Red T

[PhilSL]

A friend of mine is a chemist and he definitely classes it as hazardous waste.

Here is an article which you and your friend, may like to read. I'm sure if the author of the article, Dr. James Conca, who is an expert on energy, nuclear and dirty bombs, a planetary geologist, and a professional speaker, had any reservations, whatsoever, about the vanadium in flow technology, he would have highlighted in his article.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/jamesc...torage-breakthrough-weve-needed/#184d89075bde

 

[akaPABLO01]

Hello, akaPablo01 (sorry, I don't know your name), I have sent the information to the project director at RedT, whose client this is, and he will advise accordingly as there are variables on each project to be considered.
I will say that not every project is suitable for a RedT unit, it's all dependant on the project. This is the reason RedT offers a free project feasibility study.

It’s ok @PhilSL RedT business development are visiting me today to sign contracts. Cheers.

 

[PhilSL]

It’s ok @PhilSL RedT business development are visiting me today to sign contracts. Cheers.

I'm glad to hear this. I trust the service provided by RedT will meet your requirements.

 

[akaPABLO01]

I'm glad to hear this. I trust the service provided by RedT will meet your requirements.

I’ve got my first site data for them which should sail through. Just need to dot the i’s and cross the t’s.

From my research and data I’ve crunched flow systems are the real thing. Process and storage of renewables on this scale is exactly what I’ve been patiently waiting for. The age of storage is now here. I’m buzzing with excitement at the potential these systems can deliver. Chemical chemistry is the answer, with the funding it makes this a no brainier, so far.

 

[Doing it for the kids]

I’ve got my first site data for them which should sail through. Just need to dot the i’s and cross the t’s.

From my research and data I’ve crunched flow systems are the real thing. Process and storage of renewables on this scale is exactly what I’ve been patiently waiting for. The age of storage is now here. I’m buzzing with excitement at the potential these systems can deliver. Chemical chemistry is the answer, with the funding it makes this a no brainier, so far.

@akaPABLO01 it looks like this product is a bit of game changer - from your previous posts you always seem to be cautious and do masses of due diligence so its surprising to hear you are buzzing!

do you think this has any legs on larger systems - talking 10 - 20 MW linked up to a PV system. I don't know enough about this but looking in to it.

 

[PhilSL]

@akaPABLO01 it looks like this product is a bit of game changer - from your previous posts you always seem to be cautious and do masses of due diligence so its surprising to hear you are buzzing!

do you think this has any legs on larger systems - talking 10 - 20 MW linked up to a PV system. I don't know enough about this but looking in to it.

If you have the data, please feel free to send it to me and we can run a feasibility study and crunch some numbers for you. [email protected]

 

[akaPABLO01]

@akaPABLO01 it looks like this product is a bit of game changer - from your previous posts you always seem to be cautious and do masses of due diligence so its surprising to hear you are buzzing!

do you think this has any legs on larger systems - talking 10 - 20 MW linked up to a PV system. I don't know enough about this but looking in to it.

I’ve just obtained the last bit of data to complete the analysis and if this doesn’t fit the model then the only reason would be the array size.

This model is 150kW solar
70,000 export
Split tariff
45/225 storage
Annual site usage with solar 190,000kWh
The storage 1 cycle every 24hrs 82,000kWh

From what I understand for this to be cost effective you need to “time shift” power. The money is in using the export and tariff 2. If it is grid connection only I reckon years for payback would be in the teens even 20’s.

The model work on arrays this size and probably up to 250kW. Export is the key.

The 40% makes this attractive but I’ve not received actual costings yet! Does the 40% drive up the sale cost? I’ve done hours of research if not days. From presentations I’ve looked at this 45/225 model should retail at about 160,000 plus the government discount. As stated on here the cost is £180,600. Is there a 20k uplift due to grant??!

As soon as I send this email (just back from site) and the figures are crunched it’s time to get into the meat and potatoes of cost.

