The real reason why wheat is bad for you....

[Christoph1945]

I wonder why some have adverse reactions to wheat and others don't?

I personally avoid all wheat and gluten products and find that they induces fatigue, irritability, and poor analyses of perceived problems. I bit like alcohol, I suppose.

As for chemicals; I spent most of my working life in the chemical industry and the company I worked for produced the chlorine gas that was used to kill Germans soldiers during WW1. They also produced "Paraquat" the highly toxic weed killer and sulphuric acid that was sometimes diluted and used for killing off potato tops prior to harvest. Very often, when we solve one problem we sometimes create other unimagined problems.

 

[mikep]

I was told by my daughter she had talked about this with a small independent baker. He pointed out that supermarket bread, be it white sliced or nutty granary loaf or baguette or whatever, has to be baked very quickly, from mixing ingredients to removing from the oven in less than an hour. The only way they can get a loaf to finish that quickly is to add very much excess yeast, to accelerate the process. There is so much yeast not needed, and still there after a short time, that it starts fermenting again when it's in your guts, so you feel bloated. This feeling has been wrongly associated with gluten intolerance.

Not sure if it is true, but it's interesting

The temperature in baking will kill any yeast in the dough otherwise you would possibly get fermentation from either type of bread.

 

[Andy Howard]

On my Nuffield travels I was on a visit with an organic consultant and she started going on about wheat and gluten and I suggested it was probably more to do with modern baking than wheat itself and gluten free was another way for the marketeers to extract more money from consumers. Well I got the worst death stare ever! There is always a middle ground. Buy decent bread, don't stuff yourself and the 5% of the population who are actually celiacs should avoid it. As I have said before pre harvest glyphosate should be banned even if just for PR.

 

[Farmer T]

On my Nuffield travels I was on a visit with an organic consultant and she started going on about wheat and gluten and I suggested it was probably more to do with modern baking than wheat itself and gluten free was another way for the marketeers to extract more money from consumers. Well I got the worst death stare ever! There is always a middle ground. Buy decent bread, don't stuff yourself and the 5% of the population who are actually celiacs should avoid it. As I have said before pre harvest glyphosate should be banned even if just for PR.

If we start changing farming practices because of PR I think that's a very slippery slope to be on.

We lost Neo-nice basically down to PR and now apply cypermethrin 2-3 times in flea beetle areas.

Let's try and base what we do on scientific findings rather than PR.

Ps for what it's worth I'm not a fan of roundup pre harvest and think there should be more testing done into it. However until then as long as farmers stick to the harvest interval I can't see a reason to stop it

 

[glasshouse]

If we start changing farming practices because of PR I think that's a very slippery slope to be on.

We lost Neo-nice basically down to PR and now apply cypermethrin 2-3 times in flea beetle areas.

Let's try and base what we do on scientific findings rather than PR.

Ps for what it's worth I'm not a fan of roundup pre harvest and think there should be more testing done into it. However until then as long as farmers stick to the harvest interval I can't see a reason to stop it

pre harvest roundup should be banned, there is no need for it, and the harvest interval is a joke, the chem is on the plant on the 12th day and the 15th day.

 

[Andy Howard]

If we start changing farming practices because of PR I think that's a very slippery slope to be on.

We lost Neo-nice basically down to PR and now apply cypermethrin 2-3 times in flea beetle areas.

Let's try and base what we do on scientific findings rather than PR.

Ps for what it's worth I'm not a fan of roundup pre harvest and think there should be more testing done into it. However until then as long as farmers stick to the harvest interval I can't see a reason to stop it

You have to think of it from the consumers point of view. If you had two loaves in front of your children one with pre harvest round up and one without which one would you feed? I know which one I would feed my children. We as farmers are very bad at PR and then wonder why the consumers can turn against us.being good at PR has nothing to do with following scientific evidence! If you don't want to ban it then maybe we as an industry should voluntarily cease the practice until it has had independent research. Just like we should have done with neonics. Instead the NFU got on their high horse about how safe they are and now they and us the farming industry look stupid as the evidence is mounting against them.

 

[Brisel]

Lets ban glyphosate totally or go organic, then the kids will only have one loaf of bread with no chance of a second one!

 

[shakerator]

google "non protein nitrogen "

Think late foliar N

We are not ruminants but the Chorley wood process is a classic case of industrial health over clinical.

Some French sticks can be made with 9% protein !

