Is the west agricultural industry being run by an academic led doomsday cult ?

Cowabunga said:

McDonalds buy and use 4100 tons of potatoes worldwide every day of the year. That’s 1.5 million tons of spuds taken/bought annually by one single customer.

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Then to maximise profit, add vast quantities of vegetable oil (which contains canola oil, corn oil, soybean oil, and natural beef flavor with wheat and milk derivatives), dextrose, sodium acid pyrophosphate, and salt

However, the point of the thread is not how maccyD process chemicals and name it food

The point is that false pseudo science is being used by the WEF to misdirect world enviromental conscience away from seeing the actual source of pollution

Or do you believe flying off to eat chemically processed food on a beach in Barbados isn't a problem provided our grass fed cows are culled to make way for sikta spruce?

For that is what the retailers want the public to believe. That is why they created their WWF basket case enviromental policy

Anybody daft enough to sign up to their Greening Farming Commitments pledges a 50% cull of livestock, and 80% reduction of N&P fertiliser use, all to meet carbon nowt

All based on false science to perpetuate continued profit from pollution

Does anyone on this forum actually believe cows are killing the planet?

banjo said:

Personally I think the agricultural industry in the uk and other western countries is being run by an academic led doomsday cult. The brainwashed individuals in positions of power everywhere are being led by anti meat eating and climate change snake oil salesmen that have no business deciding what stock farmers and crop farmers should produce and what subsidies they get to produce the product that the farmer sells to make a profit.
subsidies were totally changed from production during 2000 to area payment that reduced the stocking on all farms, this subsidised the farmer for less product while taking care of the environment and keeping food supply stable. now all these years later the farmers that listened to these academics and uk and eu conservationists are told what they told us to do was all wrong and it’s destroying the planet and wildlife was in better fettle before they got involved in 2000.
I think farming is being run by a academic led doomsday cult and even our farmers union and farmers weekly, farming media, has been brainwashed by it all. Farming is in a downwards spiral ( especially in wales where many of the ministers in charge are against eating meat ) I look on at the people running the show from all parties in despair because they have no plan except deindustrialising the uk and wales ( doomsday cults do things like that ) while businesses are being destroyed and farming production is moved to another country.
i can see the replies now ( brexit caused it all ) we all know Europes farming is doing worse and is in constant rioting, protests because of this same situation where academic led doomsday cults are running the farming industry over there also )
the farmers union and all farming media should be kicking in the doors of certainly the welsh government to get these loons to see sense before it’s to late, but I have a sneaking suspicion that they are to heavily involved in the decision making process that caused this cluster f**k in the first place ?
hold on to your hats everyone because I can see the complete destruction of welsh farming and nobody is doing a thing about it because they are afraid to ruffle a few feathers and tell the loons in charge a few home truths !

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Nobody wants to look bad in front of their mates or say what might have them excluded or rejected. I feel it's partly because most people aren't clear about integrity - actually being your word - and have morality and ethics sitting on top of it in the basket.

If you say you're there to represent then you should be judged on whether you represent or not. If you say you'll be going to work on something and then not fulfil on it, then basic accountability is due. That is a fundamental part of democracy.

This rampant wokeist "can't say that" culture is beyond saving or commenting much upon, so the solution is probably to simply be honest about what you see, and stop voting for the problem.

Protests are inevitable, even in the good old fascist states who believe in being strongly told just how many beans make 5, as people begin to discover that Stockholm syndrome IS just a syndrome and that they are responsible for how life turned out.

This is it, the time to protest, and people are apathetic . This is how we vote

DrDunc said:

I'm afraid you lost any credulity claiming "chips are chips"

Please go away and look up ultra processed food, and the effects it has upon the human body. Perhaps you'll even learn how little potato is actually required to fabricate macdonalds "chips"

The sliver of vegetable decorating industrially manufactured "fast food" is just glitter on a turd

Your defence of the marketing hype only proves the effectiveness of the nonsense which has found the world believing livestock are causing the pollution that is actually created by fossil fuels and processed foods

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I know exactly how McDonalds fries are made thank you, it seems you don't.
They are fried in oil like any other chip and McDonalds buys thousands of tonnes every year, along with Beef and all the other ingredients required to make the meals, all of which benefits the farmers who supply them.

