New venture.. Cattle or Sheep

[glensman]

am i right in saying rotational grazing depletes the soil quicker?

no

 

[Bossfarmer]

are you s

no

are you sure? its growing a lot more grass so ud think it would?

 

[Ysgythan]

are you s

are you sure? its growing a lot more grass so ud think it would?

The theory is that as a grass plant grows it’s roots go deeper and shrink back if it’s grazed or cut so a short sharp graze followed by a decent rest period aids the mechanical process of improving the soil structure by the roots.

 

[neilo]

are you s

are you sure? its growing a lot more grass so ud think it would?

And a higher stocking rate means more muck dropped back on too, it's not all carried off in weight gain.

 

[Ysgythan]

And a higher stocking rate means more muck dropped back on too, it's not all carried off in weight gain.

Weight gain per animal is poorer. It’s the extra stocking rate which gives more kg to the ha.

 

[Kiwi Pete]

am i right in saying rotational grazing depletes the soil quicker?

No it builds topsoil faster, usually, if overstocked or poorly managed then it can wreck things.
Set stocking just limits pasture and stock performance (again usually) because it isn't as variable unless you're constantly changing the stocking pressure to suit the growth rate. And weeds require more effort to control because the animals select what they want to eat (graze around the weeds)

 

[Gwyn]

Lets be realistic, that 20k would be better invested outside of livestock farming. The returns are non existent

 

[Weasel]

Reading some more of your posts below you don't have too much capital to play with. Two possible routes:-

1. Buy a few head of really good stock and AI them to a good bull. Unless you have existing facilities you are going to be a bit limited.

2. Go to the opposite extreme. Have a look on the web and go and buy experienced Dexter cows preferably free of the bull. You can pick them up for nowt. Get a good maternal bull of a breed you like, young and not too heavy is good. Cross him to the dexters, sell the steers store, keep the heifers. Once he is looking at his own daughters swap the bull. Keep buying good bulls and cash the cows in as numbers build.

Cheers
Mac

Why dexters

 

[unlacedgecko]

No it builds topsoil faster, usually, if overstocked or poorly managed then it can wreck things.
Set stocking just limits pasture and stock performance (again usually) because it isn't as variable unless you're constantly changing the stocking pressure to suit the growth rate. And weeds require more effort to control because the animals select what they want to eat (graze around the weeds)

I've just taken on some HLD land that was set stocked with sheep all winter. The animals were fed supplementary turnips as well. They've scoured the pasture and eaten out anything palatable. I've a grand crop of thistles and weeds though!

 

[unlacedgecko]

Why dexters

High beef price has pushed up cow price, resulting in high herd establishment costs.

Starting with dexters and grading up is the same principle as getting into sheep by buying draft hill ewes and grading up.

A Dexter cross should also help keep the mature cow weight down, meaning a more efficient animal.

 

[neilo]

High beef price has pushed up cow price, resulting in high herd establishment costs.

Starting with dexters and grading up is the same principle as getting into sheep by buying draft hill ewes and grading up.

A Dexter cross should also help keep the mature cow weight down, meaning a more efficient animal.

And what value those Dexter cross steers in the store ring? I'm assuming they'd be sold disclosing their breeding, rather than trying to pull a fast one.

I'd rather start with an Angus X dairy heifer if I was looking to go down that route. At least you'd have something saleable to sell.

 

[ploughman1963]

(Sheep only) Farm near us does rotational grazing. It works well in summer but they turn five acres into mud every day in a wet Autumn and winter. I think they'd be better off doing set stocking over winter but I'm no expert obviously.

We see this with dairy cows but it always looks far worse than it is - always seems to recover by next grazing round

 

[unlacedgecko]

And what value those Dexter cross steers in the store ring? I'm assuming they'd be sold disclosing their breeding, rather than trying to pull a fast one.

I'd rather start with an Angus X dairy heifer if I was looking to go down that route. At least you'd have something saleable to sell.

I'd think Dexter x stores would be worth very little. I was more explaining the rational than suggesting it!

Depends on cash availability, time and land.

I'm hoping to get some cattle come the spring. The local TB situation means breeding or trading live is a no go. My limited budget means that I can't buy anything too expensive either. So dairy x native (not Dexter!) bucket calves and taking them to slaughter is the way I'll try this year.

 

[ploughman1963]

We see this with dairy cows but it always looks far worse than it is - always seems to recover by next grazing round

A quick add - I am conscious that compaction can /will be an issue with grazing in less than ideal conditions and that aeration with something like an Aerworx is needed to alleviate it

 

[Kiwi Pete]

Main thing on small-scale ventures is to NOT DO WHAT EVERYONE ELSE is doing as I'm sure the OP will realise...

You have to dare to be different, especially with livestock, or you will be playing against the big farms at their own game.
A game that barely works for some
Rare breeds, out of season lambs, that sort of thing. IMO of course..
Back to that SWOT analysis again, if your strength is available time/labour - then do something folks don't have the time/labour for!
I actually agree with the Dexter or Galloway idea, good principle, that's assuming that the OP's venture is purely for the money aspect?

 

[Kiwi Pete]

something like an Aerworx is needed to alleviate it

Some C4?

 

[ploughman1963]

Some C4?

Ive got an earth panbuster that would sort that out , I'll bring it with me next time

 

[Hsals]

I did think about Dexters, seen adverts raving about the beef.Are they worth anything in the real world?

 

[hendrebc]

Mate of mine wanted cattle to help stop jis farm getting sheep sick when he was starting out and bought a few dexters because they were cheap and ran them with a hereford bull. They really improved his farm but he didnt keep them very long i think the calves were a bit on the small side. Small cattle dont eat much though and can be left out longer in winter as they are lighter and dont poach as much as heavier cattle they have both those things going in their favour as well as being cheap of course.

 

[hendrebc]

Dexters would be great as boxed beef instead of doing lamb if everyone is.doing lamb