Finishing cattle on organic system

[Chasingmytail]

Looking at best opinions for finishing AA steers and heifers. No longer interested in selling to local market as thats an utter joke.

Never really finished cattle properly before as we used to sell all in boxes or to a finishing unit. Now we are organic Im looking at options for buyers too.

Obv not interested in stuffing and want stock to go as one load (born May).

Being grass fed, Ive only go one herbal lay field. (rest farm needs reseeding).

Need a regime or time table/thoughts...best way forward. As AA not going to be big cattle. How successful is grassfed on native breeds within the 30m or will we have to give in and get some concentrates?

 

[tinsheet]

Looking at best opinions for finishing AA steers and heifers. No longer interested in selling to local market as thats an utter joke.

Never really finished cattle properly before as we used to sell all in boxes or to a finishing unit. Now we are organic Im looking at options for buyers too.

Obv not interested in stuffing and want stock to go as one load (born May).

Being grass fed, Ive only go one herbal lay field. (rest farm needs reseeding).

Need a regime or time table/thoughts...best way forward. As AA not going to be big cattle. How successful is grassfed on native breeds within the 30m or will we have to give in and get some concentrates?

Doing the same with AA and Herefords, got several herbal lays in and grazing old permanent pasture using a holistic approach.( My first year)
Put in some red clover lays for winter feeding, neighbour doing the same with stabilizers, getting good results, fat by 24 months easy!
My Bullocks are averaging 1kg a day currently, so should be 550 600 kg by early October at 22 months (if they keep going as they are ) hope that's of some use

 

[Poorbuthappy]

Obv not interested in stuffing and want stock to go as one load (born May).

This bit troubles me? Firstly, why? And it's going to take a very tight ship to be able to achieve that, if it's viable

 

[Kiwi Pete]

Looking at best opinions for finishing AA steers and heifers. No longer interested in selling to local market as thats an utter joke.

Never really finished cattle properly before as we used to sell all in boxes or to a finishing unit. Now we are organic Im looking at options for buyers too.

Obv not interested in stuffing and want stock to go as one load (born May).

Being grass fed, Ive only go one herbal lay field. (rest farm needs reseeding).

Need a regime or time table/thoughts...best way forward. As AA not going to be big cattle. How successful is grassfed on native breeds within the 30m or will we have to give in and get some concentrates?

Easy enough.
We sent AA out the gate at between 16 and 21 months at an avg of 287kg - one key thing is to keep weighing them and decide what to do with the tail end early rather than back yourself into a corner with the less profitable individuals - I'd personally get a few too many, and count on selling the less adapted as forward stores.

Not too hard to pick out the ones not keeping up, if you weigh monthly, this avoids surprises.

We aren't certified organic but are, if that makes sense?
Decent cattle don't need their hands held, so you may have to shop around for cattle that work - choose your breeder with care.

No trouble at all stacking over 2kg/day on them in spring, I try to hold them back a little so they don't run shy later, but we get quite dry sometimes.

 

[Chasingmytail]

This bit troubles me? Firstly, why? And it's going to take a very tight ship to be able to achieve that, if it's viable

Yes get what you mean what I dont want it to drag out of months if I can block sell them means less hours. Doing a head count now to see how many to go will be some heifers too.

 

[Treg]

I finish Beef Shorthorns 18- 22 months they only have a few kg of concentrate at weaning , other than that grass only .
Keep them growing , give them the best grass at weaning ( fresh ley if possible).
I sell in 2& 3s for several reasons -
Price volatility- Organic is more volatile than conventional.
They're grass fed so let them grow at their own rate , some will be ready in 16 months when another fed exactly the same will be 25 months?!
Cash flow.
I don't do weighing so all by eye if 2 are slightly lighter I know the next pair mite need a bit longer.
Don't flood the market all one go , sometimes weekly kills at some abbattiors are only a handful of Organic.
Once your on the Abbattiors list @Chasingmytail they will sometimes ring you when their short , they will pay a bonus on top of the organic premium as well usually another 10- 20p/kg .

Look up well hung meats in Devon , although to far for you , you maybe able to find a similar outlet near you.

With AA you will have to keep a eye on minimum weights usually 270kgs dead weight, under that & they knock a lot of pence off.

 

[Chasingmytail]

Cheers @Treg I have been speaking to OLMC and think thats the way to go on pricing. Agree AA can be on the small side hence why we have to weigh. I have x2 not anywhere near. They are 25m now. Got most around 560kg. Now on herbal lay.

 

[Chasingmytail]

I also see Well Hung Meats has gone over to Eversfields now. I have messaged them just in case there is demand. Much a shame there is only one premium though as AA, grassfed and organic but go on the shelf as just 'organic'.

 

[multi power]

Yes get what you mean what I dont want it to drag out of months if I can block sell them means less hours. Doing a head count now to see how many to go will be some heifers too.

