Beet growers have a neonic seed treatment for 2021

Flat 10 · Jan 11, 2021

Daniel said:
https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1347956734955024385
.

Some of the activists on twitter are getting themselves into a right tizzy. This guy is particularly hard of thinking.

I’m not reading it because it will make me angry but the general answer to this comes from Tina barsby chief exec Niab.
“Let us not fool ourselves- to feed a global population which is increasing by about 83m pa, we need to produce food intensively and sustainably. There never was an agricultural idyll and the good old days never really existed- they were always more about extreme poverty, subsistence farming and survival.” It’s a very good piece.

Sonoftheheir · Jan 11, 2021

Glad Defra have felt it necessary and have even bothered to reply, BUT!

that’s a funny looking crop of beet??!!

teslacoils · Jan 11, 2021

Bogweevil said:
prohibition on any flowering crop being planted in the same field where the product has been used within 22 months of sugar beet

I still find this term quite ambiguous. Has it been clarified what the powers that be will say is flowering Vs non flowering? Or are you all going to be grasping the beet seed with both hands, only to be told you can't plant any crops after?

robbie · Jan 11, 2021

teslacoils said:
I still find this term quite ambiguous. Has it been clarified what the powers that be will say is flowering Vs non flowering? Or are you all going to be grasping the beet seed with both hands, only to be told you can't plant any crops after?

Very good point

Hindsight · Jan 11, 2021

teslacoils said:
I still find this term quite ambiguous. Has it been clarified what the powers that be will say is flowering Vs non flowering? Or are you all going to be grasping the beet seed with both hands, only to be told you can't plant any crops after?

As I understand yes and there will be a definitive explanation later probably through offices of BBRO.

Daniel · Jan 11, 2021

teslacoils said:
I still find this term quite ambiguous. Has it been clarified what the powers that be will say is flowering Vs non flowering? Or are you all going to be grasping the beet seed with both hands, only to be told you can't plant any crops after?

On today's British Sugar email.

Breakthru · Jan 11, 2021

Sonoftheheir said:
Well I replied on Facebook (in reply to the Guardian story) what do you think?

We don’t want to have to use chemicals at all, especially anything that harms pollinators, but these aphid spread virus’s have cut our yields by half. The alternative was to spray insecticide up to 3 times across the whole field and kill any insects that happened to be in the field at the time. The Neonic seed coating is specifically targeted at the aphids when they feed on the crop. The link to killing bees is very tenuous, as sugar beet don’t flower and no actual research has been done on bees that feed near sugar beet fields. In the article it states that 11 Europe countries had already granted derogations to their farmers (including France) in this instance we would have been at a great disadvantage if a derogation had not been granted. Sainsbury’s for one imports many tons of French granulated sugar. The alternative could be to import cane sugar, I have no idea what chemicals they use, but I would hazard to guess that they use what ever is necessary to produce a crop to sell. We are hoping that a sugar beet can be bred (not GM) that is virus resistant, I believe the breeders are getting very close to this. Please (if you have time) read the statement from HMGov stating why the limited derogation has been granted -

Neonicotinoid product as seed treatment for sugar beet: emergency authorisation application 2024

The Minister for Food, Farming and Fisheries grants conditional emergency authorisation to use a product containing a neonicotinoid to treat seeds for the 2024 sugar beet seed crop in England.

www.gov.uk

Excellent and now EU free we can gene edit in some resistance.

Bogweevil · Jan 11, 2021

Sonoftheheir said:
Glad Defra have felt it necessary and have even bothered to reply, BUT!

that’s a funny looking crop of beet??!!

That would be gene-editing I suppose

Hindsight · Jan 12, 2021

Sonoftheheir · Jan 12, 2021

Hopefully they’ll ignore it

Daniel · Jan 13, 2021

Don't they reckon it will take 3 years to breed a solution to the aphid problem? Can't remember where I saw that.

Unfortunately I'd be very surprised if we get more than one years derogation on neonics given the backlash.

There have even been farmers putting the boot in, naturally this chap doesn't actually grow beet himself, but neither should anyone else apparently.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1349039046631313409

Bogweevil · Jan 13, 2021

robbie said:
Would it work if fodder beet was mixed with sugar beet seed, if an aphid landed on a fodder beet it could infect it but if it was planted next to a cruiser treated sugar beet it would succumb as soon as it migrated, preventing too much damage.

Yes, that would work, used to be able to get treated dummy brassica seed, from Holland where treatment authorized, to drill with untreated crop seed - loophole now closed.

yellow belly · Jan 13, 2021

we need to educate the anti neonic brigade that we are not saving a single bee by not using neo nic seed dressing

the lack of neo nics
has reduced the area of flowering crops oilseed rape area is down half a million acres enough for 250000 hives of bees

the remaining osr and sugar beet is now sprayed with inscecticide 1 million acres more spray

we now import millions of litres more soya oil and palm oil because we cannot grow it in the uk

we will import more sugar from countries which use neonics france and the eu

Sonoftheheir · Jan 13, 2021

Daniel said:
Don't they reckon it will take 3 years to breed a solution to the aphid problem? Can't remember where I saw that.

