New commercial building Spec

[Doing it for the kids]

ive had a number of quotes for a Commercial building, they will no doubt be reading this though so I will keep things generic

There are two distinct price brackets which must mean something fundamental is different between the groups of quotes.

BS 5502 vs BS 5950 stands out mostly. The building is for a commercial use and will need to be building reg compliant.

Also, what % cost of the building is the steel, fluctuations for main stanchions from 406x165x40 to 254 x 146x146x37. Ditto with Rafters, 305x165x40 to 254x145x31. I imagine there is a reasonable cost saving to be had here but how much - 30 to 40%?

thought I would check in here before I ring them all up and probe!

TYIA

 

[designanddetail]

The steelwork is usually the cheapest part of a commercial building.

The difference between the columns you listed is 3kg per m. so if its 6m tall, you are probably saving in the region of £25 per column.

BS5502 is agri spec.
BS5950 is industrial spec. If you are doing full building regs for a commercial unit you need BS5950.

 

[Forever Fendt]

£3-4 per meter average on the sections that's all so as said not a lot in the scheme of things by the way there is no 406x165x40 its 305 so not that much difference in physical size

 

[Lincsman]

Why is there a difference, they both have to stand the same weather?

 

[Doing it for the kids]

Why is there a difference, they both have to stand the same weather?

Good point. Im guessing its to do with Building Regs, U values etc?

@RWG Contracts

 

[Steevo]

Agricultural buildings aren’t designed to have people in them for long periods so can be made lower spec I think is the logic.

 

[Forever Fendt]

Agricultural buildings aren’t designed to have people in them for long periods so can be made lower spec I think is the logic.

you are correct in what you say with minimum and infrequent occupancy the design loadings for farm buildings can be greatly reduced so allowing smaller steel sizes

 

[Lincsman]

you are correct in what you say with minimum and infrequent occupancy the design loadings for farm buildings can be greatly reduced so allowing smaller steel sizes

Not sure I like the idea a farmer or farm worker is worth less so falling down isnt an issue, occupancy at the time? how does the shed know its ok to fall down now?

 

[Steevo]

Not sure I like the idea a farmer or farm worker is worth less so falling down isnt an issue, occupancy at the time? how does the shed know its ok to fall down now?

It's not that they are worth less. It's a risk based calculation......the likelihood of someone being injured is that much lower.

 

[Doing it for the kids]

The steelwork is usually the cheapest part of a commercial building.

The difference between the columns you listed is 3kg per m. so if its 6m tall, you are probably saving in the region of £25 per column.

BS5502 is agri spec.
BS5950 is industrial spec. If you are doing full building regs for a commercial unit you need BS5950.

you are correct in what you say with minimum and infrequent occupancy the design loadings for farm buildings can be greatly reduced so allowing smaller steel sizes

Not sure I like the idea a farmer or farm worker is worth less so falling down isnt an issue, occupancy at the time? how does the shed know its ok to fall down now?

It's not that they are worth less. It's a risk based calculation......the likelihood of someone being injured is that much lower.

so if the steel costs don’t make much difference, How can such large costs be saved? Roof and wall cladding all same spec, doors will have some fluctuation, 100mm concrete panel is much The same to?

 

[KennyO]

Agricultural buildings aren’t designed to have people in them for long periods so can be made lower spec I think is the logic.

I seem to recall being told that it is actually to do with fire. Industrail building need to withstand fire longer to allow evacuation. Bigger steel takes longer to twist and collapse.

Agri building have less (or no) people in them and are often not enclosed. So can be evacuated quickly.

 

[Steevo]

I seem to recall being told that it is actually to do with fire. Industrail building need to withstand fire longer to allow evacuation. Bigger steel takes longer to twist and collapse.

Agri building have less (or no) people in them and are often not enclosed. So can be evacuated quickly.

There would be logic in that!

 

[br jones]

It will be something to do with fire regs ,done alot of fireboarding steels

 

[Steevo]

@George from SJM Planning will know I'm sure.

 

[Forever Fendt]

It will be something to do with fire regs ,done alot of fireboarding steels

Depending on height to eaves all steels on a boundary condition have to be fire protected and not the rest of the frame the holding down bolts and base plates are bigger the idea being the rest of the frame becomes plastic first and effectively collapses inwards and it works . We replaced the steelwork at JCB factory after they had the big fire nearly 20 years ago quite something to see 914mm columns 15meters tall still on the base plate and the top on the floor like a giant horse shoe

 

[Steevo]

Depending on height to eaves all steels on a boundary condition have to be fire protected and not the rest of the frame the holding down bolts and base plates are bigger the idea being the rest of the frame becomes plastic first and effectively collapses inwards and it works . We replaced the steelwork at JCB factory after they had the big fire nearly 20 years ago quite something to see 914mm columns 15meters tall still on the base plate and the top on the floor like a giant horse shoe

Just imaging the size of the horse reminded me of the old "Would you rather....?" question:


Would You Rather Fight a Horse-Sized Duck or a Hundred Duck-Sized Horses?


Maybe this would be a blue whale sized horse......!



Anyway, as you were......

 

[The Arable Farmer]

Could you put it up as Ag then do change of use after a couple of years? Think how many Ag sheds are now industrial!

 

[Doing it for the kids]

converted quite a few to industrial in last few years ?

This is for a new industrial building, hence my confusion.

massive difference in price, still dont get why given a 95mm Pannel surely can’t fluctuate that much in cost etc

 

[Pistonbroke]

Are wooden purlins ok for industrial spec? There's a shed been built in town destined to be a builder's merchant and it just looks like a farm shed to me

 

[designanddetail]

converted quite a few to industrial in last few years ?

This is for a new industrial building, hence my confusion.

massive difference in price, still dont get why given a 95mm Pannel surely can’t fluctuate that much in cost etc

Ask the cheaper company to quote Industrial spec?

Cant say I have ever seen an industrial building built with concrete panels, but no, the spec or price of them will not change.

Cladding is the same, if you have the same spec for both buildings then there is no difference in the cost. it would be odd thought, to have an agri sec building clad with industrial spec composite cladding.