The best farmers are not farming as we know it

[robs1]

There was a global economic downturn in the early 90s with the USA going into
recession with confidence low and interest rates high.People back then thought
cash in the bank a safer bet where as the last 20 years it has provided a pittance on savings.
Quite different times it would take a lot to crash land prices now.
That said who knows what events unfold.

Remove roll over and iht relief and huge amounts of institutionally owned land would be sold, perhaps slowly but why hold land if the return is so poor?
Actual farmers would probably benefit, maybe limit iht to a set amount would be a reasonable step say the first million above the normal £ 325,000 / 500,000 per person, for a family farm that would still add up to a fair chunk

 

[Kiwi Pete]

Wikipedia actually.

Maybe I should hop on there and edit it..

 

[lloyd]

Remove roll over and iht relief and huge amounts of institutionally owned land would be sold, perhaps slowly but why hold land if the return is so poor?
Actual farmers would probably benefit, maybe limit iht to a set amount would be a reasonable step say the first million above the normal £ 325,000 / 500,000 per person, for a family farm that would still add up to a fair chunk

I'd imagine the result of that could push some close to negative equity but it would
sort the difference between farmers and just landowners.

 

[lloyd]

Maybe I should hop on there and edit it..

Maybe but you can't compare two countries roughly the same
land size where the population of one is roughly 5,000,000 and
the other 60,000,000 and rising fast.
People or the way they vote have massive influences in the way
one is allowed to farm by their elected government.

How do you control the wildlife spreading TB in NZ ?
Major problem in the UK by all parties not wanting to tackle
the issue because of the urban majority vote.

 

[robs1]

I'd imagine the result of that could push some close to negative equity.

It might but also might give others a chance to farm, and long term it would be better overall Imvho

 

[Kiwi Pete]

Maybe but you can't compare two countries roughly the same
land size where the population of one is roughly 5,000,000 and
the other 60,000,000 and rising fast.
People or the way they vote have massive influences in the way
one is allowed to farm by their elected government.

Of course not, it's just a waste of everyone's time.

Only just the other day I pointed out the futility of comparing lamb prices in supermarkets here to UK, I could save approx 40% by going elsewhere and from what I gather it's just not the case over there.

Or comparing losing direct farm support 40 years ago to the current day, or whenever it happens in the UK, virtually no two things are comparable.

People might say "oh we had 27% interest rates" and yes they did, they also paid 70c for a litre of petrol not 4 or 5 times as much. Everything is different but the main shift is in our expectation.

In 1984 farms had been practicing "modern" aka fragile farming with regular topdressing and renovation of pasture for a bit over a decade, if at all.

Now it's been going on for 50,60 years not many know how to farm well without all those props, and that'll be the biggest hurdle to face, if all you know is "spend money to make money" how do you make money with nothing to spend??

 

[Huno]

well…
i would prefer if you didn‘t tell posters to « jog along ». For one thing it’s rude and secondly, some of us might find the posts interesting.
Merci beaucoup

That is a real bad one.. makes me look like a pixy in a pink tutu

 

[stewart]

I personally think all this NZ is better at marketing than the UK is b**lpoo,
it just benefited from a very weak currency years ago and now the much stronger NZ dollar
is having the opposite effect.

2001 NZ dollar 3.6 to the british pound.
2024 NZ dollar 2.1 to the british pound.

NZ produce is far less competitive than years ago.

You are entitled to think that NZ marketing is no better than the UKs, having farmed in both countries I think the complete opposite and am prepared to back it financially, last year my share of promotional spend via the marketer was substantial.
If inputs are imported currency value has a limited effect on profits as you are paying more for what you buy in, it does help but not as much as you think.
NZ products may not be as competitive in the UK as they once were as UK consumers in general are not prepared to pay for quality, thankfully the high paying Asian markets are prepared to pay a premium for NZ produce.

