- Location
- Essex
You would expect kestrels and barn owls to do well on the smaller mammals.
Unfortunately badgers and foxes don't have any predators controlling them...
AHL2 - Winter Bird Food
- Thread starter Stephensonlouis
- Start date
Unfortunately badgers and foxes don't have any predators controlling them...
Just a .243..... where legal to do so, of course.
- Location
- Suffolk
What can you sow in August that will fulfil the winter bird food aim? Spring barley might not head in time, buckwheat could suffer to an early frost? Mustard possibly? All very reliant on the rain in august but are you completing the "actions rather than results"?
- Location
- Suffolk
do you not think spring barley would head if planted in august?
- Location
- N.Yorkshire
Do you have to plant anything to head in winter or can you put feeders out to feed the little birds to fulfil the AhL2 ? Its fulfilling the 'provide food resources for farmland birds in late autumn-winter'
It isnt to do with finding a loophole, its to do with desperately trying being able to fit the actions into your rotation, without being out of pocket!
low levels of cyanide in linseed makes
Absolutely agree!
If £1000/ha was on the table for one cropping year (say July-July) and we provided Winter bird food for the winter months, and flowering species for pollinators in the spring (perhaps all species sown in July?)
Then this creates the break crop we are all desperately trying to replace. It also provides the original AHL2 aims without much issue, and immense public good.A
SFI is being done on on the cheap
SAM2 at £129/ha is an absolute insult to what it provides as a public good, when it also has a huge risk to a following spring crop's bottom line
especially when AHL2 planted at the same time (and arguably does the same job as SAM2, living roots, cover, pollution sponge, wildlife etc) during the autumn/winter
Should be completely simplified to:
£500/ ha to take land out of production for 6 months (to provide say an autumn OR a spring sown cover)
or
£1000/ ha to take land out of production for a year (to provide winter bird food and then spring flowers) drilled either once: With a mix for bird food and flowering species grown on into the spring or twice: Bird food sown straight after harvest in july, fb a flowering cover sown in the spring for pollinators and nesting / cover
This is then achievable in a winter and spring cereal rotation, or after late lifted root crops, or before spring sown cash crops
- Location
- Dorset/Wilts
This is why they aren't paying that kind of money, and why they really want one to sown AHL2 in the spring then having to follow with a spring cash crop.
It's an offer, an invitation to treat. Unfortunately it isn't the RPA job to run your business for you and provide like for like cropping plans.
There has to be some kind of forfeiting on the farmers part
WRXppp
Member
- Location
- North Yorks
What it needs is a type of combo option so we have the multi species winter cover then into the ahl2 from spring to spring then a spring to 15th October summer annual nectar and pollen mix so stuff like borage, phecilia, linseed, fodder radish, mustard, it’s this 3rd part we a missing to get you back into winter wheat.
one of the biggest problems with the SFI is when you compare to a ELS/HLS agreement of say 10 years ago yes the rate was say 600/ha for wild bird mix BUT you still got BPS on that area also so £835 ish/ha 10 years ago compares very well with todays ahl2 payment.
if this years harvest and back end had mirrored last year would we see the same interest in SFI I think not, I also get the impression from a supply sort of side that they are going to sell the same product onto farms in a way of FREE ADVICE towards SFI on say your poorest 20% but then to push the remaining 80% so you don’t spend less with them and the goal is set to produce the same heap as when you was cropping 100%.
The forefeit is a loss of income from an already risky spring break crop.
DDing after AHL2 is fraught with risk.
If they can't accomodate that risk by paying well, well they can't expect much uptake then.
The core rotation wins out for me.
I'll find private enterprise schemes that do fit my rotation and pay better too.
Need an option that fits after AHL2 when its finished providing bird food, and brings us back to cereals in the autumn
Huntstreet
Member
This has been an interesting 14 pages to read on Sunday morning. My thoughts would be AHL2 needs to be a break crop to get the field back into wheat. So it replaces Linseed, OSR or Spring oats for example.
In the south-east, I think there is a chance to get plants to provide seeds if planted in July or August. I like Clives approach and think that would work. However, I assume you would glyphosate in the spring to take out any grassweeds before sowing the flowing plants to forfil the second half of AHL2?
Could a rotation look like wheat, AHL2, wheat, AHL2, Wheat, AHL2 etc. Or wheat, wheat, AHL2, Wheat, wheat, Beans?
You could spin seed on in July if following wheat or avatar drill if the crops off early or (W barley). Then avatar in the spring for flowing plant element. Spray off in September and DD with Wheat. Stack the £45 no isecticides on it as well.
Planting a spring cash crop is risky for reasons previously outlined in this thread. I would rather do the cover crop option and then plant a spring crop.
There are risks involved with the weather but that's the same if you plant linseed or OSR or any crop for that matter.
In the south-east, I think there is a chance to get plants to provide seeds if planted in July or August. I like Clives approach and think that would work. However, I assume you would glyphosate in the spring to take out any grassweeds before sowing the flowing plants to forfil the second half of AHL2?
Could a rotation look like wheat, AHL2, wheat, AHL2, Wheat, AHL2 etc. Or wheat, wheat, AHL2, Wheat, wheat, Beans?
You could spin seed on in July if following wheat or avatar drill if the crops off early or (W barley). Then avatar in the spring for flowing plant element. Spray off in September and DD with Wheat. Stack the £45 no isecticides on it as well.
Planting a spring cash crop is risky for reasons previously outlined in this thread. I would rather do the cover crop option and then plant a spring crop.
There are risks involved with the weather but that's the same if you plant linseed or OSR or any crop for that matter.
num3
current thinking is now ahl2 (all 6 species) after barley - then num3 in march - then back into wheat in october
no insecticide, companion cropping cash crops, hedges, soil / ipm plans, plus dd / precision farming when they are announced and it works nicely
Did you hear back from Sandy Kalipa re AHL2 fb NUM3 as being an acceptable thing if start date is in feb?
no answer yet
, he said he has asked for a response thoughfrom what i can see there is no reason i can’t do it - the aims of both can be achieved
- Location
- Dorset/Wilts
Tbh ahl2 followed by Num3 - with a well planned start date - is splitting less hairs than your previous loophole of split drilling the bird food option.no answer yet
from what i can see there is no reason i can’t do it - the aims of both can be achieved
I can't see why there can be any argument against not doing Ahl2 followed by Num3, with a Feb start date.
- Location
- Dorset/Wilts
Would spinning on the bird food species in WB - end june/early July - work? Given a damp time.
Would having straw in swathe to bale impact establishment?
My concern with the Ahl2 after wb would be the timeliness in getting it drilled. Historically slow harvest starters, invariably teething problems, straw to bale and clear. I would worry - even more than I do - every July.
However chuck in a following legume fallow in the same harvest year ££££
Would having straw in swathe to bale impact establishment?
My concern with the Ahl2 after wb would be the timeliness in getting it drilled. Historically slow harvest starters, invariably teething problems, straw to bale and clear. I would worry - even more than I do - every July.
However chuck in a following legume fallow in the same harvest year ££££
Huntstreet
Member
Sorry if has been cleared up already. Why would a Feb start date be key to this working?
- Location
- Dorset/Wilts
Ahl2 and Num3 wouldn't be allowed on the same parcel in the same 12 month period