- Location
- Quebec, Canada
That’s a great idea, putting next years chart over this years and planning to alter the rotation around the farm.
"Improving Our Lot" - Planned Holistic Grazing, for starters..
- Thread starter Kiwi Pete
- Start date
exmoor dave
Member
- Location
- exmoor, uk
In this case, the previous management was early lambing, so alot of grazing January- through to may, no real prior rest to lambing,
No fert (although that might not be a bad thing), but there would have been reasonable inputs via creep feeders.
The soil test results were very good though
We'll almost certainly take a short cut to where we want to be, by putting a brassica in then reseed with a diverse sward
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- Location
- Quebec, Canada
Good questions.After posting my questions and seeing your and Pete’s reply I think that the only value of a grazing chart is as a road map and diary. Not too much analysis can be derived from it- I’ve tried without success, as the variables from year to year are too great.I am reluctant to throw out the last 4 years’ charts though, but then again I am reluctant to throw out anything farm related- I always seem to need it a week or two later
- Location
- Owaka, New Zealand
If the rotation/direction works for you, keep it!
But try to mix up key stuff, like where your lambs are born and where your cows are while they're bulling, these things are examples of what change your animal impact so it's nice to share that around.
I'm always surprised what happens when there's a heifer on, looks like another 50 cattle came over for a party by the morning.
(Some people always lamb in the same paddock and that's what the lamb problem is)
- Location
- Cei newydd
Agree with you about motivation to go and plate meter, we've got one as part of a grasscheck Gb project.Thanks Pete
That's a couple of great analogies and explanations.
I got a platemeter on a grant scheme and to be honest find it very hard to get motivated to use it, I did do the whole farm in preparation for our last grazing group meeting..... took me the whole day to walk the main farm..... Jen broke her ankle on the morning of the meeting, so didn't make the meeting..... @Samcowman and @exmoor tom eat my cake at the meeting
It was good to get a 'farm cover', but to be honest the best bit was just being forced to get out and walk the whole place and just look at what's there- obviously the amount of grass, but also state of recovery, species, weed burden, deer and rabbit losses!
All stuff I just don't see from the seat of the bike.
Think a reasonably good example of the limitations of platemeter thinking, is a new field we are grazing, the sward is very highly creeping Bent (browntop to you?), very dense sward, the plate meter would probs say 2000, plenty of cover, but the stock simply don't like it, the sheep will graze it down so far, the cows on the previous round were very unhappy (I noticed in other fields with more mixed swards that the cattle eat around the c.bent)
Now..... grazing chart on the other handstarted one in September, very useful!
We have to mesure weekly, id rather just go for a walk, but if i didn't have to go id probably go and do something else.
Fenwick
Member
- Location
- Bretagne France
Good questions.After posting my questions and seeing your and Pete’s reply I think that the only value of a grazing chart is as a road map and diary. Not too much analysis can be derived from it- I’ve tried without success, as the variables from year to year are too great.I am reluctant to throw out the last 4 years’ charts though, but then again I am reluctant to throw out anything farm related- I always seem to need it a week or two later
It can give you an Idea of pasture production in terms of animal days/hectare. Which may thén help with décision making.
It also helps you better understand thé évolution of rotation times through out thé year.
I liké my grazing plan very much, and it has already helped me make management décisions for next year.
- Location
- Cei newydd
We lamb in the same fields because of good shelter in them, no lamb problem that im aware of. Works well for humans and sheep
but not the grass maybe?
I have been thinking to change them but haven't convinced my sheperdess yet.
- Location
- Owaka, New Zealand
I think it's one of grass-farming's "best kept secrets" after using them a bit, then using it as the main
guideline. Not even just for the grass, we always have the cattle near the yard at the start of the month so the stock agent can keep his dirty boots in the car and see the cattle in his shoes.
He said, "it's like you plan to keep me happy", well maybe I see that as part of my job!
What you say is dead true, I guess why I don't worry about the grazing days per hectare is due to my paddocks changing so much as well. We had over 800 paddocks over winter just for one mob and 150 for the other.. however you get a good memory and feel if you even consider that measure. All our poor spots get stocked overnight to hopefully boost them up.
- Location
- Essex
Is that so you get more dung on there?
- Location
- Owaka, New Zealand
Yes, the idea is they get about 900m² early morning, then 3-4 x 400m² cells through the day so they're bursting full, then onto 400m2 on a hillside overnight.
It roughly means that they get ¼ of a hectare per 24 hours but 60% of their crap ends up on ⅙th their daily area, and I choose where that is.
@GC74 here's that prairie grass mix
might buzz the top off it soon so it can be closed up to flower.
