Irish border..

[GTB]

Sorry I haven't read the whole theread so apologies if I'm repeating something someone has already said. Why don't we just give NI back to Ireland and be done with all the bloody hassle?

Would be easier to have a devolved Southern Ireland as part of the UK. Most of the trade is with UK anyway and freedom of movement between all parts goes back to 1922.

why on earth would Ireland want to be part of the U.K.? That's just wrong on so many levels.

 

[arcobob]

Have I missed something or isn`t this ultimately about Irish trade with mainland UK. A united Ireland would presumably remain in the EU, at least for the time being, and the border would be in the Irish Sea. There are four solutions 1. Unite Ireland 2. ROI leaves EU and becomes a devolved state within the UK 3. Install Danilan's technical border between ROI and the North and retain .the status quo. 4. ROI remains within the EU and rows its own boat without any UK favours.
Peace, happiness and prosperity for all is the main aim.

 

[GTB]

Have I missed something or isn`t this ultimately about Irish trade with mainland UK. A united Ireland would presumably remain in the EU, at least for the time being, and the border would be in the Irish Sea. There are four solutions 1. Unite Ireland 2. ROI leaves EU and becomes a devolved state within the UK 3. Install Danilan's technical border between ROI and the North and retain .the status quo. 4. ROI remains within the EU and rows its own boat without any UK favours.
Peace, happiness and prosperity for all is the main aim.

Option 1 is by far the most practical.

 

[arcobob]

Option 1 is by far the most practical.

Question for those in the know. What is Varadkar's suggested solution or is he just stirring up sh1t for the sake of it?

 

[Henarar]

Have I missed something or isn`t this ultimately about Irish trade with mainland UK. A united Ireland would presumably remain in the EU, at least for the time being, and the border would be in the Irish Sea. There are four solutions 1. Unite Ireland 2. ROI leaves EU and becomes a devolved state within the UK 3. Install Danilan's technical border between ROI and the North and retain .the status quo. 4. ROI remains within the EU and rows its own boat without any UK favours.
Peace, happiness and prosperity for all is the main aim.

or the border stays like it is which is what will happen

 

[renewablejohn]

Option 1 is by far the most practical.

Only if you believe in a United Ireland with the EU making the rules and paying an increased contribution to Brussels for the privilege. You would also wave goodbye to your biggest trade customer.

 

[Henarar]

a united Ireland would need two referendum I would have thought, one in NI and one in ROI and both would have to want it

 

[Dkb]

Isnt that like saying all the uk should have voted on scottish independence or the whole of the eu on brexit

No because voting on giving a country Its independence is a very different thing to amalgamating two countries

 

[Dkb]

To say unite Ireland as if it’s like knocking down a ditch to make two fields into one just because it’d get rid of this part of the trade talks is unbelievable.

The north has hundreds of thousands of people who want to remain the uk and a % of these people would be willing to resort to violence to prevent leaving it. Then the nationalist communities % of people wanting violence would be back in action again leading to widespread violence and a return to bloodshed and war.

The north of Ireland is a population of 1.5m roughly and the south 5m roughly (you forget this because your bigger) with decades of political unrest,sectarianism, hatred and killings.

To expect to be able to just weld the two countries back together again so the mainland can run off into the sunset is ludicrous and frankly insulting to the people of Northern Ireland.

You have caused brexit and that is obviously fine but casting the north of Ireland back into disarray is just as obviously not acceptable. Even if it would suit you at this juncture

 

[nivilla1982]

The Belfast Agreement gives the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland the power to call a referendum on the constitutional status of NI if he/she believes there is sufficient evidence that a majority desire said change.
The agreement does not specify what the evidence is, but presumably a consistent series of opinion polls indicating a desire for change, and/or nationalist parties winning a clear majority of votes over parties advocating the maintenance of the United Kingdom.
Presumably and hypothetically the Republic of Ireland will have to engage in some form of consultation with her populace about what this hypothetical change will mean for the Republic. (Taxes etc, Do the institutions set up under the Belfast Agreement still continue to exist in a 32 county state? What happens to the NHS etc)

 

[Nenuphar]

Question for those in the know. What is Varadkar's suggested solution or is he just stirring up sh1t for the sake of it?

Why would he need to suggest a solution?
The UK is the one leaving the EU and is bound by the GFA to maintain an open border in Ireland.

 

[Boohoo]

Why would he need to suggest a solution?
The UK is the one leaving the EU and is bound by the GFA to maintain an open border in Ireland.

Can you tell me what part of the 1998 Belfast Agreement binds the UK government into maintaining an open border between Northern Ireland and the Republic of Ireland?

 

[arcobob]

Why would he need to suggest a solution?
The UK is the one leaving the EU and is bound by the GFA to maintain an open border in Ireland.

Then there are only two solutions. Northern Ireland remain in the single market and customs union under their own identity and the border is in the Irish sea or Ireland becomes united and the border is still in the sea.. Should Varadkar be interested in exploring and discussing this? Sure as hell he should if he has an ounce of sense or backbone. It is partly his problem and he can't ignore it nor shrug his shoulders and walk away and lay the entire burden at the UK government's feet. When all is done and dusted he may not like the result but that may be his fault to some extent.

 

[Boohoo]

Then there are only two solutions. Northern Ireland remain in the single market and customs union under their own identity and the border is in the Irish sea or Ireland becomes united and the border is still in the sea..

I don't see either of those as solutions, an independent Northern Ireland would be a disaster, as proved by the Stormont assembly and as a British citizen living in Northern Ireland I don't want a united ireland.

 

[Nenuphar]

Can you tell me what part of the 1998 Belfast Agreement binds the UK government into maintaining an open border between Northern Ireland and the Republic of Ireland?

My mistake.

 

[nivilla1982]

The Belfast Agreement also binds both the UK and the ROI Government into accepting that at present NI is an integral part of the UK.

 

[Bones]

Brexit won't bring about a united Ireland ,, and with the good Friday agreement the whole united Ireland thing was put to bed , but thanx to the DUP and brexit, a united Ireland is firmly back on the scene, and this time its not sein fein that are pushing it , but ordinary people ,

 

[Boohoo]

Brexit won't bring about a united Ireland ,, and with the good Friday agreement the whole united Ireland thing was put to bed , but thanx to the DUP and brexit, a united Ireland is firmly back on the scene, and this time its not sein fein that are pushing it , but ordinary people ,

The ordinary people I know aren't pushing for a united ireland, they're more concerned with the lack of leadership and the problems in the health and education services.

 

[it's not over]

The term united Ireland I believe is outdated. A more acceptable term is an agreed ireland.

 

[Ashtree]

I don't see either of those as solutions, an independent Northern Ireland would be a disaster, as proved by the Stormont assembly and as a British citizen living in Northern Ireland I don't want a united ireland.

I’m an ROI citizen living in ROI and I don’t want a United Ireland either.
But nationalists alone in NI did did not vote to remain. A good portion of unionists also voted remain. A good majority overall voted remain.
The DUP alone (political leaders) not general membership have a gun to the heads of the majority in NI and a gun to the head of the British government. There is something totally undemocratic about their stance. They seem to absolutely zero ability to negotiate even one single inch on anything. Just a do as we say OR attitude.
Fir the good of the whole UK Brexit needs to move to trade talks. DUP intransigence is preventing that. A unique arrangement for NI within UK while not making it less British would achieve that. It would also make economic sense for NI .... London, Dublin and Brussels can all agree on it as well.