Tubs v Liquid for feeding ewes.

[Kingcustard]

Must be time for an updated discussion on feeding in lamb ewes through the winter and lambing.

Firstly hard feed is not being considered here due to system change.

Not needing the time, disturbance and cost of fuel and wear and tear in ATVs and Snackers. When you add it all in to the equation it can be a shock.

So what's the pros and cons of both.

Everything seems a fortune nowadays but is one cheaper than the other in practice. I find that daily consumption rates are fine on paper but in reality these can be way off.

Do ewes all go to liquid feeders or do some take a bellyful and some take none.

Does anyone have problems like prolapses or twin lamb being more prevelant on one or the other.

Interested to find out everyone's thoughts.

 

[David.]

Nuts through a snacker far the cheapest way.
Tubs probably most convenient, least messy, and least stock disturbance though.

 

[Optimus]

Must be time for an updated discussion on feeding in lamb ewes through the winter and lambing.

Firstly hard feed is not being considered here due to system change.

Not needing the time, disturbance and cost of fuel and wear and tear in ATVs and Snackers. When you add it all in to the equation it can be a shock.

So what's the pros and cons of both.

Everything seems a fortune nowadays but is one cheaper than the other in practice. I find that daily consumption rates are fine on paper but in reality these can be way off.

Do ewes all go to liquid feeders or do some take a bellyful and some take none.

Does anyone have problems like prolapses or twin lamb being more prevelant on one or the other.

Interested to find out everyone's thoughts.

Have you priced up tubs?

You'll still be going round putting tubs out or filling up liquid feeders.so still have ATV cost much the same?

 

[Kingcustard]

Have you priced up tubs?

You'll still be going round putting tubs out or filling up liquid feeders.so still have ATV cost much the same?

The costs with feeding every day doing a 9 miles trip round 12 fields every day is shocking when you actually add up the extra fuel let alone breakdowns like the £600 I spent on the Chapman last year.

All Easycares so not needing to feed nuts anyway.

Tubs priced all seem to be around £950 going up to £1300

 

[DanM]

Now that you’ve switched to ewes with a lower maintenance requirement. Do you need to feed? Can you build up some surplus grass over autumn to use as deferred grazing over winter?

 

[Kingcustard]

The hope was to have a grass wedge to see them right through but the dry summer put paid to that.

Have good haylage made but don't like leaving ewes without access to minerals, vitamins and a bit of energy and protein in the run up to lambing.

All the grass is permenant pasture so grass growth and quality is always less.

Also not fertilising any of the fields now so the cost saved on that will more than cover a few tubs per hundred ewes

 

[Nithsdale]

What you'd save on wear/fuel/miles on the bike you will absolutely blow out on buckets.. convenience costs!

This year I went back to feeding my single rearing ewes daily because it was considerably cheaper than the pallet of hi energy buckets!!

Liquid feed would be scary if left adlib. Stuff I use is up to about 50p litre now...





Have you considered instead of concentrates just buying the cheapest rolled grain you can and applying a liquid feed to it? (Needs to be rolled so that the grain takes the liquid feed, whole grain absorbs feck all making the job pointless IME). Still got to go round with the snacker every day, but you'll not be feeding a lot out per head.
It also keeps the ewes quieter (they don't go as feral with daily interaction) which is worth the costs alone

 

[Kingcustard]

The reason I am trying to move a way from concentrates is.....

1. Easycare ewes don't have a requirement for it if they have grass, or haylage/silage. I am just concerned about minerals and a bit of energy, protein not so much of an issue with ECs as they seem to be able to take care of that bit themselves.

2. Spent £500 on the snacker last year getting the tow bar all replaced and the electrics redone as they gave up. Need a new set of tyres every year on the Can Am with all the miles towing.

3. Checking sheep is just driving around them, feeding sheep is towing the snacker to all parts of the farm up some steep hills and having to return to the feed silo 3 times to get everything fed.

4. Spend 2 hours after everything is fed going round them all again to check that everything has mothered up.

5. Ewes I haven't been feeding have had next to no prolapsed, fed ewes were a disaster for the last 3 or 4 years, no way of stopping some ewes gorging themselves and other ewes waiting til you are away and getting nothing.

6. Had a lot of near death experiences with the snacker on steep wet or snowy hills. Not worth a broken neck for.

7. Every morning the ewes are all at every gate waiting for the feed, no matter what the weather, dragging their lambs after them. And when I go to the next field they all come belting across to the fence to try and get more.

8. If you go in the field with the buggy to check sheep they think they are getting fed and start chasing you.

9. Surely not every farmer that uses tubs or liquid instead of hard feed can be wrong, and the price is set to reflect intakes against the other feed options, no matter what your rep tries to tell you.

10. Every year without fail there will be at least one lorry that arrives when we are snow bound and needs towed out and then the feed blown in to a trailer and then tipped at the main farm which is 4 miles away from where the sheep are which is an added pee about.

