Farm Subsidies......expand or GET OUT???

[puppet]

some technology can massively increase efficiency and lower labour requirements i.e front mower on tractor aswell as rear at silage time has halved the time it takes to cut our silage

I understand that but to save employed labour costs you need to save time across the year. If that involves more and bigger machinery/technology then there is a tipping point where a contractor is the answer.

 

[Bossfarmer]

Swapping machines every day on a livestock takes time better spent with stock

with things like straw bedders you have to get out the tractor ANYWAY its takes seconds to pull the pipes and pto shaft off, prob quicker than walking to the next tractor and getting it heat up

 

[Bossfarmer]

Historically we've always had one tractor on narrower wheels and one on wider, but in practice nearly all of ours have two pairs of wheels

7720 permanently on 650 42's for drilling ridging and cultivation
7620 on 20.8r42's, but wears 16.9r42 for destoning and harvesting potatoes
7618 on 14.9r46 most of the year for planting spraying and topping but currently sat on the combi on its 650r38's
7490 on 580's most of the year but wears 16.9r46 in spring for spraying etc while the 18 is busy then does irrigation duty
6480 on 20.8r38 runabout cart tractor
6480 on 600/65r38 for rolling pressing cultivating. Wears 13.6r48 for destoning & irrigating
3075 sits on 13.6r38 most of the time but currently on 540r34 for rolling & drain jetting

Halfing the tractor fleet would still get the work done but there'd be a lot more compromise and a lot more hassle. No thanks!

do you find much difference in power/reliability between the 7720 and the 7620?

 

[Sleepeasy]

how do you go about expanding? Renting more land? What will rents be on good combinable only ground now? Sfi has put a bottom in the market for rents now

 

[Spud]

with things like straw bedders you have to get out the tractor ANYWAY its takes seconds to pull the pipes and pto shaft off, prob quicker than walking to the next tractor and getting it heat up

It just goes to show tht we're all different. Hitching up a 3pl, pto & pipes and swapping machines every day to me is a ballache best avoided. Swapping cabs much more convenient and safer to me

 

[Bossfarmer]

It just goes to show tht we're all different. Hitching up a 3pl, pto & pipes and swapping machines every day to me is a ballache best avoided. Swapping cabs much more convenient and safer to me

make sure the pto is well lubricated and its off it seconds, angle tractor slightly to make job even easier, leave control box in cab at all times and just disconnect cable

 

[Spud]

do you find much difference in power/reliability between the 7720 and the 7620?

Both are VT, the 76 has 9000hrs and here from new. Sisu engines have been without exception excellent for us. This one is the only one thats had a new transmission. The 77 replaced another 7620vt. The 77 has had a few solenoids, both had addble delete. Nowt between them power wise, but the 76 grips better on its narrower wheels. 7618 better than both of them in my opinion,

 

[Spud]

make sure the pto is well lubricated and its off it seconds, angle tractor slightly to make job even easier, leave control box in cab at all times and just disconnect cable

Nope, still easier to leave it on, sod all that climbing past mucky wheels messing on with a cold linkage and pto shaft. If its a machine used every single day to me it justifies an older tractor to sit on it for convenience and safety, never mind cost.

 

[Bossfarmer]

Both are VT, the 76 has 9000hrs and here from new. Sisu engines have been without exception excellent for us. This one is the only one thats had a new transmission. The 77 replaced another 7620vt. The 77 has had a few solenoids, both had addble delete. Nowt between them power wise, but the 76 grips better on its narrower wheels. 7618 better than both of them in my opinion,

yes ive heard good things about the sisu engines, are the 76 models more prone to transmission problems or would you just put it down to bad luck? i see a lot of these tractors about 2nd hand at reasonable money

 

[Devil's advocate]

not necessarily, upgraded 2nd hand trailer needed for muck in winter anyway and fitted with 560 floatations rather than supersingles, combine on tracked...less compaction

Re the trailer all that disinfectent & paperwork.

Re The combine how much does a new set of tracks cost.

 

[Spud]

yes ive heard good things about the sisu engines, are the 76 models more prone to transmission problems or would you just put it down to bad luck? i see a lot of these tractors about 2nd hand at reasonable money

We've had seven vt's and put big hours on a few, bar a couple of high low cables, a speed sensor and a transmission wiring loom on an older one, no bother. Dyna6 6490 cost a bomb by comparison

 

[farmerm]

Intensification not expansion.
sweat the assets. Make every acre / square foot pay

Which might just see you double your inputs for rather modest output gains…

 

[Bossfarmer]

Re the trailer all that disinfectent & paperwork.

