SFI Options and Grassweeds

[sahara]

What are people's thoughts on how they will manage Blackgrass and or Rye Grass in options like Wild Bird Food or Legume fallows?

I've been reading through the SFI handbook and have found some options that would be a good fit for us, but I'm nervous of planting something that becomes swamped by Ryegrass, so I'm interested to hear other peoples take.

Thanks

 

[Chris W]

What are people's thoughts on how they will manage Blackgrass and or Rye Grass in options like Wild Bird Food or Legume fallows?

I've been reading through the SFI handbook and have found some options that would be a good fit for us, but I'm nervous of planting something that becomes swamped by Ryegrass, so I'm interested to hear other peoples take.

Thanks

Personally am hoping that by establishing the wild bird food Early August, any BG that germinates won’t have chance to seed before it is sprayed off in the following spring.

 

[DrWazzock]

A good stale seedbed (with cover crop?) over winter. Can you claim for over winter cover prior to birdseed?
Spray off and “direct” drill late spring (late April).
I couldn’t see the bird seed coming to much if drilled as late as August here.

 

[warksfarmer]

Had a flier through (sorry cant remember who from though) where by they were trialling pre emergence herbicides with various seed mixes that meet the SFI criteria with the view these were applied in august/september and then the mix is destroyed in March before any grass weed seeds went to head.

 

[Hindsight]

A good stale seedbed (with cover crop?) over winter. Can you claim for over winter cover prior to birdseed?
Spray off and “direct” drill late spring (late April).
I couldn’t see the bird seed coming to much if drilled as late as August here.

You could claim SAM2 for Autumn 2024 as your AHL2 Bird Cover would not be until the 2025 SFI year - the second year of your SFI agreement, and entered onto the 2025 claim and thus on that parcel not be claimed in 2024 as AH2. My understanding - but as ever caveat is take proper advice.

 

[DrWazzock]

You could claim SAM2 for Autumn 2024 as your AHL2 Bird Cover would not be until the 2025 SFI year - the second year of your SFI agreement, and entered onto the 2025 claim and thus on that parcel not be claimed in 2024 as AH2. My understanding - but as ever caveat is take proper advice.

There’s a lot to think about both agronomically and financially regarding meshing these options efficiently into rotations.
Still waiting for a call back from DEFRA after leaving my number last Wednesday. Not a show stopper so it doesn’t really matter but it’s concerning generally.

 

[DrWazzock]

All I know is my better land will rotate wheat and red clover arable ley. My poorer arable land will rotate spring barley, winter covers, birdseed mix, pollinator mix in some way that I haven’t worked out yet. The grassland will gradually become more herbal leys.
It will be a modest application, not taking the Mickey!

 

[DrWazzock]

As we’ve sheep, it’s debatable whether stubble turnips might be better than a winter cover.
The fly in the ointment is that winter birdseed has to be left all winter but that’s not really such a problem as it’s only a portion of the poor land arable rotation. I’m rotating it to avoid a weed build up.

 

[Badshot]

As we’ve sheep, it’s debatable whether stubble turnips might be better than a winter cover.
The fly in the ointment is that winter birdseed has to be left all winter but that’s not really such a problem as it’s only a portion of the poor land arable rotation. I’m rotating it to avoid a weed build up.

You can lightly graze the over winter cover, over winter, as long as it still remains green enough and isn't poached to buggery. Then end of Feb graze hard to finish it off. Aims met.

 

[Hindsight]

There’s a lot to think about both agronomically and financially regarding meshing these options efficiently into rotations.
Still waiting for a call back from DEFRA after leaving my number last Wednesday. Not a show stopper so it doesn’t really matter but it’s concerning generally.

You may well wait forever for a call back. Keep calling until you get to speak with someone. If subsequently the call back comes through say thank you but am sorted now.

 

[DrWazzock]

You can lightly graze the over winter cover, over winter, as long as it still remains green enough and isn't poached to buggery. Then end of Feb graze hard to finish it off. Aims met.

The way I read it you could only start grazing it 6 weeks prior to spring drilling which kind of implies I’ve got a functioning crystal ball.

 

[Badshot]

The way I read it you could only start grazing it 6 weeks prior to spring drilling which kind of implies I’ve got a functioning crystal ball.

You're overthinking it

It simply says you can graze it, as long as it's still sufficiently well established over the winter months.

So graze lightly, until the end Feb (end of winter months) then graze hard to finish it off.

 

[ESUS Agri]

You could claim SAM2 for Autumn 2024 as your AHL2 Bird Cover would not be until the 2025 SFI year - the second year of your SFI agreement, and entered onto the 2025 claim and thus on that parcel not be claimed in 2024 as AH2. My understanding - but as ever caveat is take proper advice.

The yearend depends on when your agreement starts.

 

[Derrick Hughes]

If you dont want to add Ryegrass to Legume fallow ,supposedly to help control blackgrass then add Timothy and Cocksfoot

 

[Gadget]

If you dont want to add Ryegrass to Legume fallow ,supposedly to help control blackgrass then add Timothy and Cocksfoot

Our problem isn't the grass added, its the resistant ryegrass that we already have.

 

[Derrick Hughes]

Our problem isn't the grass added, its the resistant ryegrass that we already have.

So letting it seed it the legume fallow could be a nightmare then , there are mowing options if you add a bit of grass, which may stop it seeding

 

[Regenerator1]

Our problem isn't the grass added, its the resistant ryegrass that we already have.

The problem is choosing Legume Fallow with NO approved chemistry if that is how you farm... if you take the money... work out how to get back to year 1 again without penalty... it is a very very hard solution...

 

[DrWazzock]

I’ve a low and manageable level of blackgrass on heavy land. If I put it down to NUM3 for 2 or even 3 years will I see a BG explosion? I can see a few thin stand of red clover and BG making the most of it turbo charged by the N. There’s mowing but that doesn’t seem sensible when birds are nesting and BG can head quite low. How have people managed?

 

[DrWazzock]

No, didn’t think so.
What a load of ballcocks these options are. Why drill an over winter cover just so you can have the pleasure of driilling A sh!t crop of spring barley into a slug infested mat of sodden trash.
No. I’ll carry on drilling winter cereals. Sod SFI for a game of soldiers. What a crock it is when you get into the detail.

 

[Brisel]

What are people's thoughts on how they will manage Blackgrass and or Rye Grass in options like Wild Bird Food or Legume fallows?

I've been reading through the SFI handbook and have found some options that would be a good fit for us, but I'm nervous of planting something that becomes swamped by Ryegrass, so I'm interested to hear other peoples take.

Thanks

Sow a winter cover crop SAM2 before your bird seed or legume fallow. Keep the seed rates down to allow the grass weeds space to chit. That way, you will have avoided the main germination window for blackgrass and can terminate what has grown already as you move from one option to another.

I won’t be adding any ryegrass to my NUM3. I have enough blackgrass already to fill the space. AB15 2 year legume fallows have Timothy added for BG competition here currently.

In AHL2 or AB9 wild bird seed, choose broad leafed species that you can spray graminicides in. Most of the main seed merchants will have mixtures to suit. In my weedy AB9 plots that have been growing multi species crops for years, there are high levels of broad leafed weeds so I grow Broad Buster from Bright Seeds (Grass Buster is also available) which includes sorghum, millet and linseed that meets the option requirement yet I can use Peak and Shield under EAMU approvals to clean them up.