Spring Beans after permanent pasture

[SilliamWhale]

I've been mulling over what crops go grow to reclaim some of my 40 year old permanent pasture. I'm pretty confident that the drill is technically capable of doing it.

I did ask about swedes and brassicas etc. but ideally I wanted to grow a Winter wheat after it.

Thinking about it again I'm wondering about no tilling spring beans into it and then a winter wheat. What say the sages?

There was talk of wireworm and cranefly and that beans may be less affected than a wheat? or may help break the cycle a bit?

I can get £50 acre if I sell it has a hay cut and although the its not lot in p and k I was thinking it may need some prilled lime placed near it.

Do you think its a bit risky to do? My plan would be spray off with roundup soon (spray insecticide as well), no till beans use nirvana pre em and then probably need to spray grassweeds again - there would still be weeds I'm sure. Possibly give it a kick with some NPK with very little N. Disaster zone?

 

[Hartwig]

Go for it, I can`t see what should go wrong. Just don`t drill too early as the beans would love it to get a warm kickstart really and grass can decay a bit more since then. I´m always amazed how well beans grow in a patch with annual meadowgras here and there.

 

[SilliamWhale]

Thanks Hartwig.

With specific reference to the likely potential wireworm or insect issues are there any other comments?

 

[BSH]

Will cant comment on beans per se but I felt in retrospect that I would definitely go out of grass with a spring crop if doing it again because of the opportunity to apply nitrogen to counter the breakdown of the old sward. I put some spring barley into and area that had been grazed over winter and then sprayed off and if anything it looked better than the rest of the area. Going into grass in the previous autumn was less succesful. I have only once had a problem with wireworm when breaking an old ley and they ate the lupin seed I had sown but not so much the triticale that I had sown with it as an arable silage mix. I haven't ever had a problem with leather jackets, despite plenty of crane flies, but we do have a couple of rookeries on the farm. Perhaps spring oats is something to think about? There was a someone on the other forum looking for oats that were uncontaminated with barley esp for a specialist food contract. Oats on ex pasture would be ideal and attract a premium. PM me if you want his details.

 

[Jim Bullock]

Will... we have done spring beans after long-term setaside (15 years) which was just mown every year. We sprayed off in the autumn with glyphosate and again in the spring.. Had a pretty good crop of beans 1.25 tons/acre (good for us!) then direct-drilled winter wheat and had a cracking good crop 3.8 tons/acre (Solstice)..

 

[H.Jackson]

Put beans in after long term grass last spring autumn glyphosate and again in the spring. Did a shade under 2 tonnes very pleased

 

[Simon Chiles]

If you've sprayed it of in the autumn then it'll be ok, if it's still growing grass then you'll have to think carefully if you're going to dd this spring.

 

[SilliamWhale]

If you've sprayed it of in the autumn then it'll be ok, if it's still growing grass then you'll have to think carefully if you're going to dd this spring.

Your thinking toxins affecting germination and the temperature etc? I've not sprayed it yet, this is a last minute idea really. If it was sprayed in the next few days and drilled about 10th April then maybe its a goer. That said there's little growth at the moment - sheep grazed it quite hard.

Hmmm.

 

[nick channer]

We have 100 acres the same.
Last cropped 15 yrs ago and left derelict.
Cut silage off it last June then sprayed off.
Sprayed off again in October.
Will go straight in with hybrid..
Not to fussed about yield as land rent Fred for 2 yrs.
Just want something to go in that will make easy for winter wheat in autumn..
Could plough but seems shame to bury 15 yrs biology etc when it can be drilled straight into..

 

[JD6920s]

I've been mulling over what crops go grow to reclaim some of my 40 year old permanent pasture. I'm pretty confident that the drill is technically capable of doing it.

I did ask about swedes and brassicas etc. but ideally I wanted to grow a Winter wheat after it.

Thinking about it again I'm wondering about no tilling spring beans into it and then a winter wheat. What say the sages?

There was talk of wireworm and cranefly and that beans may be less affected than a wheat? or may help break the cycle a bit?

I can get £50 acre if I sell it has a hay cut and although the its not lot in p and k I was thinking it may need some prilled lime placed near it.

Do you think its a bit risky to do? My plan would be spray off with roundup soon (spray insecticide as well), no till beans use nirvana pre em and then probably need to spray grassweeds again - there would still be weeds I'm sure. Possibly give it a kick with some NPK with very little N. Disaster zone?

Are you allowed to turn permanent pasture into arable now?
Thought they were on about stopping this, or, does that rule only apply to ploughing it up?

 

[SilliamWhale]

Are you allowed to turn permanent pasture into arable now?
Thought they were on about stopping this, or, does that rule only apply to ploughing it up?

I've done an EIA in Wales (inspection) which means I can do what I want. Don't know the rules in England sorry.

 

[JD6920s]

I've done an EIA in Wales (inspection) which means I can do what I want. Don't know the rules in England sorry.

What does that entail then?
And do you have to pay for the privilege?

 

[SilliamWhale]

What does that entail then?
And do you have to pay for the privilege?

No you fill in a form and inspector comes out to makes sure there are no species of interest there which deem the area a "habitat" ie something rare or unusual. Then you get on with your life.

Its likely you will already know if its a wildlife habitat or unusual as there is probably an SSSI on it or something in the past management of it may have helped it.

 

[SilliamWhale]

Well the ph has come back as about 5.9 - I think if I can get some bean seed I'm going to give it a crack.

Roundup this week, some insecticide, drill around April 15th with some lime on top and some bagged lime down the spout, pre-em and pray. There is some wireworm in one field but not in another (different soil type).

May also give it a pile of FYM.

 

[yellow belly]

beware od wire worm for the next 3 years I had part of field that was long term setaside which kept having wire worm problem use treated seed for the wheat in the autumn

 

[Simon Chiles]

Well the ph has come back as about 5.9 - I think if I can get some bean seed I'm going to give it a crack.

Roundup this week, some insecticide, drill around April 15th with some lime on top and some bagged lime down the spout, pre-em and pray. There is some wireworm in one field but not in another (different soil type).

May also give it a pile of FYM.

The weather will be better on the 16th.

 

[SilliamWhale]

Just had the soil test results

P index 0 !
K index 1!
ph is 5.9 on one test and 5.4 on the nrm one.

Organic matter 12% - need to burn some up!

It will have to be placed P (maybe even K) and lime both from a bag and the spreader to make this work.