The Red Tractor ACCS referendum

homefarm · Jan 30, 2021

An Gof said:
You want to pay Christine Tacon £100k
I have no doubt that, as normal practice, the Chair will have the casting vote.

NO but I presume you agree will the first line.

I wish NFU had set up red tractor so farmers had at least a 50% share of the votes then when there was a farmer chairman thing could go our way.

Grass And Grain · Jan 30, 2021

Humble Village Farmer said:
Good bit of investigation, well done. I doubt anyone else was going to tell us.

Took a bit of finding. To me, it seemed to be deliberately burried so it was difficult to find.

But now we've found it, we've got a chance of breaking it. It's the document that ties all the assurance industry together into the web that means all the different parts of the agriculture and supply industry effectively need to be assured to have any hope of getting customers and operating their businesses.

I think it might be possible to force AIC to change the rules.

Henarar · Jan 30, 2021

An Gof said:
Hearing the President speak this last week I am in no doubt of how she wants to drive the NFU response.

didn't see that but she would have us asking RT if we can dump under hedge or not

ploughman1963 · Jan 30, 2021

Clive said:
ok then

how about we start a “go fund me” campaign to fund paying a specialist competition lawyer to look into this discrimination for us ?

we only take peoples money if we het enough to get the lawyer ?

who would contribute ?

anyone want to look into who the best specialist council is ? and see what they would charge ?

45 minutes after your post, am I the only person to say I will put my hand in my pocket? I guess several will have posted private messages of support but we arent exactly putting forward a united front?

An Gof · Jan 30, 2021

Henarar said:
right in as much as you are mistaken or right in the fact it don't matter one bit what I say ?

Sorry, my sense of humour replying to your sense of humour/sarcasm.
At the end of the day what you or I think won’t change the NFU view ........

BUT I have never seen so many NFU members so incensed on an issue as they are with RT. There are many long standing members who have held high position who are VERY unhappy with the RT proposals. I think NFU have been caught out by the strength of feeling and how widespread it is. Will it be properly acknowledged in the NFU reply to the consultation on our behalf ....... I’m not holding my breathe. But ALL members who feel this way MUST keep on and on to their representatives at all levels and speak out so that there is no misunderstanding of the strength of feeling.

Sid · Jan 30, 2021

Clive said:
if you are expect to say what your employer want you to vs what you really believe yourself then yes you have been bought

i honestly don’t believe Guy really thinks what he says on this - I’ve met him and he’s not a fool

They are NOT your employer but you get renumeration for sitting on a board.
You are their for your skills and viewpoint.

You may disagree with the majority but the agreed viewpoint is the official board line.

Its some what different to a wholey business board as you would know.
Your not "bought".

I never have been or will be.
Always spoke out for what I believe in and never afraid to.

Henarar · Jan 30, 2021

An Gof said:
Sorry, my sense of humour replying to your sense of humour/sarcasm.
At the end of the day what you or I think won’t change the NFU view ........

BUT I have never seen so many NFU members so incensed on an issue as they are with RT. There are many long standing members who have held high position who are VERY unhappy with the RT proposals. I think NFU have been caught out by the strength of feeling and how widespread it is. Will it be properly acknowledged in the NFU reply to the consultation on our behalf ....... I’m not holding my breathe. But ALL members who feel this way MUST keep on and on to their representatives at all levels and speak out so that there is no misunderstanding of the strength of feeling.

it could work, MB was all for WLA back a few years ago but that didn't happen
well not yet anyway

tullah · Jan 30, 2021

[

ploughman1963 said:
45 minutes after your post, am I the only person to say I will put my hand in my pocket? I guess several will have posted private messages of support but we arent exactly putting forward a united front?

With you. Count me in. A few annual subs would go a long way.

MrNoo · Jan 30, 2021

ploughman1963 said:
45 minutes after your post, am I the only person to say I will put my hand in my pocket? I guess several will have posted private messages of support but we arent exactly putting forward a united front?

I'm game, just tell me where and who to make payable to

An Gof · Jan 30, 2021

Henarar said:
it could work, MB was all for WLA back a few years ago but that didn't happen
well not yet anyway

Be warned, WLA is a long way from dead in the water.

Henarar · Jan 30, 2021

An Gof said:
Be warned, WLA is a long way from dead in the water.

I know as I said back along on this thread

Grass And Grain · Jan 30, 2021

Clive said:
ok then

how about we start a “go fund me” campaign to fund paying a specialist competition lawyer to look into this discrimination for us ?

we only take peoples money if we het enough to get the lawyer ?

who would contribute ?

anyone want to look into who the best specialist council is ? and see what they would charge ?

ploughman1963 said:
45 minutes after your post, am I the only person to say I will put my hand in my pocket? I guess several will have posted private messages of support but we arent exactly putting forward a united front?

tullah said:
[

With you. Count me in. A few annual subs would go a long way.

MrNoo said:
I'm game, just tell me where and who to make payable to

Let's decide on the best course of action.

