UK Flour Millers: Press release about grain assurance

[Grass And Grain]

I see UK Flour Millers have recently put out a press release about grain assurance.

Assurance of imported wheat shows the value of Red Tractor

Position of UK Flour Millers 02 February 2023 Contrary to the view held by some farmers, the milling industry’s use of imported wheat is not undercutting UK growers. This is outlined in a new position statement by UK Flour Millers setting out why mills buy imported wheat and how it is assured...

www.ukflourmillers.org

^^^the pdf at bottom of this page goes into further detail.

They clearly like Red Tractor/ SQC, and highlight benefits of such schemes. Reading it carefully, what wasn't entirely clear was if their members would accept UK grain under same protocols as they accept for imports.

Obviously they accept the imports, so are presumably content with the food safety aspects.

The British Farming Union https://www.bfu.org.uk/ are making enquiries with UK Flour Millers to determine exactly what the import protocols are, and how we can match them.

 

[wanton dwarf]

Joe added “If a farmer wishes to sell unassured grain to a UK flour mill they would need to provide agrochemical and mycotoxin test results for at least every 200 tonne of grain drawn from the same bulk, at their own expense. This is clearly a less efficient means of providing assurance and it’s no wonder that Red Tractor is well supported by processors.”


Given Red Tractor has no baring what-so-ever on UK agricultural chemicals, chemical spay rates and crops grown & harvested.

How is this statement truthful ? It's just an arbitary decision based on what ?

The Millers need to get their facts sorted because they are costing the UK agricultural industry money for no good reason other than the sake of it - looks like politics to me, politics putting UK farmers behind imports which use banned pesticides.

I'll also add to this the fact that we already test our grain and get Mytoxin results - which goes on the Passports for every 29 tonne load. I guess most farmers are the same, it's done at the same time we test Protien.

Red Tractor does nothing, tests nothing, assures nothing. It's just a paper trail of mostly useless activities - I was looking today at a "Harvest Plan" left by the last assessor. TBH it was beyond laughable, I am somehow supposed to idenity when I tip a trailer where in the field it comes from, keep a testing conglomerate of the trailers in the "Heap".

Why the hell would I tip all the grain in one heap ? I know roughly what is better quality and what is lessor quality. I know what needs drying. Regardless when the trailer gets pushed up how the hell does keeping a record of where the trailer came from make any difference to anything ?

To think someone actually got paid for writing this stuff. Just goes to show they have never done the job in their lives.

 

[Humble Village Farmer]

Joe added “If a farmer wishes to sell unassured grain to a UK flour mill they would need to provide agrochemical and mycotoxin test results for at least every 200 tonne of grain drawn from the same bulk, at their own expense. This is clearly a less efficient means of providing assurance and it’s no wonder that Red Tractor is well supported by processors.”


Given Red Tractor has no baring what-so-ever on UK agricultural chemicals, chemical spay rates and crops grown & harvested.

How is this statement truthful ? It's just an arbitary decision based on what ?

The Millers need to get their facts sorted because they are costing the UK agricultural industry money for no good reason other than the sake of it - looks like politics to me, politics putting UK farmers behind imports which use banned pesticides.

It also smacks of restrictive practice. It's illegal to treat similar goods or services differently.

 

[Will Blackburn]

So for those of us who only grow feed grain WTFP.

 

[Grass And Grain]

Joe added “If a farmer wishes to sell unassured grain to a UK flour mill they would need to provide agrochemical and mycotoxin test results for at least every 200 tonne of grain drawn from the same bulk, at their own expense. This is clearly a less efficient means of providing assurance and it’s no wonder that Red Tractor is well supported by processors.”


Given Red Tractor has no baring what-so-ever on UK agricultural chemicals, chemical spay rates and crops grown & harvested.

How is this statement truthful ? It's just an arbitary decision based on what ?

The Millers need to get their facts sorted because they are costing the UK agricultural industry money for no good reason other than the sake of it - looks like politics to me, politics putting UK farmers behind imports which use banned pesticides.

I'll also add to this the fact that we already test our grain and get Mytoxin results - which goes on the Passports for every 29 tonne load. I guess most farmers are the same, it's done at the same time we test Protien.

