A significant result

[Clive]

Ah right, so human nature will change?

I don't think so!

what change ? not all humans are obsessed with size / doing more

 

[dontknowanything]

what change ? not all humans are obsessed with size / doing more

There will always be enough.

When something makes more money, people do it and expand their businesses. It's how western civilisation works, deny it all you want, it won't suddenly stop being true.

 

[JNG]

Size could be a limiting factor, as the extra level of management and attention to detail gets a bit harder the more ground there is to cover or different soil types, just a thought. But irrelevant to the opening post which I also think is very significant because it was not significant.

 

[Clive]

There will always be enough.

When something makes more money, people do it and expand their businesses. It's how western civilisation works, deny it all you want, it won't suddenly stop being true.

not everyone thinks the same, I'm sure there are those who are happy with their lot and value quality of life above scale

re management I think the reason that both min-till and plough / combo are popular is they are very simple systems to manage and as a result very easy to scale in a UK situation

 

[dontknowanything]

not everyone thinks the same, I'm sure there are those who are happy with their lot and value quality of life above scale

re management I think the reason that both min-till and plough / combo are popular is they are very simple systems to manage and as a result very easy to scale in a UK situation

It doesn't matter if 99% of farmers are happy with their lot, the 1% is easily enough to satisfy landlords' wallets.

As for scaling, are you saying your operation will get no bigger?

 

[Clive]

It doesn't matter if 99% of farmers are happy with their lot, the 1% is easily enough to satisfy landlords' wallets.

As for scaling, are you saying your operation will get no bigger?

i'm not saying anything about myself just that scale is not what everyone wants , in my own case I think it would be a big challenge to maintain the detail required over a larger area and a bit pointless unless increased scale adds to profit and not just ego, however if you can find and retain the right people though all sorts of things are possible I guess

 

[SilliamWhale]

 

[ajd132]

James, I think you need to get on with it and stop trying to justify everything to the smallest detail! Bold, decisive decions are so important in day to farming in general.

 

[ajd132]

And talking on scale, we have lost a chunk this year due to it being sold, so perfect time to completely reset our systems and change. We would still be considered big farmers I think (3+) but it's manageable with my father and I, Do a lot of the work ourselves and both qualified agronomists doing all the agronomy ourselves (I'm only recently qualified), father has never had an agronomist in fact.
This year has seen a conversion to CTF, lots of cover and companion cropping and highly reduced tillage/no till. I am confident we can make it work.
On the other hand there's a farming company nearish doing 6000 acres zero till which I can see being a complete nightmare.

It would be nice to get some more land, but I want land through merit of our skill as farmers. Unfortunately nowadays it all seems to come down to whether you suck up to land agents/take them shooting/wear red trousers....

 

[martian]

Which is why I often scratch my head at the way we all share our best ideas, when this simply helps my direct competitors (all of you out there!)

I remember hosting a farm walk a few years ago to look at the mob grazing I was doing and saying that in four years' time if I've gone very quiet on the subject it would either be because it had failed miserably or it was extremely successful.

I rarely mention it these days.....

It's an unusual business farming in that we are not, in the main, competing with each other (except in the pub with yield talk), but your comment has got me thinking. The mob grazing job works for us, but it could well be compromised if half the farmers in E Anglia realise how easy it is and pile in, resulting in a glut of cattle and falling prices, not to mention the increased likelihood of TB coming this way.

Arable info is perhaps less sensitive, contractors are competing for business, but as @ajd132 says, you should be able to get land through your skill as farmers and by looking after the soil (which is something agents don't seem to understand). But otherwise we are mostly growing commodity crops and it won't make much difference to the price if your neighbour has a stonking harvest or a disaster, or whether the UK has a million tonnes to export or two million. I do feel that there is a limit on how big a well run no-till farm can be. As people have posted above, there is much more management required compared to the 'industry model', min-till or plough/power-harrow, that the big arable guys seem to use. We're on 2000 arable acres here and I can honestly say that at the moment I wouldn't want any more, I know we can make what we've got work much better and make even more money, so why expand and do the job badly? There may well be some geniuses out there who could cope with the level of organising required, but count me out, life is short enough as it is.

Back to the OP, it is incredibly significant. Good decision made.

