Synchronising ewes 12 or 14 days for sponges?

[TrewithickFarm]

Sponges are going in this week. Last year we left them in 14 days, PMSG on removal and rams in 36-48 hours later - worked well but they were a little more drawn out at lambing than expected and had around 9% empties at scanning. We are lleyn and blue texel.
Have read an article by Teagasc who suggest that if bringing them out of season, then only putting sponges in for 12 days is better. Anyone have any opinions/experience with this.

 

[neilo]

If they are out of season then you can pull at 12 days (which is standard procedure for AI programs, where synchrony is far more important than when tupping), although 14 days or longer won’t cause any issues either.
You won’t get any better results by shortening the time to 12 days though. Teasing before sponging might help, as would using regulin alongside (c.£4/hd extra!).

I was advised last year, by an Iranian that’s been selling sheep CIDR’s for many years, that you can pull them out after 6 days and the ewes will still cycle. He claimed the ewes will be more fertile too, as the ova will be fresher.
I pulled a dozen at 6 days last year, as a trial, and 9 got in lamb to that cycle, despite only having been weaned a fortnight or so. I’m doing the same on a small bunch this year, as I need to tip them a few days earlier in order to get the service site to his new home.

Btw CIDR’s are a lot easier & cleaner to use than sponges.

 

[Dkb]

@neilo are CIDRs easily sourced?

 

[neilo]

@neilo are CIDRs easily sourced?

Yes. The vet can order them in the same as they would sponges. Been around for years worldwide, but licensed here last year.

 

[Ysgythan]

I prefer CIDRs but for flushing ewes I believe they’re bringing back sponges this year.

 

[neilo]

I prefer CIDRs but for flushing ewes I believe they’re bringing back sponges this year.

Yes. They’ve had a few places where ET results weren’t as good with CIDRs iirc. Very pleased with my flushing last year though, with fresh and frozen semen.
The only fly in the ointment was the one donor that lost her CIDR before I started injections, which ‘may’ have been from the cord catching on something when rubbing (there’s a tiny knobble on the end)? I should have checked they were still in place every day, as per vet’s advice.

 

[Ysgythan]

Yes. They’ve had a few places where ET results weren’t as good with CIDRs iirc. Very pleased with my flushing last year though, with fresh and frozen semen.
The only fly in the ointment was the one donor that lost her CIDR before I started injections, which ‘may’ have been from the cord catching on something when rubbing (there’s a tiny knobble on the end)? I should have checked they were still in place every day, as per vet’s advice.

Yes we found one hanging on the mesh of a hurdle.

 

[neilo]

Yes we found one hanging on the mesh of a hurdle.

There are some available in South America that have a design where that can’t happen, i’m Told.

Overall though, I lose fewer CIDRs than sponges, and never get one that needs forceps to remove in bits.

 

[Farmer Fin]

CIDR and sponges are different hormones so can’t be used interchangeably. Slightly different timings. I think this is where some people have struggled with ET and CIDRs as used as a sponge. Zoetis have more data and timings now for this and I think some of the ET companies are happy with them now. Certainly less issues with removing and discharge.

 

[Ysgythan]

CIDR and sponges are different hormones so can’t be used interchangeably. Slightly different timings. I think this is where some people have struggled with ET and CIDRs as used as a sponge. Zoetis have more data and timings now for this and I think some of the ET companies are happy with them now. Certainly less issues with removing and discharge.

It’s the Vet that draws up the program.

 

[neilo]

CIDR and sponges are different hormones so can’t be used interchangeably. Slightly different timings. I think this is where some people have struggled with ET and CIDRs as used as a sponge. Zoetis have more data and timings now for this and I think some of the ET companies are happy with them now. Certainly less issues with removing and discharge.

As above, I've used CIDR's for AI and ET programs for the last 2 years, and been very happy with the results with both fresh and frozen semen. Timings no different to when I was using sponges.

I have 140 CIDRs in ewes currently being programed for AI, tupping and/or embryo implanting.