Red Tractor does nothing, tests nothing, assures nothing. It's just a paper trail of mostly useless activities - I was looking today at a "Harvest Plan" left by the last assessor. TBH it was beyond laughable, I am somehow supposed to idenity when I tip a trailer where in the field it comes from, keep a testing conglomerate of the trailers in the "Heap".

Why the hell would I tip all the grain in one heap ? I know roughly what is better quality and what is lessor quality. I know what needs drying. Regardless when the trailer gets pushed up how the hell does keeping a record of where the trailer came from make any difference to anything ?

To think someone actually got paid for writing this stuff. Just goes to show they have never done the job in their lives.

Yes, we can provide a mycotoxin risk assessment, so that negates need to do those tests.

We've also only got UK approved pesticides available. Unlike the imports which can have pesticides not licenced here. Hence do we really need pesticide tests?

Wonder which pesticides they're testing for. Can't possibly be testing for every single one? But if they're not testing for them all, including the banned ones, then what use is the testing?

 

[Grass And Grain]

Red Tractor check a SINGLE pesticide application record, and that seems to negate need for pesticide testing.

We can send all our pesticide records to UK F Millers if they like, which is a much better than just checking one.

 

[Grass And Grain]

I don't think UK Flour Millers are going to say "no, you can't supply as per imports". They can't can they, as those protocols are accepted assurance methods, and we can equal it plus we're also within UK legislative food production framework...so already one big step ahead of the imports.

 

[stroller]

"This is clearly a less efficient means of providing assurance and it’s no wonder that Red Tractor is well supported by processors"

The only reasons it's well supported is because it's funking compulsory unless you want to loose hundreds if not thousands of pounds, if dread tractor was voluntary they would have about half a dozen members.

 

[Barleymow]

I'll include spray records ,zon m Don test results with my wheat after harvest then the millers are welcome to come and check the growing crop

 

[teslacoils]

So....the mills do full agchem screens on every 7th lorry load of imported grain?

 

[Barleymow]

So....the mills do full agchem screens on every 7th lorry load of imported grain?

Talking to truck drivers French and German wheat is delivered to certain mills before 8am. Its just weighed in

 

[T Hectares]

The first bit of the statement misses the point totally

“Contrary to the view held by some farmers, the milling industry’s use of imported wheat is not undercutting UK farmers”

Its not imported wheat undercutting UK farmers, we understand the need for high protein wheat etc, its RT that’s undercutting UK farmers

If every 200t is tested then that’s far more rigorous than RT that checks paperwork that could be faked ??
Personally I’d rather sample my grain than endure another RT audit - Writing out a “grain storage strategy” - essentially documenting that I’m going dry the wet grain and tip the dry, where on earth will this mindless banal tick box mentality ensure improved grain safety over grain that’s actually tested ??

 

[Grass And Grain]

The first bit of the statement misses the point totally

“Contrary to the view held by some farmers, the milling industry’s use of imported wheat is not undercutting UK farmers”

Its not imported wheat undercutting UK farmers, we understand the need for high protein wheat etc, its RT that’s undercutting UK farmers

If every 200t is tested then that’s far more rigorous than RT that checks paperwork that could be faked ??
Personally I’d rather sample my grain than endure another RT audit - Writing out a “grain storage strategy” - essentially documenting that I’m going dry the wet grain and tip the dry, where on earth will this mindless banal tick box mentality ensure improved grain safety over grain that’s actually tested ??

I can see us attempting to put together a group of farms, sample each one, get grain assured, then farmer sells grain in usual manner. We're a way off that yet, but there's plenty of interest.

Will let BFU members and anyone else who wants to join in.

Red Tractor and SQC have had a monopoly. We've no choice but to join, then no choice when they add more standards. It needs fragmenting up. It needs competition.

I'm intending to action it.

 

[farmerm]

Joe added “If a farmer wishes to sell unassured grain to a UK flour mill they would need to provide agrochemical and mycotoxin test results for at least every 200 tonne of grain drawn from the same bulk, at their own expense. This is clearly a less efficient means of providing assurance and it’s no wonder that Red Tractor is well supported by processors.”


Given Red Tractor has no baring what-so-ever on UK agricultural chemicals, chemical spay rates and crops grown & harvested.

How is this statement truthful ? It's just an arbitary decision based on what ?

