Is ploughing bad ?

ajd132

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Suffolk
There is nothing confusing about this in the slightest. You accused me of making “making stuff up” in post 47, I showed you the evidence presented in the OP’s quoted report which found that DD doesn’t capture any more carbon in soils that ploughing, and now your trying to ‘save face’.
No, you inferred we were only using the surface layer to make our OM percentage claims to try and make ourselves look good which is quite a childish argument.
I completely understand what the article says, nothing is new there whatsoever, it’s been discussed on these forums many times before and is a known fact that zero till collates on the surface and tillage spreads it throughout the cultivation layer, I am not trying to save face, I am agreeing with that fact and always have…
 

Cowabunga

Member
Location
Ceredigion,Wales
Well you have heard of woolly mammoths

In the first couple of thousand years after humans got to Australia, something like 23 of the 25 biggest animal had died out. Something similar in Madagascar where multiple species died off after the advent of humans; but South America had the most dramatic loss of some fantastic mega fauna. All evidenced by subsequent fossil finds.

Wolves, lynx, beaver most recently in the uk Aurochs before that.
I didn't ask about the Stone Age. I asked about recent times and specifically the last 50 years. Make it 100 years if you like and I can only think of one off hand. I can think of many that have been actually saved from natural extinction though.
 

Humble Village Farmer

Member
BASE UK Member
No, I'm asking for specific species that have been eliminated through the act of humans. If there that many, perhaps you could list the top five eliminated by human activity in the last, say, fifty years? An easy enough job for you, surely.
Tiger, black rhino, white rhino, elephant orang otang. Do you want some more?
 
Last edited:

Cowabunga

Member
Location
Ceredigion,Wales
Tiger, black rhino, white rhino, elephant orang otang. Do you want some more?
Only the Sabre Tooth Tiger of those is extinct as a direct result of human activity as far as I know. Extinction is a natural phenominon and indeed our ancestors, the Neanderthals, themselves became extinct worldwide and I doubt it was due to Homo Sapiens.
Many more species have been prolonged [unaturally?] through human intervention though.
 
I didn't ask about the Stone Age. I asked about recent times and specifically the last 50 years. Make it 100 years if you like and I can only think of one off hand. I can think of many that have been actually saved from natural extinction though.


Oliver Rackhams book "History of the British Countryside" is really interesting on this
 

Flatlander

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Lorette Manitoba
No, I'm asking for specific species that have been eliminated through the act of humans. If there that many, perhaps you could list the top five eliminated by human activity in the last, say, fifty years? An easy enough job for you, surely.
I’l list the first five from the list that became extinct in 2020, splendid poison frog,smooth hand fish,Jalpa false brook salamander, spiced dwarf mantis,Bonnie pipstrelle bat all of which probably have never been heard of the the average man but they still are gone forever. Also on the list of endangered species was the northern white rhino. Two remaining ones left are female so little chance they will make it either. It was an easy google cowabunga. Even for me.
 

Flatlander

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Lorette Manitoba
Only the Sabre Tooth Tiger of those is extinct as a direct result of human activity as far as I know. Extinction is a natural phenominon and indeed our ancestors, the Neanderthals, themselves became extinct worldwide and I doubt it was due to Homo Sapiens.
Many more species have been prolonged [unaturally?] through human intervention though.
One species has been prolonged unnaturally is the human one. Every sick weak useless member of society get a chance to reproduce more of its kind. Something nature wouldn’t let happen. As said above there is a large number of species that man has eradicated thru over hunting or destroying their environment. Just maybe the Neanderthals were all eaten by the Sabre tooth tiger then the Homo sapiens killed the tiger ? This thread has come a long way from ploughing.
 

Hjwise

Member
Mixed Farmer
So… what Kverneland have said goes against what has become the general thinking of soil improvement. Are they wrong or have they just chosen specific research that backs up to their arguments?
 

ajd132

Member
Arable Farmer
Location
Suffolk
So… what Kverneland have said goes against what has become the general thinking of soil improvement. Are they wrong or have they just chosen specific research that backs up to their arguments?
I think there’s enough scientific papers out there to support any argument. Just do what’s best for you.
 

Cowabunga

Member
Location
Ceredigion,Wales
One species has been prolonged unnaturally is the human one. Every sick weak useless member of society get a chance to reproduce more of its kind. Something nature wouldn’t let happen. As said above there is a large number of species that man has eradicated thru over hunting or destroying their environment. Just maybe the Neanderthals were all eaten by the Sabre tooth tiger then the Homo sapiens killed the tiger ? This thread has come a long way from ploughing.
Of course you ignore the fact that we humans are a part of nature.
 

Cowabunga

Member
Location
Ceredigion,Wales
Am I right in thinking that there was a species of zebra which has gone extinct in recent decades?
If it has, which it may well have, it will be a breed of Zebra because the species is very much alive and kicking. So it will be part of natural evolution I suspect.

This demonisation of humans is nothing new of course. It is part and parcel of organised religion and 'the sins of our fathers' and all that nonsense. It is very much linked to religion actually. See this video through to the end by the master philosopher and observer of the human condition, Dave Allen. It explains why we flagellate ourselves over guilt. Its also a prime feature of the current 'culture wars' of course where many people wish to expunge or alter aspects of our history.


 

Chips

Member
Location
Shropshire
I was just surprised that nobody has pointed out any specific flaws to their claims.
Exactly what I posted it for , I am no expert myself and wondered if there was any truth to it as it obviously came from a plough manufacturer.
As an organic dairy farmer I always plough to rotate between grass and cereals and wondered if it was as bad as people and policy makers claim. Just like cows have existed for thousands of years pre industrial revolution and thus IMHO have no impact on global warming so has ploughing.
Cows get blamed for GW due to flawed accounting of methane and because it suits many large multinationals to keep promoting the myth and thus divert attention from the real problems which would effect their business models far more while allowing them to sell high profit alternatives.
Is ploughing a victim of the same kind of myth promotion to suit multinationals ? I really don't have a clue and hence the original post.
 
If it has, which it may well have, it will be a breed of Zebra because the species is very much alive and kicking. So it will be part of natural evolution I suspect.

This demonisation of humans is nothing new of course. It is part and parcel of organised religion and 'the sins of our fathers' and all that nonsense. It is very much linked to religion actually. See this video through to the end by the master philosopher and observer of the human condition, Dave Allen. It explains why we flagellate ourselves over guilt. Its also a prime feature of the current 'culture wars' of course where many people wish to expunge or alter aspects of our history.



I remembered correctly. It is called a Quagga.

 

Bury the Trash

Member
Mixed Farmer
ojotesf.jpg
 

CHAP Webinar - Innovative tools to overcome the challenges of Regen Ag

  • 388
  • 1
https%3A%2F%2Fcdn.evbuc.com%2Fimages%2F186160299%2F486662465563%2F1%2Foriginal.20211115-160823


Applying principles of regen ag can incur a range of on-farm challenges. Learn how innovative tools & machinery can help with these hurdles.

This event will be held online from 1pm to 2pm on Thursday 2nd December 2021 so please block it out in your diary.

About this event​

Intro
This...
Top