- Location
- Derbyshire UK
Any tips on getting a grazing plan started? Never been that keen on the idea, but maybe that's a reflection of where my grazing management is at the moment i.e. potential for improvement!
I'm quite impressed with the way that looks is that bit of chickory i spy in there too?
- Location
- Owaka, New Zealand
Yes, I put quite a bit of chicory and various clovers in there. Plantain is just wild from being broadcast and let to go to seed in the paddock next door, and shipped in via animals.
I drilled about 2kg/ha chicory from memory, because it will be in the middle of my techno lanes I wanted it to have a bit of different stuff for them to spread along.
But yes, it's quite a hearty paddock this one now, the new grass is about level with the bottom of the Ranger's door and the old grass in the fenceline is about 2 inches!
JohnGalway
Member
- Location
- Connemara, Ireland
So this thread has gone from grazing plans are sh1t to grazing plans are fab in less than a year
- Location
- Owaka, New Zealand
There are probably far better people than myself to teach you the concepts. Basically your grazing plan is everything that your feed budget is not - it's planning your ideal migrations around your farm.
Work out and jot down a flow chart for a start, is how I tackled it.
Some paddocks and gateways are much better used in one direction, we have several of those where you're farting against thunder to get stock to go out the gate and a certain way - so change that into a positive by ironing those kinks first. You want to work with nature!
Ours has developed from a beginning as a record of our grazing to a plan for our grazing - because I want to learn everything the hard way I just got the charts online and got the pencils out; filled in where the stock had been for a couple of months and then I could "get that visual on it"
The visual still says we graze too often but we're easing it out slowly, no point having it look like a jungle until we can manage a jungle properly!
Other than that, you can see each paddock on ours is grazed about a month to 7 weeks apart through the year, which demonstrates just how mild it is here - and how our floating stocking rate matches things up a little more.
The plan ahead is that we'll slow to about 60 then 80 then 120 days between grazings, but it looks alot like I will need to buy some cattle as opposed to finding any grazing in the short-term. If we get some cheap enough, then we can afford to flick them on if grazing suddenly looks likely.
A small profit is still better than incurring the cost of harvesting grass to keep it growing, in the meantime we'll just let the grass come up a bit
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Rod Dumbreck
Member
I have one on a spreadsheet, and Mrs D keeps one on a chart! (Don't ask) Its easier than you would imagine, and for me the advantage is I can shuffle the fields in the order we are going to graze in, to help with visualising where to put fences up.
- Location
- Quebec, Canada
I’ve been using one for 4 years and it has been a game changer. I downloaded mine from Troy Bishopp on ‘On Pasture’So this thread has gone from grazing plans are sh1t to grazing plans are fab in less than a year
- Location
- Quebec, Canada
I had the same experience as you- at first I used the chart to record what had happened but then realised that it was much more valuable as a tool to plan for what needs to happen and where. If I have any outside commitments and need to be away for any lenghth of time, I plan for the animals to be in an easy to reach, not-much-chance-of-an-escape location and leave instructions for moving them. But I plan this long in advance , factoring in these requirements, and structure my rotation accordingly , to arrive where and when I need them to be. Also, if an area has been abused for whatever reason, I can block off that paddock on my chart, so that when I am planning my next move I know to stay away, while if I was just looking at it I might say to myself , ‘well its probably been a long enough rest, it looks pretty good, I think I’ll let the stock in’.
Looking at your charts Pete I see that the months are broken down into weeks, not days. On my chart I have a box for each day and I have room to mark down that I have had one or two moves that day. I find it is a much more detailed document than yours. What do you think are the advantages of your charts ?
JohnGalway
Member
- Location
- Connemara, Ireland
I just started listening to the "In Search Of Soil" podcast with Diego Footer, episode one is with Dr Elaine Ingham and it's bloody interesting. Dr Ingham is a name I've often heard but I didn't know much about her so I even listened to the podcast twice today as I was driving and working.
There is mention of a course in the podcast, so I said I'd look it up while I was sitting on a rock taking a break from fencing. Well I nearly fell off my rock, $5,000 for the course! I've no doubt she knows what she's talking about but that's out of sight for most people.
There is mention of a course in the podcast, so I said I'd look it up while I was sitting on a rock taking a break from fencing. Well I nearly fell off my rock, $5,000 for the course! I've no doubt she knows what she's talking about but that's out of sight for most people.
Crikey there's definitely money in farming.
To me paying money like that to go on courses is still a input & it's still about selling you something, as in selling the idea to you & hopefully you go on more courses.
I'll stick to this thread as part of my self development