Option 1.
Confront AIC directly, point out the strange rules and the discrimination (just my own view to use the word discrimination) between rules for UK farmer suppliers vs rest of world suppliers. See what they say.

Option 2.
As per Clive's suggestion, crowd fund a couple of hours from the right legal advisor. Would need to find the right person.

Option 3.
Go straight to CMA, as I suspect that might be the area of law that is applicable. It's totally free to submit information to CMA, they investigate and make a decision.

Option 4.
We're wasting our time. Go home and forget about it.

I don't like option 4, and think there is a strong case.

I've got £200 for the pot (if we need one), but even a pledge of £10 would help.

I think option 1, moving on up to option 3 if AIC are not cooperative. Companies can be fined 10% of global turnover, which is a lot for a big mill or crusher, and a big deterrent from going as far as getting a CMA ruling.

SilliamWhale · Jan 30, 2021

Clive said:
ok then

how about we start a “go fund me” campaign to fund paying a specialist competition lawyer to look into this discrimination for us ?

we only take peoples money if we het enough to get the lawyer ?

who would contribute ?

anyone want to look into who the best specialist council is ? and see what they would charge ?

I would definitely contribute. £300

I've long felt the way they operate is immoral and wrong

theboytheboy · Jan 30, 2021

Clive said:
ok then

how about we start a “go fund me” campaign to fund paying a specialist competition lawyer to look into this discrimination for us ?

we only take peoples money if we het enough to get the lawyer ?

who would contribute ?

anyone want to look into who the best specialist council is ? and see what they would charge ?

I would contribute and I don't even have anything arable anymore.

Grass And Grain · Jan 30, 2021

theboytheboy said:
I would contribute and I don't even have anything arable anymore.

That really made me laugh. People detest it that much!

Humble Village Farmer · Jan 30, 2021

Grass And Grain said:
Took a bit of finding. To me, it seemed to be deliberately burried so it was difficult to find.

But now we've found it, we've got a chance of breaking it. It's the document that ties all the assurance industry together into the web that means all the different parts of the agriculture and supply industry effectively need to be assured to have any hope of getting customers and operating their businesses.

I think it might be possible to force AIC to change the rules.

Or slacken their grip on the money pipe..

texelburger · Jan 30, 2021

Clive said:
ok then

how about we start a “go fund me” campaign to fund paying a specialist competition lawyer to look into this discrimination for us ?

we only take peoples money if we het enough to get the lawyer ?

who would contribute ?

anyone want to look into who the best specialist council is ? and see what they would charge ?

How about forming a new union with a sub,it would then raise the funds and give us membership for the investment.TFU.........The Farming Union.I would become a member.

Grass And Grain · Jan 30, 2021

Humble Village Farmer said:
Or slacken their grip on the money pipe..

Yes, if we were to all leave RT, then no choice but to buy non-assured. It's just getting everyone together.

My membership is due, but I'm holding off paying if I can.

It's slightly tricky because we all have different start dates. Although i guess we could all rescind our membership at the same time. Just meed a strong union who's top brass don't take the RT shilling.

Humble Village Farmer · Jan 30, 2021

Grass And Grain said:
Let's decide on the best course of action.

Option 1.
Confront AIC directly, point out the strange rules and the discrimination (just my own view to use the word discrimination) between rules for UK farmer suppliers vs rest of world suppliers. See what they say.

Option 2.
As per Clive's suggestion, crowd fund a couple of hours from the right legal advisor. Would need to find the right person.

Option 3.
Go straight to CMA, as I suspect that might be the area of law that is applicable. It's totally free to submit information to CMA, they investigate and make a decision.

Option 4.
We're wasting our time. Go home and forget about it.

I don't like option 4, and think there is a strong case.

I've got £200 for the pot (if we need one), but even a pledge of £10 would help.

I think option 1, moving on up to option 3 if AIC are not cooperative. Companies can be fined 10% of global turnover, which is a lot for a big mill or crusher, and a big deterrent from going as far as getting a CMA ruling.

Option 3 is the first thing to do as it will be free.

After that we need to get a quote from the right person in option 2 and see who's in and divide by the number of backers (I'm in) before we instruct. If it's too much we can get a few more backers.

theboytheboy · Jan 30, 2021

Grass And Grain said:
That really made me laugh. People detest it that much!

I feel that seeing progress on this issue could be a catalyst for change elsewhere in agriculture. If a group of farmers can work together on one issue it will show it can be done and it may snowball into other areas.

I'm no longer a "real" farmer in my eyes, red tractor makes no difference to me anymore.

But if we all looked at the bigger picture and got behind this for starters, it could be that the next issue will be one that does make a difference to me or someone else who is currently not affected by RT.

The Red Tractor ACCS referendum

Would you leave or remain a Red Tractor ACCS member ?

Yes, I would resign my Red Tractor (ACCS) membership and join a new "equal to imports" Scheme

No, I would remain in the Red Tractor scheme

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

0 %

Up to 25%

25-50%

50-75%

75-100%

100% I’ve had enough of farming!

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