The Millers need to get their facts sorted because they are costing the UK agricultural industry money for no good reason other than the sake of it - looks like politics to me, politics putting UK farmers behind imports which use banned pesticides.

I'll also add to this the fact that we already test our grain and get Mytoxin results - which goes on the Passports for every 29 tonne load. I guess most farmers are the same, it's done at the same time we test Protien.

Red Tractor does nothing, tests nothing, assures nothing. It's just a paper trail of mostly useless activities - I was looking today at a "Harvest Plan" left by the last assessor. TBH it was beyond laughable, I am somehow supposed to idenity when I tip a trailer where in the field it comes from, keep a testing conglomerate of the trailers in the "Heap".

Why the hell would I tip all the grain in one heap ? I know roughly what is better quality and what is lessor quality. I know what needs drying. Regardless when the trailer gets pushed up how the hell does keeping a record of where the trailer came from make any difference to anything ?

To think someone actually got paid for writing this stuff. Just goes to show they have never done the job in their lives.

Why would we need to produce mycotoxin and residue testing for every 200 tonnes? I don’t believe for a minute that is what happens with imports. Testing is done using a “risk based approach” is it not??

 

[ollie989898]

A full screen for contaminants and mycotoxins wouldn't be a lot of money, ring up Sciantec and ask. They've gone and let the horse out with this kind of public statement if this is genuine. I used to send raw material samples off and they won't be crazy expensive to have done. Just put the samples in the post.

Provided you follow standard agchem application legislation (basically what the label states), you will have zero issue. In fact, I would argue that doing this would give enhanced protection of the food chain compared to anything RT presently do as your average RT inspector wouldn't know jack about agrochemicals or mycotoxins. Mycotoxins are just as real a danger in imported feedstuffs that have been sat in a ship for 2 months as they would be in dry marketable quality grain.

 

[farmerm]

So....the mills do full agchem screens on every 7th lorry load of imported grain?

 

[ollie989898]

So....the mills do full agchem screens on every 7th lorry load of imported grain?

Of course they don't. If you want to box clever, someone write to Hovis and ask them how regularly they are testing flour before bagging and screening for mycotoxin and contaminants?

 

[Grass And Grain]

So....the mills do full agchem screens on every 7th lorry load of imported grain?

Of course they don't. If you want to box clever, someone write to Hovis and ask them how regularly they are testing flour before bagging and screening for mycotoxin and contaminants?

Suppose each mill has their own rules, although smaller mills won't have any choice. 60+k tonnes on boat from Canada, you can have 2,000t, but it's on our terms, we'll provide you with ONE set of lab results.

EFISC-GTP allows imports to go straight to the mill without any assurance type lab test results. As long as mill has it's own sampling spear and then they can choose to lab test for whichever parameters they like.

 

[Cowcorn]

"This is clearly a less efficient means of providing assurance and it’s no wonder that Red Tractor is well supported by processors"

The only reasons it's well supported is because it's funking compulsory unless you want to loose hundreds if not thousands of pounds, if dread tractor was voluntary they would have about half a dozen members.

I had my origin green / Bord Bia assurance inspection today ....
The chicken shite train has a few extra carages added since the last time .
The audit was three months overdue as i had been kicking the can down the road in sympathy with the brothers over the pond labouring under the red tractor yoke and with sheer bloody mind as i really cant see the point....
Last week the milk purchaser rang and informed me that unless i rejoined this " voluntary scheme " then my milk wouldnt be collected ..
So there you have it the assurance stasi have me over a barrel .
The red tractor model is been adopted it seems with the co - operation of the co - ops and the silence of the IFA
Oh why the fucck didnt we all wise up years ago and strangle the assurance baastard at birth before it grew up to dominate us without as much as a shred of proof of monetary benefit for our produce ???
T

 

[farmerm]

Suppose each mill has their own rules, although smaller mills won't have any choice. 60+k tonnes on boat from Canada, you can have 2,000t, but it's on our terms, we'll provide you with ONE set of lab results.

EFISC-GTP allows imports to go straight to the mill without any assurance type lab test results. As long as mill has it's own sampling spear and then they can choose to lab test for whichever parameters they like.

Tests the mill pays for and a pile of grain headache for the mill should the sample fail any such test