You can give the thread all the flash titles you want...at the end of the day there is a war on farmers in the early stages...plian and simple.


Think back 20 plus years ago...id farmers ever get a mention at any sort of economic summit? Or even climate summit?

In the words of the great band ac/dc

Satans coming for you.

Ant...

MrNoo said:

I don't think it just the Welsh farming, the rest of us are in a similar position of sorts. The sums of money they are paying or will be paying farmers not to produce food is mind boggling. E.g. my agent told me of one of his customers who is putting over 800ha into Stewardship, his yearly payment will be over half a million for not growing cereals.
In my own case I was paid £42k under SFP and Stewardship is just over £140k for not producing anything except flowers and grass. My grandfather told my father that he would become a park keeper and nothing more and he was completely right.
The lunatics are running the asylum.

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You are right. A waste of taxpayers money. “Oh we don’t need to produce food, let’s just have a massive wild parkland for our country”. We can import all the substandard products we like! Beggars belief in this day and age. Muppets, all of them in the position of decision making on this policy

TelesnaAg said:

You can give the thread all the flash titles you want...at the end of the day there is a war on farmers in the early stages...plian and simple.


Think back 20 plus years ago...id farmers ever get a mention at any sort of economic summit? Or even climate summit?

In the words of the great band ac/dc

Satans coming for you.

Ant...

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Yes the stage was set for it a long long time before we got here.

Fabrications need foundations

DrDunc said:

I'm afraid you lost any credulity claiming "chips are chips"

Please go away and look up ultra processed food, and the effects it has upon the human body. Perhaps you'll even learn how little potato is actually required to fabricate macdonalds "chips"

The sliver of vegetable decorating industrially manufactured "fast food" is just glitter on a turd

Your defence of the marketing hype only proves the effectiveness of the nonsense which has found the world believing livestock are causing the pollution that is actually created by fossil fuels and processed foods

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I’m pretty sure the UK market fries are just potatoes fried in oil then salted.

The USA market has the fully barstewardised 17 ingredients version, eg used to use beef stock to flavour, now use synthetic beef flavouring, anti clumping agents, colourings, 3 types of veg oil, sweeteners, anti foaming agent in the oil etc.

No. The West's agricultural industry is now run by corporations. A takeover that, for decades, has been aided and abetted by farmers. Should have listened to the lentil knitters.

melted welly said:

I’m pretty sure the UK market fries are just potatoes fried in oil then salted.

The USA market has the fully barstewardised 17 ingredients version, eg used to use beef stock to flavour, now use synthetic beef flavouring, anti clumping agents, colourings, 3 types of veg oil, sweeteners, anti foaming agent in the oil etc.

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More profit from ultra processed food full of industrial chemical

More profit from engines that meet "emissions" regulations, despite burning more fuel

More profit from jet fuel and cargo ship heavy oil than local holidays and home made gadgets

More profit from culling cows and planting permanent pasture in trees, or crop to grow "fuel"

More profit from vegetables grown behind wire security fence and armed guard in a starving third world African country, than seasonal neighbourhood vegetables

Globalisation has permitted the human population explosion that now consumes planet resources far faster than it can repair itself from the damage

Profits continue to rise from pollution while farming, the industry that can sequestrate carbon, is scapegoated. Livestock are vilified for killing the planet

Two cars in the driveway and an annual international holiday are OK, because farmland is rewilded, the peat bogs are restored to emit more methane, and dogs are free to roam in the fields cleared of pesky four legged food

The UK retail sector has decided the British Farming Industry is part of the "Food Industry", and published their intent to cull our cows, abolish our fertliser user, and thieve our carbon credits, all while not increasing imports of actual food

Not to save the planet, but to increase profit from ultra processed pretend food. All based on science proven to be farcical in its accuracy

DrDunc said:

More profit from ultra processed food full of industrial chemical

More profit from engines that meet "emissions" regulations, despite burning more fuel

More profit from jet fuel and cargo ship heavy oil than local holidays and home made gadgets

More profit from culling cows and planting permanent pasture in trees, or crop to grow "fuel"

More profit from vegetables grown behind wire security fence and armed guard in a starving third world African country, than seasonal neighbourhood vegetables

Globalisation has permitted the human population explosion that now consumes planet resources far faster than it can repair itself from the damage

Profits continue to rise from pollution while farming, the industry that can sequestrate carbon, is scapegoated. Livestock are vilified for killing the planet

Two cars in the driveway and an annual international holiday are OK, because farmland is rewilded, the peat bogs are restored to emit more methane, and dogs are free to roam in the fields cleared of pesky four legged food

The UK retail sector has decided the British Farming Industry is part of the "Food Industry", and published their intent to cull our cows, abolish our fertliser user, and thieve our carbon credits, all while not increasing imports of actual food

Not to save the planet, but to increase profit from ultra processed pretend food. All based on science proven to be farcical in its accuracy

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Agreed.

And a lot of our own industry advisors and intellectuals are on that very path too.


Heard him speak at groundswell in fife. Falling over himself to agree that agriculture is a major problem and promoting expensive Heath Robinson ideas on solving the decided problem.

melted welly said:

Agreed.

And a lot of our own industry advisors and intellectuals are on that very path too.

Davy McCracken

SRUC: Scotland's Rural College - Cited by 9,035 - High Nature Value farming systems - agricultural ecology - chough population dynamics - farmland birds - Common Agricultural Policy

0-scholar-google-com.brum.beds.ac.uk

Heard him speak at groundswell in fife. Falling over himself to agree that agriculture is a major problem and promoting expensive Heath Robinson ideas on solving the decided problem.

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Influencing government policy

Prolifically publishing opinion and conjecture as if it were academic peer reviewed fact

Our industry "advisers" have raced down the route that it's cheaper to employ numpties and simpletons, and outource the real thinking to academia when the hard questions are asked

Trouble being there's no integrity left in academia, let alone independent intelligence: Research funding is provided by industry that wants answers conducive to profit, not reality

kiwi pom said:

McDonalds buys an awful lot of produce off farmers, often locally sourced too.

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did some hf bull beef for Mc D, joints to tesco? rest burgers. Good meat in, WTF they do to it, but its called 'patte' when it comes out.

l should add, the number of times l have been in McD, can be counted on one hand, grandkids seem to love the processed crap though.

som farmer said:

did some hf bull beef for Mc D, joints to tesco? rest burgers. Good meat in, WTF they do to it, but its called 'patte' when it comes out.

l should add, the number of times l have been in McD, can be counted on one hand, grandkids seem to love the processed crap though.

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There is no significant processing. They use lean beef and that is what you get in the burgers. There’s lots of other stuff of course including lettuce and a special ‘cheese’. Lovely lettuce and tomatoes in some recipes.

Cowabunga said:

There is no significant processing. They use lean beef and that is what you get in the burgers. There’s lots of other stuff of course including lettuce and a special ‘cheese’. Lovely lettuce and tomatoes in some recipes.

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The issue is not how they process primary produce to add profit, and what industrial chemicals are involved in the "specials sauces"

The issue is that there is far more profit from processed "food" and foreign holidays, and to "offset" the ever increasing pollution, farmers are being scapegoated internationally

For farmers to bugger about pontificating over the ingredients of America's most successful fast food is amazing. Meanwhile fake science says that my grass fed cows are killing the planet, while we bicker over a burger

melted welly said:

I’m pretty sure the UK market fries are just potatoes fried in oil then salted.

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Come on now don’t let reality get in the way, the Doctors on a rant.
The worlds against him apparently.

kiwi pom said:

Come on now don’t let reality get in the way, the Doctors on a rant.
The worlds against him apparently.

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It depends on food regulation in the individual country. I’m sure if UK was slacker, we’d have 17 ingredients too. Europe will be different again.