What does "quality" even mean for our health. I saw some sprouted wheat flour on sale for £7/kg. not bad for zero hagburg

It is gluten or ammonia from non biological nitrates unable to convert into proteins

Spelt ok sourdough ok

 

[glasshouse]

i always thought it strange how you had to put foliar n on late to get 11% "milling quality."
bread can be made from any wheat.

 

[Andy Howard]

Lets ban glyphosate totally or go organic, then the kids will only have one loaf of bread with no chance of a second one!

No shortage of food in the world. If UK went completely organic I don't think starving children in Africa would notice. Actually they may be better off as there will be less European subsidised cheap grain dumped on the world market.

 

[Brisel]

No shortage of food in the world. If UK went completely organic I don't think starving children in Africa would notice. Actually they may be better off as there will be less European subsidised cheap grain dumped on the world market.

We'll agree to disagree on that one. Sure, if the UK went totally organic there would be little effect but the more likely scenario is the whole EU would be legislated into going that way by default. The EU is the biggest producer & consumer of wheat in the world, as well as accounting for a good % of traded grain too.

The Western world may consume more calories than it needs but over a billion people go to bed hungry. There is only just enough food in the world. If the world goes organic there certainly won't be enough to feed them all.

I agree that dumping our grain on the world market destabilises domestic production in the importing nations - just seeing what a strong £ is doing to our market is bad enough.

 

[Andy Howard]

For me it's a question of distribution, increasing production where the food is needed and stopping shoving grains through animals and biofuel plants. Reading a book called how the other half dies at the moment by Susan George. Written 40years ago but still very relevant. Worth a read. It makes you think. How much of the developing world produces products that are exported to the developed world to feed consumerism in the first world? What if they grew foods for themselves or at least a portion. Who owns the land that produces the products for export? The locals or companies like Unilever etc? So where do the profits go? Is food aid a help or used as a weapon? I always thought USA food aid was a gift. Apparently it is a loan or can be. Sorry getting a bit deep here for a Monday but I think we need to stop kidding ourselves that we need to keep producing more to feed the poor starving masses. We don't they do.

 

[Brisel]

All good points, Andy.

It's not good for the Western world if the Developing world becomes self sufficient - we'd lose our control which just wouldn't do! (That's a tongue in cheek comment, not a serious one).

The biofuels issue is an interesting one - where else do we get our energy from other than fossil fuels & a few other renewables like wind & solar? We've been growing biofuels for millennia - oats for the horses that pulled the plough etc etc.

So maybe wheat is bad for the world, not just the Caucasian body??

 

[Andy Howard]

All good points, Andy.

It's not good for the Western world if the Developing world becomes self sufficient - we'd lose our control which just wouldn't do! (That's a tongue in cheek comment, not a serious one).

The biofuels issue is an interesting one - where else do we get our energy from other than fossil fuels & a few other renewables like wind & solar? We've been growing biofuels for millennia - oats for the horses that pulled the plough etc etc.

So maybe wheat is bad for the world, not just the Caucasian body??

I don't think it's about things being bad or good, it is about balance and diversity. Something currently lacking at the moment. I agree with biofuels that some should be grown but again it's balance. There is always a halfway house.

 

[Brisel]

That's like a perfect market. In theory it exists but in reality it doesn't. Politics always gets in the way, along with greed.

 

[multi power]

Maybe it would be better if we just stop eating?

 

[Andy Howard]

That's like a perfect market. In theory it exists but in reality it doesn't. Politics always gets in the way, along with greed.

Yep, without politics and greed we would all live happily ever after

 

[yellow belly]

The biggest importers of wheat are country's that cannot grow enough due to their climate being unsuitable Egypt Japan
Saudi Arabia used to have a policy to grow all their own food but money could no produce more water so they decided to by their food from country's that could do it cheaper and export more oil

In the uk we can grow wheat at lower cost per tonne than most other countrys as water falls out of the sky

 

[yellow belly]

I don't think it's about things being bad or good, it is about balance and diversity. Something currently lacking at the moment. I agree with biofuels that some should be grown but again it's balance. There is always a halfway house.

Bio fuels from food crops allow use to have a reserve in production to cover low yielding years

 

[glasshouse]

The biggest importers of wheat are country's that cannot grow enough due to their climate being unsuitable Egypt Japan
Saudi Arabia used to have a policy to grow all their own food but money could no produce more water so they decided to by their food from country's that could do it cheaper and export more oil

In the uk we can grow wheat at lower cost per tonne than most other countrys as water falls out of the sky

Dont agree, we get too much water, other countries grow it cheaper ie ukraine, canada, usa, australia.
our land is too expensive to grow wheat.
australia land is £300 per acre ton
uk is £3,000 per acre ton.