What Will Be The Turning Point?

Derrick Hughes · Sep 26, 2021

A good test would be whats on your mind for next year
Apart from Cycling
Ditch Cleaning Fencing Hedge Management , Getting more lime on , improving pastures , more reseeding ,

Highland Mule · Sep 26, 2021

Top Tip. said:
Up here in the hills of the north I’m afraid that rewilding is an unstoppable force. Report in the paper yesterday that a local estate has been sold. 3000 acres of heather moor for £7.5 million bought by Sta ndard Life. I can only imagine that this will be to facilitate carbon trading of some description.

Which one is that @Top Tip. ? Not seen any paper this last while (they’ve stopped delivering).

Sharpy · Sep 26, 2021

toquark said:
I find it baffling that the Scottish government whinges on about the concentration of land ownership in too few hands whilst simultaneously encouraging institutional buyers to plant family farms!

That is a seriously relevant point, thank you for pointing it out.

Derrick Hughes · Sep 26, 2021

Sharpy said:
That is a seriously relevant point, thank you for pointing it out.

If you sold your farm would you sell it to someone like that ,i expect i will have to sell one day , ive already decided whos buying it and told them

Tarw Coch · Sep 26, 2021

Derrick Hughes said:
If you sold your farm would you sell it to someone like that ,i expect i will have to sell one day , ive already decided whos buying it and told them

What if they only offer you a quid

hoff135 · Sep 26, 2021

Highland Mule said:
Which one is that @Top Tip. ? Not seen any paper this last while (they’ve stopped delivering).

Heard Cambusmore estate at dornoch has been sold to a group of investors for carbon capture. 18m was the figure I heard

Al R · Sep 26, 2021

Derrick Hughes said:
If you sold your farm would you sell it to someone like that ,i expect i will have to sell one day , ive already decided whos buying it and told them

Similar happened here, first refusal, gave the offer they wanted until a valuer turned up and said split it into 7 lots, went for well over double what it was realistically worth…

delilah · Sep 26, 2021

egbert said:
WTF?
I read Franks post as a lament for what he sees as the erosion of a complex and useful(nay, essential) industry.

Then I apologise, I read it as a post asking the question 'What will be the turning point ?', and as such seeking answers. If I had known it was just another whingefest I would have kept quiet.

warksfarmer said:
In some areas there is zero call for farmers markets.

Agreed, anywhere populated mainly by farmers would be a waste of time. It only angers me slightly that farmers find it necessary to smirk at fellow farmers selling direct and steadfastly refuse to support them. The bit that angers me hugely is the way that farmers constantly look for any opportunity to put the boot in to the one sector of society that seeks to support farmers; members of environmental organisations.

Agrivator said:
From what I've seen of farmers' markets, two folk take a van and produce, and spend the whole day going there and setting up and waiting for customers, and seem pleased when the day's takings get to about £600.

It's probably the most inefficient form of producer/retailing.

Whilst not being party to their accounts, I would say that of all the farming businesses in this parish the ones that are best equipped to survive post-BPS are those who sell direct, so it can't be that inefficient. The ones set to suffer the most are the 'proper' farmers.

egbert · Sep 26, 2021

delilah said:
Then I apologise, I read it as a post asking the question 'What will be the turning point ?', and as such seeking answers. If I had known it was just another whingefest I would have kept quiet.

Agreed, anywhere populated mainly by farmers would be a waste of time. It only angers me slightly that farmers find it necessary to smirk at fellow farmers selling direct and steadfastly refuse to support them. The bit that angers me hugely is the way that farmers constantly look for any opportunity to put the boot in to the one sector of society that seeks to support farmers; members of environmental organisations.

Whilst not being party to their accounts, I would say that of all the farming businesses in this parish the ones that are best equipped to survive post-BPS are those who sell direct, so it can't be that inefficient. The ones set to suffer the most are the 'proper' farmers.

why would we want to hold hands with them? (members of environmental organisations)
They seem to be an endless supply of whiners about how we're doing it wrong, and how much better it'd be if we XYZ, while munching on avocadoes/soya/almonds.

I don't understand why 'environmental' groups are all so blessed loved-up lefties.
Look at the green party....
The grim reality is that to survive, we'll (nationally) be making some pretty brutal choices, and holding hands round the fire singing kumbaya will cut no mustard with Putin/China/whoever else wants to do as they please or have us over.
It won't stop the flood of refugees who want to come here.
It won't stop the facet of human nature that involves waging war on each other.

Stuff em. I'll take em seriously when they take the blinkers off.

Top Tip. · Sep 26, 2021

Highland Mule said:
Which one is that @Top Tip. ? Not seen any paper this last while (they’ve stopped delivering).