11. If I am not feeding ewes I can leave gates open in a lot of fields and not have to worry about 100 ewes appearing at the house when the buggy starts up. Sounds pathetic but when you 25 years of rugby and clipping have screwed your knees up it is not fun getting in and out to open a gate, shut it, feed ewes, then open and shut it when you are out again.... 4 times every gate times 12, no thanks

12a if you start feeding ewes you have to keep feeding them after they lamb. I run 300 ewes to the other farm 17 miles away once lambed, feeding that as well is a nightmare in time and stress about worrying about mothering up. Not to mention time away from the lambing fields. Dad always says leaves them as everything will mother up but with triplets or even pairs, 1 lost lamb every 2 or 3 days is still £100+ if it dies and if you spend 10 minutes trying to get it back to its mum you are probably getting 5 more lost with all the chasing about through the fields.


These are my experiences on a hill farm in Scotland, I am sure everyone will have a reason why I am wrong but every farm is different and every farms ewes are different.

My days of flying about with a quad and a snacker in all weathers are gone, I am trying to get to a system I can still be doing when I am 70!!

As I stated at the start, I wasnt needing a lecture on hard feed, more just people's experiences of the pros and cons of tubs v blocks v Liquid.

 

[glensman]

The reason I am trying to move a way from concentrates is.....

1. Easycare ewes don't have a requirement for it if they have grass, or haylage/silage. I am just concerned about minerals and a bit of energy, protein not so much of an issue with ECs as they seem to be able to take care of that bit themselves.

2. Spent £500 on the snacker last year getting the tow bar all replaced and the electrics redone as they gave up. Need a new set of tyres every year on the Can Am with all the miles towing.

3. Checking sheep is just driving around them, feeding sheep is towing the snacker to all parts of the farm up some steep hills and having to return to the feed silo 3 times to get everything fed.

4. Spend 2 hours after everything is fed going round them all again to check that everything has mothered up.

5. Ewes I haven't been feeding have had next to no prolapsed, fed ewes were a disaster for the last 3 or 4 years, no way of stopping some ewes gorging themselves and other ewes waiting til you are away and getting nothing.

6. Had a lot of near death experiences with the snacker on steep wet or snowy hills. Not worth a broken neck for.

7. Every morning the ewes are all at every gate waiting for the feed, no matter what the weather, dragging their lambs after them. And when I go to the next field they all come belting across to the fence to try and get more.

8. If you go in the field with the buggy to check sheep they think they are getting fed and start chasing you.

9. Surely not every farmer that uses tubs or liquid instead of hard feed can be wrong, and the price is set to reflect intakes against the other feed options, no matter what your rep tries to tell you.

10. Every year without fail there will be at least one lorry that arrives when we are snow bound and needs towed out and then the feed blown in to a trailer and then tipped at the main farm which is 4 miles away from where the sheep are which is an added pee about.

11. If I am not feeding ewes I can leave gates open in a lot of fields and not have to worry about 100 ewes appearing at the house when the buggy starts up. Sounds pathetic but when you 25 years of rugby and clipping have screwed your knees up it is not fun getting in and out to open a gate, shut it, feed ewes, then open and shut it when you are out again.... 4 times every gate times 12, no thanks

12a if you start feeding ewes you have to keep feeding them after they lamb. I run 300 ewes to the other farm 17 miles away once lambed, feeding that as well is a nightmare in time and stress about worrying about mothering up. Not to mention time away from the lambing fields. Dad always says leaves them as everything will mother up but with triplets or even pairs, 1 lost lamb every 2 or 3 days is still £100+ if it dies and if you spend 10 minutes trying to get it back to its mum you are probably getting 5 more lost with all the chasing about through the fields.


These are my experiences on a hill farm in Scotland, I am sure everyone will have a reason why I am wrong but every farm is different and every farms ewes are different.

My days of flying about with a quad and a snacker in all weathers are gone, I am trying to get to a system I can still be doing when I am 70!!

As I stated at the start, I wasnt needing a lecture on hard feed, more just people's experiences of the pros and cons of tubs v blocks v Liquid.

The only way you really learn anything is by doing it. Use tubs or blocks and cost it up at the end of the season (money and time/ease). This is obviously the direction you're going anyway so have no fear and go for it

 

[Nithsdale]

The reason I am trying to move a way from concentrates is.....

1. Easycare ewes don't have a requirement for it if they have grass, or haylage/silage. I am just concerned about minerals and a bit of energy, protein not so much of an issue with ECs as they seem to be able to take care of that bit themselves.

2. Spent £500 on the snacker last year getting the tow bar all replaced and the electrics redone as they gave up. Need a new set of tyres every year on the Can Am with all the miles towing.

3. Checking sheep is just driving around them, feeding sheep is towing the snacker to all parts of the farm up some steep hills and having to return to the feed silo 3 times to get everything fed.

