level that the tax can be paid
or there will be the abandonment of 20 million acres and the port infrastructure up grade to import 20 million tonnes of food

rural small businesses get rate reductions now farm land is also exempt now
any increase will come out of the rent or farmers will just walk off their farms and farm over seas of find another job

It occurs to the cynic in me that if one were of the persuasion that was against the private ownership of land, you could levy an annual tax that was many times its productive capacity, thus driving the value to zero and the owners into bankruptcy, and the State could then take over the land FoC.