Are NZ regs close to the UK? I suppose they started from the same point but been separate for what 120yrs?

kiwi pom said:

Come on now don’t let reality get in the way, the Doctors on a rant.
The worlds against him apparently.

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When you can't dispute the facts, besmirching the messenger does not increase validity of your argument

While you may be content to bicker over a burger while false science vilifies agriculture for climate change, others are content to question your complacency

DrDunc said:

The issue is not how they process primary produce to add profit, and what industrial chemicals are involved in the "specials sauces"

The issue is that there is far more profit from processed "food" and foreign holidays, and to "offset" the ever increasing pollution, farmers are being scapegoated internationally

For farmers to bugger about pontificating over the ingredients of America's most successful fast food is amazing. Meanwhile fake science says that my grass fed cows are killing the planet, while we bicker over a burger

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I couldn’t care less. Their basic ingredients, particularly their burgers are top quality and sourced from us. They are excellent customers of ours for the majority of ingreients.

MrNoo said:

I don't think it just the Welsh farming, the rest of us are in a similar position of sorts. The sums of money they are paying or will be paying farmers not to produce food is mind boggling. E.g. my agent told me of one of his customers who is putting over 800ha into Stewardship, his yearly payment will be over half a million for not growing cereals.
In my own case I was paid £42k under SFP and Stewardship is just over £140k for not producing anything except flowers and grass. My grandfather told my father that he would become a park keeper and nothing more and he was completely right.
The lunatics are running the asylum.

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Isn't this to show us the true value of farmland?

Investment, risk, skill, knowledge and commitment are all being given away for almost nothing. Food and commodities do not reflect the true cost of production, but there's still someone in the world who will supply it

It's all fine buying in from abroad until it isn't.

get down to basics, every living person on this planet needs food to survive, a fact that some don't seem to realise

the loudest voice, is the one that influences politicians, farmers barely whisper. Those with the loudest voice, are the ones that thing farming, in the UK, isn't really needed, except for 'niche' market foods, they can show off, to their friends.

they also seem to think we can grow soya, or similar protein, on every field in the UK, or at least those they don't demand to be afforested, or rewilded. That they cannot, is either ignored or dis- believed.

most politicians haven't got a clue about where food comes from, or just assume it magically appears in s/mkts, as long as its cheap and can be imported easily, so they can sedate the zealotic idiots, with smooth talking.

which is all dandy, the big retailers are an amazingly efficient businesses, as with many other industries, they all operate on a 'just in time' stocking policy, worked brilliantly. A little history lesson, during ww1, german u'boats reduced the amount of grain entering the country. With only 3 weeks supply of wheat, in store. The guv seriously thought they would have to withdraw from the war. Today, there's about 3 days worth, it doesn't matter, we can import it.

and as @delilah rightly say's, the world is controlled by the men in grey suits, that allow politicians to dance to their tune. All in the name of profit and control.

the world has become a very very dangerous place. War in Europe, European countries preparing for war with Russia, senior military leaders, mentioning 'conscription', re-arming etc. Add the middle east, a powder keg, anything could happen there, Iran stirring the shite pot. China getting its economy into recession, and Xi threatening Taiwan, India, and the south china sea area. War brewing in S America. A wrong political call .................. and ww3 ?, and who thinks today's politicians are sensible people, or trustworthy.

The just in time policy, is fecked, block the Suez canal, and the Panama canal, both highly probable, Suez 99% certain. 10-14 days extra travel time, when its needed, on its original arrival date. Parts needed, that are made in China, to keep industry moving...... Disrupted everything, when a ship got stuck in Suez canal, fecked no end of stuff.

so, where do the zealots think the food is coming from, as we get closer to ww3 ? They just won't think that's a possibility, never happen. But somewhere amongst the areas above, it will happen, and it will spread, and trade routes will be obstructed. The same zealots will blame the guv, for failing to maintain food security. And farmers will be unable to respond, because those same zealots have reduced the fuel industry

the world is seriously fecked up. @delilah 'friends', will sit back, ready to 'rule' the roost again, when it quietens down again, if we are not all nuked.