 

[stewart]

When you are only 60% self sufficient and you are producing a commodity product such as wheat or milk you shouldn't need to market your product, the processors should be fighting for it, the consumer doesn't buy wheat and milk only to put in their tea the rest is processed why would we market those products? Of course UK farm produce is marketed to some extent by RT, that has really increased our prices, dairy crest was farmer owned much like some of the NZ co ops, central grain stores do "market" their crops but to processors not consumers, when you have to sell it into a foreign market then you need to market it and cooperate to export it, I think your not comparing like with like, European farmers don't market directly either.
Do the makers of steel or components market cars, do brick makers market houses ?
Some farmers selling direct to processors and even to the likes of McDonald's or marks and Spencers, their prices are still very largely dependent on the general market prices.
Most of what we produce goes direct to the end buyer but it's not into the food sector, UK consumers want cheap food I've yet to see a promotion that says buy my product it's dearer than the rest

A very concise post and a good explanation as to why UK agricultural marketing is so poor. Thank you.

 

[livestock 1]

You are entitled to think that NZ marketing is no better than the UKs, having farmed in both countries I think the complete opposite and am prepared to back it financially, last year my share of promotional spend via the marketer was substantial.
If inputs are imported currency value has a limited effect on profits as you are paying more for what you buy in, it does help but not as much as you think.
NZ products may not be as competitive in the UK as they once were as UK consumers in general are not prepared to pay for quality, thankfully the high paying Asian markets are prepared to pay a premium for NZ produce.

Have you looked at all the millions of dollars you receive with your ‘unsubsidised’ farming ?

 

[ollie989898]

Remove roll over and iht relief and huge amounts of institutionally owned land would be sold, perhaps slowly but why hold land if the return is so poor?
Actual farmers would probably benefit, maybe limit iht to a set amount would be a reasonable step say the first million above the normal £ 325,000 / 500,000 per person, for a family farm that would still add up to a fair chunk

Inheritance tax is just so immoral on so many levels.

It should be scrapped. It would actually increase economic growth I think. An asset/property tax could be used instead, and for Godsake change the council tax bandings, that is bullship. No more holiday home lark- you own a home you pay the fudging council tax on it.

 

[stewart]

Have you looked at all the millions of dollars you receive with your ‘unsubsidised’ farming ?

We don't receive subsidies.

https://www.cato.org/blog/new-zealands-free-market-farming

NZ Government

www.mpi.govt.nz

 

[stewart]

Inheritance tax is just so immoral on so many levels.

It should be scrapped. It would actually increase economic growth I think. An asset/property tax could be used instead, and for Godsake change the council tax bandings, that is bullship. No more holiday home lark- you own a home you pay the fudging council tax on it.

Problem with an asset tax is when your cash poor (which many farmers are ) then you have to sell the assets to pay tax.

 

[livestock 1]

We don't receive subsidies.

https://www.cato.org/blog/new-zealands-free-market-farming

NZ Government

www.mpi.govt.nz

They say if you tell a lie enough times will believe it

 

[stewart]

They say if you tell a lie enough times will believe it

Well keep up the the lie about NZ farmers receiving a subsidy, it will take a lot of telling for me to believe it and as I receive sweet FA in the from of payments from the government I will in all likely hood never believe it.

 

[livestock 1]

Well keep up the the lie about NZ farmers receiving a subsidy, it will take a lot of telling for me to believe it and as I receive sweet FA in the from of payments from the government I will in all likely hood never believe it.

Read what I’ve put on for you then tell me again

 

[livestock 1]

 

[ollie989898]

Problem with an asset tax is when your cash poor (which many farmers are ) then you have to sell the assets to pay tax.

I don't know how best to implement this. I would sooner put added sales tax on goods and services as in this way people can choose to pay it if they are able or simply avoid buying stuff.

 

[ollie989898]

View attachment 1179276

Where in that passage of text do you think it says they give money to farmers???

 

[Henarar]

Where in that passage of text do you think it says they give money to farmers???

Does a susidy have to be money