After all this work there’s still the process of “selection” for the grant. No one is assured, if it helps productivity increase and costs decrease with time shifting power from renewables it should sail through. If this doesn’t then I’m not rolling it out across my farms. This is the tester. The product is right, it’s just the cost versus savings not to mention the loss of export revenue.

 

[PhilSL]

UPDATE:

After some feedback, please note the unit costs contained in the Energy storage project example: poultry farm, as quoted in my initial post are specific to the said example, and should NOT be read as actual costs. Each project will vary, and additional costs may be incurred, for ancillary equipment, grid connections etc.

To obtain actual RedT unit and project costs, please contact us; [email protected]

Thanks.

We have an Energy Partnership Agreement with RedT, it took us a few months to negotiate though, but the terms and processes suit all parties, including clients.

From a commercial standpoint, we are the initial point of contact for our existing and potential clients, re the RedT Energy Storage Units. We collate all the required data on any proposed site/project, submit it to RedT and liaise thereafter with the client. Invariably though, after the initial data is submitted to RedT, their technical team take over, and they are in direct contact with the potential client(s). As we generate our revenue directly from RedT via the sales of the Energy Storage Units, (all payments for the Energy Storage Units are paid directly to RedT, and not third parties), there are no costs to our clients, and/or potential clients, for our services.

At present, we are collectively, refining the details of the RDPE Countryside Productivity Scheme Grant marketing material.

Here's an overview:

The Grant
For farmers: livestock, dairy, arable and horticulture
To improve farm productivity through:
• Increasing the use of farm produced renewable energy by improving
energy storage and distribution
• Using robotic equipment and systems to aid crop and livestock
production
• Using LED wavelength controlled lighting to aid crop production
• More efficiently using of livestock slurries, manures and digestate

Amount available: 40% of project
Minimum grant: £35,000
Maximum grant: £1,000,000

Energy storage project example: poultry farm
Onsite data:
• Annual usage 600,000kWh
• 30kWp solar array
Current energy costs per year: £70,800 at 11.8p/kWh
Cost and payback of adding energy storage:
• Storage added: 45kW-225kWh redT storage machine
• System and installation: £180,600
• Grant amount: £72,240
• Cost after grant: £108,360
• IRR after grant: 19.8%
• Simple payback: 7.2 years
NEW energy cost per year: £59,410 at 9.9p/kWh SAVINGS

Benefits of adding storage to your site:
• Utilise surplus renewable energy generation
• Decrease energy prices
• De-risk future increases in energy prices
• Secure energy supply
• Cash returns
• Sustainable energy

redT energy provides full support to prepare and
submit the grant application. Including:
• Creating financial model and project feasibility study using
redT’s unique economic model
• Demonstrating the returns the project
• Getting quotes for alternative storage solutions
• Drafting the RDPE Grant documentation for you to complete
and submit

Requirements:
For the best return, your farm needs to have:
• Over 100,000kWh of annual electricity usage
• An overall energy cost of over 10.5p/kWh
• Renewable generation, or plans for renewable generation, on site

What redT energy needs to complete grant application:
• Half hourly energy consumption data
• Half hourly energy generation data
• 12 months of electricity bills
1. Documentation
• Generation data
• Consumption data
• 12 months of energy bills
2. Project exclusivity agreement (6 months)
redT energy requires exclusivity in recognition that we will incur costs from:
• supporting your submission for the grant
• carrying out analysis of the site energy flows
• modelling the revenue that can be generated by applying storage to your site
3. Complete and submit RDPE grant form
• redT’s data gathering form

There are essentially four steps in the process;
Step 1.
We work with you to assess your needs and recommend a solution which works best for you.This includes:
Data Gathering
Financial Modelling
Solution Specification
Site Survey
Proposal and Contract.