 

[SilliamWhale]

It's an unusual business farming in that we are not, in the main, competing with each other (except in the pub with yield talk), but your comment has got me thinking. The mob grazing job works for us, but it could well be compromised if half the farmers in E Anglia realise how easy it is and pile in, resulting in a glut of cattle and falling prices, not to mention the increased likelihood of TB coming this way.

Arable info is perhaps less sensitive, contractors are competing for business, but as @ajd132 says, you should be able to get land through your skill as farmers and by looking after the soil (which is something agents don't seem to understand). But otherwise we are mostly growing commodity crops and it won't make much difference to the price if your neighbour has a stonking harvest or a disaster, or whether the UK has a million tonnes to export or two million. I do feel that there is a limit on how big a well run no-till farm can be. As people have posted above, there is much more management required compared to the 'industry model', min-till or plough/power-harrow, that the big arable guys seem to use. We're on 2000 arable acres here and I can honestly say that at the moment I wouldn't want any more, I know we can make what we've got work much better and make even more money, so why expand and do the job badly? There may well be some geniuses out there who could cope with the level of organising required, but count me out, life is short enough as it is.

Back to the OP, it is incredibly significant. Good decision made.

I'd like some more

 

[martian]

Fair enough, I realise I sound like the spoiled brat that I am...

 

[Feldspar]

James, I think you need to get on with it and stop trying to justify everything to the smallest detail! Bold, decisive decions are so important in day to farming in general.

I'm not going into detail but I have recently taken a few very bold and decisive decisions which were way more complex than a switch to no-till and the success has been sufficient to buy more than Clive's small farm that he reckons he's made from his no-till successes. The gamble only paid off due to obsessive attention to detail, a lot of research (including a lot of academic papers I should add), questioning everything that people did and said and ignoring a lot of people who said it couldn't be done. Funnily enough the idea spawned during a period of wasting time on the internet...

 

[ajd132]

I'm not going into detail but I have recently taken a few very bold and decisive decisions which were way more complex than a switch to no-till and the success has been sufficient to buy more than Clive's small farm that he reckons he's made from his no-till successes. The gamble only paid off due to obsessive attention to detail, a lot of research (including a lot of academic papers I should add), questioning everything that people did and said and ignoring a lot of people who said it couldn't be done. Funnily enough the idea spawned during a period of wasting time on the internet...

Good. We need a catch up soon.

 

[Clive]

I'm not going into detail but I have recently taken a few very bold and decisive decisions which were way more complex than a switch to no-till and the success has been sufficient to buy more than Clive's small farm that he reckons he's made from his no-till successes. The gamble only paid off due to obsessive attention to detail, a lot of research (including a lot of academic papers I should add), questioning everything that people did and said and ignoring a lot of people who said it couldn't be done. Funnily enough the idea spawned during a period of wasting time on the internet...

good to hear ! was that a farming decision ? In other areas of business I would agree and have made similar changes and well proven changes to other things i have been involved in, its normally the correct way to do things

Farming however I have learnt (the hard way) is somewhat unique in its complexity and lack of proof of just about anything, its only very small part (understood) science and a VERY large part art right now

 

[dontknowanything]

I'm not going into detail but I have recently taken a few very bold and decisive decisions which were way more complex than a switch to no-till and the success has been sufficient to buy more than Clive's small farm that he reckons he's made from his no-till successes. The gamble only paid off due to obsessive attention to detail, a lot of research (including a lot of academic papers I should add), questioning everything that people did and said and ignoring a lot of people who said it couldn't be done. Funnily enough the idea spawned during a period of wasting time on the internet...

Pictures or it didn't happen

 

[Feldspar]

Pictures or it didn't happen

As my uncle once said in response to an impertinent request for sensitive information, "Of course, my dear fellow, just as soon as you send me a picture of your wife in nothing but her underwear."

However, since it's you David, and since your wife has already sent me one, I'll send you a picture later FoC.





Well, you did say pull the other one!

 

[dontknowanything]

As my uncle once said in response to an impertinent request for sensitive information, "Of course, my dear fellow, just as soon as you send me a picture of your wife in nothing but her underwear."

However, since it's you David, and since your wife has already sent me one, I'll send you a picture later FoC.





Well, you did say pull the other one!

The other wife?

 

[SilliamWhale]

Ooh you pair of old Cambridgeshire cads you.....wife swapping indeed...

 

[shakerator]

Profit doesn't drive scale anymore. Credit and collateral does