Unfortunately I'd be very surprised if we get more than one years derogation on neonics given the backlash.

There have even been farmers putting the boot in, naturally this chap doesn't actually grow beet himself, but neither should anyone else apparently.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1349039046631313409

With the track record of this Government I can see another U turn ahead, either that or a lean on Rothamsted for the threshold not to be met.

I should imagine the petition is over 150k signed this morning, I mean if you had no idea about the reasons behind the derogation why wouldn’t you sign it? No one wants all the bees to die.

Sonoftheheir · Jan 13, 2021

yellow belly said:
we need to educate the anti neonic brigade that we are not saving a single bee by not using neo nic seed dressing

the lack of neo nics
has reduced the area of flowering crops oilseed rape area is down half a million acres enough for 250000 hives of bees

the remaining osr and sugar beet is now sprayed with inscecticide 1 million acres more spray

we now import millions of litres more soya oil and palm oil because we cannot grow it in the uk

we will import more sugar from countries which use neonics france and the eu

Shame there is no way of reply on the petition.

Hindsight · Jan 13, 2021

Daniel said:
Don't they reckon it will take 3 years to breed a solution to the aphid problem? Can't remember where I saw that.

Unfortunately I'd be very surprised if we get more than one years derogation on neonics given the backlash.

There have even been farmers putting the boot in, naturally this chap doesn't actually grow beet himself, but neither should anyone else apparently.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1349039046631313409

Beet yellows is a complex of three viruses. The genetics complex. Possibly 3 to four years for genetic resistance to BYV I think it is that one but doubt reliable resistance to all three viruses in a commercially acceptable variety.

robbie · Jan 13, 2021

yellow belly said:
we need to educate the anti neonic brigade that we are not saving a single bee by not using neo nic seed dressing

the lack of neo nics
has reduced the area of flowering crops oilseed rape area is down half a million acres enough for 250000 hives of bees

the remaining osr and sugar beet is now sprayed with inscecticide 1 million acres more spray

we now import millions of litres more soya oil and palm oil because we cannot grow it in the uk

we will import more sugar from countries which use neonics france and the eu

This is exactly the sort of thing our representatives need to be shouting from the roof tops. But as usual I haven't heard much from them, suprise suprise.

Hindsight · Jan 13, 2021

yellow belly said:
we need to educate the anti neonic brigade that we are not saving a single bee by not using neo nic seed dressing

the lack of neo nics
has reduced the area of flowering crops oilseed rape area is down half a million acres enough for 250000 hives of bees

the remaining osr and sugar beet is now sprayed with inscecticide 1 million acres more spray

we now import millions of litres more soya oil and palm oil because we cannot grow it in the uk

we will import more sugar from countries which use neonics france and the eu

YB. For the first time I have ventured onto Twitter. Fascinating. You can take a horse to water but not make it drink is the answer I fear to you idea to educate the anti neonic brigade.

Going to be more difficult if the Labour Party have decided to politicize the issue and take a negative stance. I now consider that neonics have gone and that is it. Ah well.

farmerfred86 · Jan 13, 2021

Im amazed how many farmers think 'more folia sprays' is a good argument against the ban. Those lobbying against neonics would be delighted to ban all pesticides without a single thought further.

I am conflicted because the half life of these products is very long however they are non lethal to pests after 12 weeks (at the higher rate). Therefore they are unlikely to be harmful to bees or anything else. I accept that field margins are an issue but don't see this area nationally to be large enough of concern.

I also feel I am going to be forced to grow next years crop (final 3yr deal) without adequate protection because we are now governed by media, knowing the crop will make a loss before its even planted!

Hindsight · Jan 13, 2021

farmerfred86 said:
Im amazed how many farmers think 'more folia sprays' is a good argument against the ban. Those lobbying against neonics would be delighted to ban all pesticides without a single thought further.

I am conflicted because the half life of these products is very long however they are non lethal to pests after 12 weeks (at the higher rate). Therefore they are unlikely to be harmful to bees or anything else. I accept that field margins are an issue but don't see this area nationally to be large enough of concern.

I also feel I am going to be forced to grow next years crop (final 3yr deal) without adequate protection because we are now governed by media, knowing the crop will make a loss before its even planted!

Concur. I have ventured onto Twitter for the first and possibly last time to make posts. Once my daughter explained what to do! Most odd form of communication. Anyway I have asked in my posts what about imports from countries using neonics and the morals of us all exporting our environmental issues. Judging by a reply or two that is irrelevant. Ah well.

Beet growers have a neonic seed treatment for 2021

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100% I’ve had enough of farming!

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