Step 2.
We design the solution to your specifications and advise you on steps you need to take prior to delivery. This includes;
Sire Survey
Design Proposal
Site Preparation
Equipment Manufacture
Delivery Schedule

Step 3.
The team of highly experienced installation engineers will site, commission and test the system. This includes;
Safety Inspection
Grid Standards (G100)
Acceptance Testing
Commissioning Sign Off
Handover to Customer

Step 4.
RedT work with you to create maximum value from the energy storage system and remain on hand to provide tech support. This includes;
Remote Monitoring
Scheduled Maintenance
Revenue Stream Optimisation
On-going Customer Support
Aggregation and Energy Trading

The RedT Energy Storage System:
Durable liquid energy storage machines for Commercial and Industrial applications
• Use continually with no performance loss: charging and
discharging for the 25-year lifespan of renewable assets
• Sustainable and safe, non-toxic chemistry with no risk of
thermal runaway
• Lowest cost vanadium redox flow energy storage machines
commercially available worldwide
• 7.5 years equivalent operating machines
• Proven technology, 17 years of development
• Customers across UK, EU, Australia and Africa
• UK-based company (plc AIM:RED),
offices in UK, USA and Africa

You may have seen this video...or not!

I trust this information has helped, and if you are interested in Energy Storage Units and would like more info, please don't hesitate to contact me, either via the forum or email [email protected]

 

[akaPABLO01]

UPDATE:

After some feedback, please note the unit costs contained in the Energy storage project example: poultry farm, as quoted in my initial post are specific to the said example, and should NOT be read as actual costs. Each project will vary, and additional costs may be incurred, for ancillary equipment, grid connections etc.

To obtain actual RedT unit and project costs, please contact us; [email protected]

Thanks.

@PhilSL
Fella you’ve put me in a very sticky situation.

For £180,600 you only get the shipping container filled with electrolyte and commissioned. Not installed.

Additional costs are added on. I’m still not clear but am submitting the DNO on Monday. I need to discover witness test costs if any to glean a clearer picture!

 

[PhilSL]

@PhilSL
Fella you’ve put me in a very sticky situation.

For £180,600 you only get the shipping container filled with electrolyte and commissioned. Not installed.

Additional costs are added on. I’m still not clear but am submitting the DNO on Monday. I need to discover witness test costs if any to glean a clearer picture!

I can't quite see how I have put you in a sticky situation?

The 'example' originally quoted, was just that....an example. In the absence of all data related to a project, a project design brief, and all other pertinent information, all renewable technologies we have installed, have always been, and always be, quoted ex-installation costs, and any ancillaries, until such time as all the aforementioned have been received.

The only way to provide accurate figures for tech supply and installation is for potential project owners to contact us, or RedT direct, and begin the process, also outlined in the original post.

I know the team at RedT will ensure all the figures you require re your project, will be provided as every energy storage project is unique.

 

[akaPABLO01]

I can't quite see how I have put you in a sticky situation?

The 'example' originally quoted, was just that....an example. In the absence of all data related to a project, a project design brief, and all other pertinent information, all renewable technologies we have installed, have always been, and always be, quoted ex-installation costs, and any ancillaries, until such time as all the aforementioned have been received.

The only way to provide accurate figures for tech supply and installation is for potential project owners to contact us, or RedT direct, and begin the process, also outlined in the original post.

I know the team at RedT will ensure all the figures you require re your project, will be provided as every energy storage project is unique.

Well, the example you’ve used cannot be an accurate cost of supply and install for the 45/225 until, literally.

In my exploration of this product I have come across many hidden costs not listed. For example, data collection is the second stage. You need 3 pieces of information to process, import, export, generation. All 3 of these need to be presented in a hh spreadsheet fashion.
Who pays for this organisation and collection?
The most difficult of these is the generation hh data. RedT assume all generation meters are hh monitored and suggest they are. My experience in commercial installations is that I’ve never installed anything that measures hh data on the generation meter, jobs I’ve repaired have never had this which I haven’t installed, in fact talking to other commercial installers neither have they. I’m not talking about portal monitoring which I do usually install as this does not give access to hh excel spreadsheet data but does monitor hh data. This the brings in a 3rd party company that charge to extract hh data from the generation meter, who pays for that? All this data gives a more accurate simulation.
Next is DNO application of ESS, who pays for that?
Thirdly, investigating the position of the unit for weight. 20 ton on a pad, this needs building and inspection if there isn’t a suitable existing site. The existing still needs testing for weight load. Who covers this cost?
You may get the unit cheaper then me but I’m charged £180,600 just for supply and electrolytes with commission. This does not include all ac connection, who pays for this?
Then there is a council planning query application, you need to enquire at least, this may come with a cost due to the materials held within.
Following this the dno may ask for a witness test on connection, something I’m looking into, again who pays this?