Re The combine how much does a new set of tracks cost.

adds about 40k new i believe but nothing really 2nd hand, hope to never find out, we dont do much roadwork so should last long enough

 

[Bossfarmer]

We've had seven vt's and put big hours on a few, bar a couple of high low cables, a speed sensor and a transmission wiring loom on an older one, no bother. Dyna6 6490 cost a bomb by comparison

ive heard the dyna 6 is bad

 

[Optimus]

Nope, still easier to leave it on, sod all that climbing past mucky wheels messing on with a cold linkage and pto shaft. If its a machine used every single day to me it justifies an older tractor to sit on it for convenience and safety, never mind cost.

I leave a tractor on the bedder all winter far easier than swapping all the time.same with the one that I feed cattle with.its never of it EVER!!.

 

[Jackov Altraids]

I agree with that, I don't really intend to sub the farm, but can afford not to take an income from it, if the value of the farm/stock increases over time that is a useful assett.

I don't quite understand the text highlighted in red

The thing is, most reading that would think it would be stupid to pay £20k into a farm business just to keep it going. The evidence suggests that @Bossfarmer and the majority of the rest of us have been doing the same.

Well I think everyone would agree that borrowing/ earning money to make up for a farm losing £1K / month in normal trading is mental.
But if you look at the statistics for farm incomes, most livestock farmers and others have used their BPS to make up the shortfall which is the same thing. If you realise that BPS is effectively really a diversified income, not a farming income.

 

[Optimus]

not necessarily, upgraded 2nd hand trailer needed for muck in winter anyway and fitted with 560 floatations rather than supersingles, combine on tracked...less compaction

I'm sure there now sayin that floatations are actually worse for compaction now.an tracks are the worst offenders.

 

[DrWazzock]

some technology can massively increase efficiency and lower labour requirements i.e front mower on tractor aswell as rear at silage time has halved the time it takes to cut our silage

I’m sure that works for you. We run a Claas WM165 (1.65m) that an MF135 can manage at over 6 mph. We bought a Potinger Novacat 10 ft wide machine to go behind the Lambo 105. It’s a rave to get it out of the shed and attach it. It’s so much more heavy and lumbering. Total time from getting the machine out to finishing cleaning down wasn’t much better for knocking down 6 acre blocks of hay and there’s a lot more capital tied up and depreciation. I find that sweating older lighter smaller kit is more profitable than spaffing ££k on shiny new stuff. And I’m still finished before dark. We drilled everything with an MF30 this year and a 27 year old Lambo. Light and fast. The dealers yards are still full of drills that weigh 8 tonnes empty and are festooned with wheels and rollers. I rest my case.

 

[DrWazzock]

The thing is, most reading that would think it would be stupid to pay £20k into a farm business just to keep it going. The evidence suggests that @Bossfarmer and the majority of the rest of us have been doing the same.

Well I think everyone would agree that borrowing/ earning money to make up for a farm losing £1K / month in normal trading is mental.
But if you look at the statistics for farm incomes, most livestock farmers and others have used their BPS to make up the shortfall which is the same thing. If you realise that BPS is effectively really a diversified income, not a farming income.

And why have we kept using BPS to keep farming?
Because being an active farmer saves inheritance tax and keeps the asset tidy. If my father had sold up in 2000 at £2200 an acre then he and we as an extended family would have lost megabucks. It was everybody’s interest to keep the business going even though there are some incredibly lean times on the production front. The capital growth and tax breaks make the production margin look irrelevant unless you start losing big money and run out of cash flow, which is when and why people sell. If you are eating capital by one means or another then it’s time to stop. Then sell, let or go down the environmental route. We are nearly but not quite there.

 

[Humble Village Farmer]

The thing is, most reading that would think it would be stupid to pay £20k into a farm business just to keep it going. The evidence suggests that @Bossfarmer and the majority of the rest of us have been doing the same.

Well I think everyone would agree that borrowing/ earning money to make up for a farm losing £1K / month in normal trading is mental.
But if you look at the statistics for farm incomes, most livestock farmers and others have used their BPS to make up the shortfall which is the same thing. If you realise that BPS is effectively really a diversified income, not a farming income.

They say the bps shouldn't even go into the farm account unless it's to reduce borrowings.