If you are going to be selling them all on the same day 75% of them will be out of spec and probably £50 per head of a penalty
Realistically you would be selling some each week for a 3 months

 

[Treg]

I also see Well Hung Meats has gone over to Eversfields now. I have messaged them just in case there is demand. Much a shame there is only one premium though as AA, grassfed and organic but go on the shelf as just 'organic'.

Didn't realise they'd been taken over, they were always keen on their native breeds but never had Beef Shorthorns on their list yes would be nice if all the premiums could be added up but be thankful for the premium there is & not having to scrape by on the prices their talking about on the Beef is fudged thread ( felt very guilty putting prices on there but hopefully it will give someone some hope that they can do something different ).

 

[Chasingmytail]

If you are going to be selling them all on the same day 75% of them will be out of spec and probably £50 per head of a penalty
Realistically you would be selling some each week for a 3 months

yes agree after weighing them there are a few needing to catch up but the time is short now as close to 30 months.

 

[multi power]

yes agree after weighing them there are a few needing to catch up but the time is short now as close to 30 months.

I'm not sure what weighing will achieve, you need to feel the ribs
If you don't get the grades you will get too low a price per kg

 

[Chasingmytail]

I'm not sure what weighing will achieve, you need to feel the ribs
If you don't get the grades you will get too low a price per kg

The majority look really great just the 2 that are a bit behind. I have 550kg lw now. I will want them gone by mid September. They are on the herbal lay now on rotation every 3-4 days. So Im going to run out very soon.

Has anyone got the weight gain per day for Angus on grass system. I am trawling the net and struggling to find it. Also working on grass April to September will there be any difference in the months?

I do have someone interested and an organic company Im in talks with.

 

[Kiwi Pete]

The majority look really great just the 2 that are a bit behind. I have 550kg lw now. I will want them gone by mid September. They are on the herbal lay now on rotation every 3-4 days. So Im going to run out very soon.

Has anyone got the weight gain per day for Angus on grass system. I am trawling the net and struggling to find it. Also working on grass April to September will there be any difference in the months?

I do have someone interested and an organic company Im in talks with.

Weight gain per hectare?
Or individual liveweight gain per day?

IMO you'll only have a profitable year every year if you concentrate on the first one and forget the second.

 

[escapedfromunderthecow]

We are also new to organic finishing and need to find the best way of marketing. Any ideas?

 

[jonnyjon]

Easy enough.
We sent AA out the gate at between 16 and 21 months at an avg of 287kg - one key thing is to keep weighing them and decide what to do with the tail end early rather than back yourself into a corner with the less profitable individuals - I'd personally get a few too many, and count on selling the less adapted as forward stores.

Not too hard to pick out the ones not keeping up, if you weigh monthly, this avoids surprises.

We aren't certified organic but are, if that makes sense?
Decent cattle don't need their hands held, so you may have to shop around for cattle that work - choose your breeder with care.

No trouble at all stacking over 2kg/day on them in spring, I try to hold them back a little so they don't run shy later, but we get quite dry sometimes.

Very interested/ surprised that you can get 2kg/ day on grazing cattle @Kiwi Pete, is that on herbal leys? Struggle to put that on intensive diets here

 

[Kiwi Pete]

Very interested/ surprised that you can get 2kg/ day on grazing cattle @Kiwi Pete, is that on herbal leys? Struggle to put that on intensive diets here

It's old pasture, definitely we don't "do leys" here, most of our paddocks are 20 years at least - but the same ideas apply: diversity and deep roots.

We manage for "energy flow", not quality, not grass production but energy from the sun, into the plant, into the soil, into the cattle.

The newest pastures look the best to a farmer, but the oldest ones are where the cattle do best; once the sown ryegrass loses its dominance and becomes 'part of the whole' seems to be the sweet spot.
Endophytes don't help the rumen at all.

 

[Chasingmytail]

We are also new to organic finishing and need to find the best way of marketing. Any ideas?

Marketing as selling in boxes or finding buyers?

 

[BobTheSmallholder]

Marketing as selling in boxes or finding buyers?

Marketing as far as I'm concerned is the "how" of selling i.e.. how you acquire customers and then keep them. If your marketing hits home then you shouldn't have to do much hard selling as customers should be coming to you keen to buy what you have.

I've been looking into this a lot and the key seems to be the "story" behind your product, get people invested in your story and they will buy whatever you have. This is where social media, photography, filming and sharing information becomes really important, something farmers are notoriously bad at!

My personal strategy which probably won't work for a lot of producers is going to revolve around a youtube channel and heavy social media presence showing all aspects of farm life and how well the (free range, organic, pasture fed) animals are raised and treated followed by cooking videos etc. Farm is only 3 miles outside of a decent sized town with an above average wealthy population so the plan is to lure them and their wallets to us... no guarantee it will work but has to beat standing around at a farmers market for hours hoping for sales.

 

[Chasingmytail]

Just a follow up on this.

Organic grassfed

Sent to Kepak. 27/28 months back in September

Graded o+2 and R2
Killed out 275 - 308kg

So around £1100 each.

I think getting certified Grassfed certification will give a few pence per kg extra. But only to those companies selling pasture fed.