Mag, mang and k all in cheap forms so no great expense
Nutrition more important than fungicides Imo. healthy, well fed plants don’t get sick so easy
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T2
- Thread starter Feldspar
- Start date
Mag, mang and k all in cheap forms so no great expense
Nutrition more important than fungicides Imo. healthy, well fed plants don’t get sick so easy
- Location
- East yorks
We put some mang on at T1 and it made a noticeable difference even on the really snotty clay, will put a bit more in at T2 when I do it next weekend
Tissue test says put on mag. Says fine for everything else.
dirty harry
Member
- Location
- east of east midlands!
Mag now (b’salts) - too late for mn?
B’salts here at t2 & t3 aswell
Cheers dh
B’salts here at t2 & t3 aswell
Cheers dh
- Location
- Essex
Manganese @ 2 l / H applied at T0 and another 2L/ H @ T1 applied here. No magnesium though. Septoria more prevalent here than anything else at the moment. 6mm last night which will do more good than harm but still have some T2 to do. Wind has been a real issue here as well as the odd thunder shower that doesn't amount to much but could potentially wash chemical of the leaf if it arrives close on the heals of an application.
Such is farming!
Such is farming!
Try to succeed
Member
Well the wind stopped me before lunch. Didn’t stop everyone though. Spent the afternoon weed wiping black grass in wheat instead!
Feldspar
Member
- Location
- Essex, Cambs and Suffolk
Still waiting to see some decent trial results for positive trace element responses. Haven't seen any yet.
Can you run some yourself? Your soils are the only ones that count.
What would it cost to get some professional people to do the trial for you? Over your area, the results could pay handsomely over the cost of the trial.
I visibly can see the effect of Mag Mang and K on my soils when ever we have purposely missed a tramline etc to compare !
think trials anywhere other than your own farm is pointless for this kind of product because it very much depends on what your soil can supply itself - every time I have ever tested Mang, Mag and K are short here and all can be supplied for very little money if you don't buy the fancy products and stick to basics
John Slejpner
Member
- Location
- Brick clay near Bedford
It's a tricky one alright. Are the trials not decent or are trace elements a waste of time??
I suspect that a disproportionate number of those who go beyond standard Mn and Mg are the one pass crop establishment mob...with a few elite growers chasing every last available bit of positive ROI.
But what are you to do mid april when cold soil is just not giving up it's goodies fast enough?
I suspect that a disproportionate number of those who go beyond standard Mn and Mg are the one pass crop establishment mob...with a few elite growers chasing every last available bit of positive ROI.
But what are you to do mid april when cold soil is just not giving up it's goodies fast enough?
Feldspar
Member
- Location
- Essex, Cambs and Suffolk
Obviously soils will differ, but the best equivalent to an on-farm trial which I have seen was done by one of our independent agronomists. They tissue tested every two weeks through the season and applied a wide range of trace elements on a soil type which was the same as ours with a farmer who was a good farmer. They had a reference area which wasn't treated. End result was that the (small) yield increase did not justify the spend. They did the same with the Delta T programme and the same result was achieved.
What was really interesting was the way the foliar levels changed throughout the season. I think foliar testing is far too vague to be a helpful diagnostic in all but the more severe deficiencies (i.e. ones that can easily be picked up by eye).
Away from on-farm trials, I would have had a bit more enthusiasm for the topic if AHDB had found anything more than the glimmer (i.e. one significant response) in all the trials they did.
It might not cost you a lot, but I bet your sprayer driver swears at having to lump so much stuff in. Those molasses must be a fair PITA.
I have seen wheat die here because of mang deficiency ! - i'm 100% sure we get a return on it
Mg harder to quantify but our soil results are consistently short of it and it really is a cheap product
K can been seen in crop colour - we get a much darker green where its used which you would think was a good thing but I admit I had never quantified it - again its cheap and I have read it helps with water uptake so on light soils where water is usually our yield limitation a bit of a no brainer ?
not too much bother for sprayer drivers when set up to handle the stuff and with bowser driver support etc
I think if you have high CEC soils you probably see little benefit from them, but when you farm some of the weaker soils we do then you can't rely on the soil to supply
- Location
- Bedfordshire
We are like Clive, some areas of crop will die without Mn early in the season. We even use Mn seed dressing on some fields.
After soil tests we have discovered that we have excessive Calcium. After some investigation I conclude that it can lock up Mg. Tissue tests have confirmed that. I am now applying Bittersaltz every time we go through. The crops seem a lot better for it, especially in some fields that previously have had poor patches in them. For the minimal cost and minimal hassle I will keep doing it.
After soil tests we have discovered that we have excessive Calcium. After some investigation I conclude that it can lock up Mg. Tissue tests have confirmed that. I am now applying Bittersaltz every time we go through. The crops seem a lot better for it, especially in some fields that previously have had poor patches in them. For the minimal cost and minimal hassle I will keep doing it.
- Location
- the brecks norfolk
Same here. We would suffer significant crop loss without routine use of MN thought the whole season.
Also most of our soil when tested is ok for mg but certainly not high and tissue tests are showing it low in the crop so I've started using 2 lts at t0-t3 and it's definitely made my crops look better and I don't seem to get the drought patches in the crop anywhere near as much I used to.
Also most of our soil when tested is ok for mg but certainly not high and tissue tests are showing it low in the crop so I've started using 2 lts at t0-t3 and it's definitely made my crops look better and I don't seem to get the drought patches in the crop anywhere near as much I used to.
- Location
- Lincolnshire
Here it's the case that overloosening or over over oxygenisation of the soils promotes high level of bacteriological activity. The bacteria then use up or lock up the manganese. There is no shortage. It just gets locked up.
That's why oats always look green here as they have bacteria round their roots that release it, whereas barley and wheat don't.
That's why oats always look green here as they have bacteria round their roots that release it, whereas barley and wheat don't.
Feldspar
Member
- Location
- Essex, Cambs and Suffolk
If everyone is thinking they're getting such big differences from trace elements, then why did it not show up in any of the AHDB trials?
- Location
- the brecks norfolk
Because its very dependent on the soil type.
I have one block of away ground which we call our "heavy" land and that has no need for foliar nutrition. It never shows any signs of autumn mn deficiency and although I put a couple of litres in with t1 it doesn't need it and I only do it to make me feel better.
If trial were conducted on my two land types there would undoubtedly be two very different results.
Soil ! It’s not all the same
It’s why I personally don't hold much faith in trial work done anywhere beyond my own farm
If I want to know if Mg Mn or K has a MOIC then I test it here with split fiends and tramline trials for a result more relevant than anything AHDB etc could do (unless they came here to do it for me !)
Feldspar
Member
- Location
- Essex, Cambs and Suffolk
So what sort of responses are you seeing then from those nutrients? K is pretty uncontroversial, but I would that Mg is more so.