It's a question of cost of production compared to sale price, as with gas providers if production costs escalate you are better stopping production rather than build up huge losses!
CF Fertilisers
- Thread starter Yorkshire lad
- Start date
- Location
- DD9.
I've always thought you were one of the nice folk on here.
……I’ve a set of very specific skills, acquired over many years……
I have been thinking this for years, really wouldn’t be hard. Does make you wonder.
No, might as well give it away, the CO2 is now the primary product, the fertiliser is just a byproduct and they should be paying you to take it off their hands
Exactly, plus they know that fertilisers have a long shelf life and are fairly easy to store. If none were shipped for a few months now the impact would be very low so no big consequence if they halt the plant. The CO2 however is a different matter more difficult/costly to store and relatively low value, hence the demand for government cash to keep going.
Thast the problem with by products, we utilise them as they are readily available and inexpensive, the time comes however when we are dependent on them and their withdrawal causes major disruption.
- Location
- West Suffolk
Lifted from BBC news, so there are 3 other sites that are still producing? Would they be fert plants too?
The shelf life has no bearing at all, it's the cost of production of the fertiliser, it does not suddenly become cheaper to produce now if you then sell it months further down the line at a saleable priceNo, might as well give it away, the CO2 is now the primary product, the fertiliser is just a byproduct and they should be paying you to take it off their hands
Exactly, plus they know that fertilisers have a long shelf life and are fairly easy to store. If none were shipped for a few months now the impact would be very low so no big consequence if they halt the plant. The CO2 however is a different matter more difficult/costly to store and relatively low value, hence the demand for government cash to keep going.
Thast the problem with by products, we utilise them as they are readily available and inexpensive, the time comes however when we are dependent on them and their withdrawal causes major disruption.
Steevo
Member
- Location
- Gloucestershire
The majority of UK-produced CO2 comes as a byproduct from the two fertiliser plants, owned by CF Fertilisers, at Ince and Billingham. Between them they are the source of approximately 60% of UK consumption. This concentration of production in a single owner is a joint venture that was established in 2007. That joint venture was investigated by the Competition Commission at the time, who insisted on remedies designed to address a lessening of competition in CO2 supply1 . Built into CO2 production is a seasonality with less ammonia produced as demand from farmers falls during the summer and a need for closures of plants for maintenance. The other significant source of CO2 in the UK is bioethanol production. The country’s largest bioethanol plant is Ensus at Wilton. On paper, it could be a large producer of CO2, with capacity of up to 250kt a year. However, the market for bioethanol in the UK is very challenging and the plant produces below its capacity. Lack of demand for bioethanol has led the plant to be closed for a number for significant periods since it started operation in 2010.
Also from same document:
Steevo
Member
- Location
- Gloucestershire
There are five main sources of food grade CO2 in the UK, and only two of these, near Manchester, have been operational for the best part of the last month. The other three – two ammonia plants at Billingham and Wilton in the North East and a bio-ethanol plant near Ipswich – have been closed.
www.maintenanceandengineering.com
CO2 shortage eases but effects persist | Maintenance and Engineering
www.maintenanceandengineering.com
- Location
- West Suffolk
Just ordered enough Adnams Ales to last into the new year
Not sure the wife will go for the CO2 shortage now HM Gov are stepping in
Steevo
Member
- Location
- Gloucestershire
Nice to see the courier followed the "This way up" advice for three out of the four boxes!
- Location
- South Northants
So am I right in thinking that the CO2 that is captured in the process of making fertiliser is used elsewhere and released into the atmosphere and them the farmer gets the blame for global warming?
Exfarmer
Member
- Location
- Bury St Edmunds
Crazy world isn’t it. In other situations it would be called recycling
- Location
- South Molton
We want farmer to be come less reliant on fossil fuels and subs........but we will subsidise fertiliser production ....what ever next?
- Location
- Lincolnshire
Private eye writes itself this week.
- Location
- Carmarthenshire, West Wales
So, am I right in thinking the government would really like us all to stop farming, plant trees and re wild large swathes of the UK, therefore there won't be any need really to produce fertliser here, however, they would also like to subsidise foreign owned firms to make fertliser here that they don't want us to use, so we as a country can utilise the CO2 that is produced as a bye product?
Have I missed something here, or is that the gist of it?
Have I missed something here, or is that the gist of it?
SilliamWhale
Member
I think we get the blame for the nitrous oxides. At the end of the day if using gas to make something the molecules are going to reappear in a different format somewhere along the line - there is no option!
C4H6 and CH4 = Haber Bosch = N20 and CO2
- Location
- Limousin, France
All laid out here...
The impact of Brexit on the UK energy sector - Vivid
An assessment of the impact of leaving the EU on the UK’s energy sector, focusing on the impact of potentially leaving the Internal Energy Market.
www.vivideconomics.com
The impact of Brexit on the UK energy sector - Vivid
An assessment of the impact of leaving the EU on the UK’s energy sector, focusing on the impact of potentially leaving the Internal Energy Market.
www.vivideconomics.com
Closure of UK’s largest gas storage site ‘could mean volatile prices
https://amp.theguardian.com/busines...ritish-gas-centrica?__twitter_impression=true
Higher energy bills claim fuels EU row - BBC News
Supporters of leaving the EU say claims by Energy Secretary Amber Rudd that total household bills could rise by as much as £1.5m a day as a result are "absurd".
www.bbc.co.uk
Courier
Member
- Location
- M62 - M1 - M18 triangle
You would be amazed at how far a mobile phone will bounce !!!
oil barron
Member
- Location
- Aberdeenshire
What I don’t understand on the gas prices is no one in the UK is even bidding on none contracted LNG cargoes at the moment. The LNG price isn’t that high at the moment