Ralia down at Newtonmore

delilah · Sep 26, 2021

egbert said:
why would we want to hold hands with them? (members of environmental organisations)

Because they are on your side.
Because they have something that UK ag doesn't have: A mandate.
https://www.sustainweb.org/membership/
As I have said before, there is no point farmers putting their wagons in a circle, you don't have enough wagons.

egbert · Sep 26, 2021

delilah said:
Because they are on your side.
Because they have something that UK ag doesn't have: A mandate.
https://www.sustainweb.org/membership/
As I have said before, there is no point farmers putting their wagons in a circle, you don't have enough wagons.

they're on my side?
How come so many of em carp on about veganism?
Why do so many swear blind we can rewild whole chunks of the UK and it'll make the nasty carbon go away?

Looking at your link, it seems to be a list of organisations I wouldn't want around me.

And in case you hadn't noticed, our side of the (tiny) ring of wagons will be very well provisioned, and obligingly used to, er, doing whatever we have to, to rub along.

They've poked me in the eye too long now.
I'd warn them, as someone else did earlier, 'be careful what you wish for', but they wouldn't begin to understand what that meant.

Go and chat with them D, you and I seem to have little in common.

Jackov Altraids · Sep 26, 2021

delilah said:
Because they are on your side.
Because they have something that UK ag doesn't have: A mandate.
https://www.sustainweb.org/membership/
As I have said before, there is no point farmers putting their wagons in a circle, you don't have enough wagons.

I do think there is some sense to what your saying but you certainly wouldn't think that "Eating Better" is on 'your side'!!!

Eating Better

Eating Better is a UK-based civil society alliance that is working together to help people move towards eating less meat and dairy foods and more food that’s better for us and the planet, as part of the vital task of creating sustainable food and farming systems

We certainly do need to work with the people that actually care about food and the environment.

livestock 1 · Sep 26, 2021

If we go back to @frank-the-Wools point made I think a lot of it is economics. The land we farm was originally farmed by seven full time people. Now there’s my son the wife and myself plus a few contractors doing some tractor work. Probably the true number of original staff was actually more as there’s rented land to add to that. There’s no way that seven staff could be paid out of the business. Much land round about is farmed in a very low input manner no fert no spray not much grazing. Bps and stewardship has been the main income from much land and who could blame people. Suckler cows weren’t paying in the 90’s sheep weren’t very exciting livestock enterprises were looked upon as a draw on the handouts. Trouble is now the ones who have de stocked have poor producing farms and stock is now dear to get into. Those of us who are left with the stock numbers will hopefully continue to trade in favourable economic conditions. Bigger farms have continued to take on more land wether it being bought or rented. Those who dared to buy in the past have made money on paper with increased collateral add some decent accounts and there’s no limit what can be done as long as you don’t wear your body and mind out in the process. Banking and taxation have a fair bit do with progress and steer folks wanting to increase the size of a business. The way it steers you is to do more or better each year or both.
Sometimes folks just follow the trend as there’s often not much option

serf · Sep 26, 2021

Tarw Coch said:
What if they only offer you a quid

I'll offer twice as much if that's any better

Tarw Coch · Sep 26, 2021

serf said:
I'll offer twice as much if that's any better

Ahhh, but he said he’d already decided who he was selling to............and I’m guessing that isn’t you.

serf · Sep 26, 2021

Tarw Coch said:
Ahhh, but he said he’d already decided who he was selling to............and I’m guessing that isn’t you.

☹ dam thought I got a bargain heading my way then ......

warksfarmer · Sep 26, 2021

delilah said:
Then I apologise, I read it as a post asking the question 'What will be the turning point ?', and as such seeking answers. If I had known it was just another whingefest I would have kept quiet.

Agreed, anywhere populated mainly by farmers would be a waste of time. It only angers me slightly that farmers find it necessary to smirk at fellow farmers selling direct and steadfastly refuse to support them. The bit that angers me hugely is the way that farmers constantly look for any opportunity to put the boot in to the one sector of society that seeks to support farmers; members of environmental organisations.

Whilst not being party to their accounts, I would say that of all the farming businesses in this parish the ones that are best equipped to survive post-BPS are those who sell direct, so it can't be that inefficient. The ones set to suffer the most are the 'proper' farmers.

Think you’ll find lots of built up areas don’t want farmers markets either because all they want is Aldi and Lidl.

delilah · Sep 26, 2021

warksfarmer said:
Think you’ll find lots of built up areas don’t want farmers markets either because all they want is Aldi and Lidl.

You had better tell this lot then, they are clearly wasting their time.

https://farmretail.co.uk/2021/08/24/world-coalition-of-farmers-markets/

edit: Our neighbours have a waiting list as long as your arm for their veg box scheme. Everything on our farm is sold before it is born, at a price of our setting. I really, really can't get my head round the fact that so many within agriculture can be so insulting towards their fellow producers and their customers, whilst at the same time moaning about how the world is against them. What do you feckin expect ? Any member of the public stumbling in here would think farmers a bunch of spoilt children.

warksfarmer · Sep 26, 2021

delilah said:
You had better tell this lot then, they are clearly wasting their time.

https://farmretail.co.uk/2021/08/24/world-coalition-of-farmers-markets/

They can do what they like but when 43 million people in the U.K. are earning around £400/week after tax they want and need cheap food.

The nearest local farmers market around here isn’t accessible to the vast majority of people which is why it isn’t well supported.

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