If this poultry farmer had this system supplied and installed for £180,600 then either you sleeping with the director at RedT and getting a good price or I’m getting charged over the odds, or rather my farmers are.

Then there’s the servicing charges which are up to £1,800 / year

£180,600
How much Vanadium is contained within the electrolyte? It’s cost is $35/kg
Cost of a shipping container £2,000
Ion cell?
A few containers and pumps?
OS?

Then I guess £160,000 for the boys at the top /unit probably comes under RD

This unit is very expensive. And your example does not reflect an accurate cost installed and signed off.


And lastly, yes John from RedT this is ME. So when I’ve crunched the final costing I expect you to sharpen your pencil.

Regards

Paul!

 

[Ukjay]

Hi

Rather than start a new thread, I was just wondering if anyone has had any dealings with Redflow Energy Storage Technology, especially in relation to their 10kWh ZBM2 zinc bromide flow battery installations in the UK?

Reason for my question, is because I am trying to find out if anyone has had one installed in the UK for lower use smaller scale domestic / commercial property, so that I can try and get some useful real life experiences with the kit vs other manufacturers from an end user POV, rather than simply dealing with commercial scentric applications only as there appears only to be one UK nominated Installer based in Lincolnshire (Cellnexx), with very little in the way of useful data on the installs - as it appears mainly Solar references.

Thanks in advance.

 

[akaPABLO01]

Hi

Rather than start a new thread, I was just wondering if anyone has had any dealings with Redflow Energy Storage Technology, especially in relation to their 10kWh ZBM2 zinc bromide flow battery installations in the UK?

Reason for my question, is because I am trying to find out if anyone has had one installed in the UK for lower use smaller scale domestic / commercial property, so that I can try and get some useful real life experiences with the kit vs other manufacturers from an end user POV, rather than simply dealing with commercial scentric applications only as there appears only to be one UK nominated Installer based in Lincolnshire (Cellnexx), with very little in the way of useful data on the installs - as it appears mainly Solar references.

Thanks in advance.

Ring John at RedT 07956 015888

I couldn’t stack cost versus payback and they tend to try and enter the market at 250kW

 

[Ukjay]

Ring John at RedT 07956 015888

I couldn’t stack cost versus payback and they tend to try and enter the market at 250kW

Sorry Paul

Why would John @ RedT answer my questions on Redflow products?

I interested in learning more about their products not RedT's, especially interested in the way the Redflow unit looks modular and simple to expand.

 

[akaPABLO01]

Sorry Paul

Why would John @ RedT answer my questions on Redflow products?

I interested in learning more about their products not RedT's, especially interested in the way the Redflow unit looks modular and simple to expand.

Request some case studies from him and data surrounding the products implementation. I’m sure he would be happy to answer all your questions on the technology of vanadium. John is sales leader I think from memory and conducts all costing with correctly sized dc input. It’s your best lead so far.

My last analysis saw the product at least 50% over priced including the grant available.

 

[Ukjay]

Request some case studies from him and data surrounding the products implementation. I’m sure he would be happy to answer all your questions on the technology of vanadium. John is sales leader I think from memory and conducts all costing with correctly sized dc input. It’s your best lead so far.

My last analysis saw the product at least 50% over priced including the grant available.

Maybe I am missing something - but the two companies are using somewhat different technology, RedT is Vanadium, Redflow is Zinc Bromide which in essence is a different tech in terms of battery properties / attributes etc - also the size of the actual unit is evidentally smaller than a vanadium unit from what I can see.

To that degree, I am not certain John from RedT would be the 'best lead' for finding the truth of real end users of the Redflow units here, as it is not the site survey I am avter - but real life experience from someone int he UK with a unit if there is one.