4. Spend 2 hours after everything is fed going round them all again to check that everything has mothered up.

5. Ewes I haven't been feeding have had next to no prolapsed, fed ewes were a disaster for the last 3 or 4 years, no way of stopping some ewes gorging themselves and other ewes waiting til you are away and getting nothing.

6. Had a lot of near death experiences with the snacker on steep wet or snowy hills. Not worth a broken neck for.

7. Every morning the ewes are all at every gate waiting for the feed, no matter what the weather, dragging their lambs after them. And when I go to the next field they all come belting across to the fence to try and get more.

8. If you go in the field with the buggy to check sheep they think they are getting fed and start chasing you.

9. Surely not every farmer that uses tubs or liquid instead of hard feed can be wrong, and the price is set to reflect intakes against the other feed options, no matter what your rep tries to tell you.

10. Every year without fail there will be at least one lorry that arrives when we are snow bound and needs towed out and then the feed blown in to a trailer and then tipped at the main farm which is 4 miles away from where the sheep are which is an added pee about.

11. If I am not feeding ewes I can leave gates open in a lot of fields and not have to worry about 100 ewes appearing at the house when the buggy starts up. Sounds pathetic but when you 25 years of rugby and clipping have screwed your knees up it is not fun getting in and out to open a gate, shut it, feed ewes, then open and shut it when you are out again.... 4 times every gate times 12, no thanks

12a if you start feeding ewes you have to keep feeding them after they lamb. I run 300 ewes to the other farm 17 miles away once lambed, feeding that as well is a nightmare in time and stress about worrying about mothering up. Not to mention time away from the lambing fields. Dad always says leaves them as everything will mother up but with triplets or even pairs, 1 lost lamb every 2 or 3 days is still £100+ if it dies and if you spend 10 minutes trying to get it back to its mum you are probably getting 5 more lost with all the chasing about through the fields.


These are my experiences on a hill farm in Scotland, I am sure everyone will have a reason why I am wrong but every farm is different and every farms ewes are different.

My days of flying about with a quad and a snacker in all weathers are gone, I am trying to get to a system I can still be doing when I am 70!!

As I stated at the start, I wasnt needing a lecture on hard feed, more just people's experiences of the pros and cons of tubs v blocks v Liquid.

You give more info on the situation there

I'd go with buckets over liquid feed

 

[Jonp]

Was checking ewes the other day and noticed quite a few of the ones that are always knawing away at blocks or buckets are loosing their teeth, does anyone else see this?
They're good ewes and was thinking of feeding liquid to try and save teeth.

 

[Guleesh]

Was checking ewes the other day and noticed quite a few of the ones that are always knawing away at blocks or buckets are loosing their teeth, does anyone else see this?
They're good ewes and was thinking of feeding liquid to try and save teeth.

Last year, was checking mouths of cast ewes that had been fed blocks every winter, most still had all their teeth, but their teeth were worn right down to the gums.

 

[Highland Mule]

Was checking ewes the other day and noticed quite a few of the ones that are always knawing away at blocks or buckets are loosing their teeth, does anyone else see this?
They're good ewes and was thinking of feeding liquid to try and save teeth.

Use buckets (crystalix) every year. Rarely find myself culling on teeth, usually on age.

 

[Wood field]

We use liquid feed with urea , it’s supposed to be self limiting and to be fair we don’t see ewes hanging around the feeders
I’ve a few double ball feeders which hold more so can get away with not filling every day

 

[Y Fan Wen]

This hill farmer in his 70s has fed ewes nuts, rolls, liquid and blocks in his time and now uses only blocks.

 

[livestock 1]

We use liquid feed with urea , it’s supposed to be self limiting and to be fair we don’t see ewes hanging around the feeders
I’ve a few double ball feeders which hold more so can get away with not filling every day

This is the point. If you use a urea based liquid you will provide what the sheep need and they only take a sensible amount what they need. If you feed molasses then they will just sup it all day.
Blocks are for millionaires

 

[Welshram]

If there having haylage/silage just pore the molasses/urea over the bales when you put it in the feeder when I’ve given my ewes it I just half filled 25l jacks up and topped up with water poured it on top it soaked down through lovely self regulating as lay can only eat so much and if there’s grass for them lay don’t need anything

 

[Aspiring Peasants]

This is the point. If you use a urea based liquid you will provide what the sheep need and they only take a sensible amount what they need. If you feed molasses then they will just sup it all day.
Blocks are for millionaires

Roughly what daily intake would you work on for a high energy liquid feed with urea? Medium size ewes

 

[livestock 1]

Roughly what daily intake would you work on for a high energy liquid feed with urea? Medium size ewes

No more than 0.3 litre even in rough weather

 

[Nithsdale]

IIRC it's about 200-250ml/he/day most liquid feeds are quoted as saying intake requirements are... but that doesn't mean the odd ewe won't be greedy and take more, whilst others take less