McHale or Kuhn Fixed or Variable?

DrDunc

Member
Location
Dunsyre
Which baler to replace a variable chamber Krone? McHale roller makes best shaped bales of grass, Kuhn belt best for swallowing dry stuff (and presumably straw), but bales of second cut sag before wrapping (or I didn't set the density correct on the demo).

What are the McHale V6 like for making silage bales?

Will there be much less straw in a bale from a roller compared to belt?

What's people's experiences?
 

Pigless

Member
Location
Cornwall
Which baler to replace a variable chamber Krone? McHale roller makes best shaped bales of grass, Kuhn belt best for swallowing dry stuff (and presumably straw), but bales of second cut sag before wrapping (or I didn't set the density correct on the demo).

What are the McHale V6 like for making silage bales?

Will there be much less straw in a bale from a roller compared to belt?

What's people's experiences?
Why not another Krone?
 
Which baler to replace a variable chamber Krone? McHale roller makes best shaped bales of grass, Kuhn belt best for swallowing dry stuff (and presumably straw), but bales of second cut sag before wrapping (or I didn't set the density correct on the demo).

What are the McHale V6 like for making silage bales?

Will there be much less straw in a bale from a roller compared to belt?

What's people's experiences?
I have Kuhn belt baler up to 6ft diameter hay and straw down to 80 cm if you need to dry crops it’s a animal will take anything
I wouldn’t put anything over 30 % moisture through it as we don’t make that type of food wouldn’t recommend for silage is what I’m saying to many rollers for wet grass
Lots of settings to make bales as dence or as tight as you want with options for tight or slack centers it’s a operator’s baler to get the best out of it if driven well you will get some excellent bales
But wouldn’t recommend for silage
 

Bill dog

Member
Mixed Farmer
Location
Scottish Borders
After our soap opera with the variable Krone, now variable Massey ( welger), and it’s great.
But why not fixed chamber ?
A fixed McHale would kick out the most consistent bale !
 
Neighbour had a contractor working with a belt mchale and the tractor broke down so I finished it with a claas354. Far better bales but maybe down to the operator 😉. Couple of new Claas balers around here with contractors. Very impressive so far
 

kill

Member
Livestock Farmer
Location
South West
Why not another Krone?
Really thought it was meant to be the dogs doo dah’s by previous posts from the op!!!
I know someone that had to replace the belted slats and one hell of a heap of bearings and it was mega expensive and a job from hell and he’s a agri mechanic by trade.
I was quite interested where two balers where baling side by side the other side of a valley recently and one was fixed chamber and the other variable making larger bales and it was so easy to see which rounds and areas the variable belt machine was working by the extra distance the bales were apart
 

KB6930

Member
Location
Borders
Variable chamber every time

Kuhn will pack a tighter bale I'm not Mchales biggest fan I do know of 2 that were new last year that seem to be going a lot better this year for no apparent reason after a visit from an engineer for updates :scratchhead: still wouldn't go back baleing silage is easy again now I went to a fendt welger baler

Agco baler will have a better life span

Best tightest bale will come out a JD with the funny back door

In out experience roughly 1/3 more straw in a variable chamber bale than a fixed chamber that's a welger compared to welger 10yrs ago
 

hutchy143211

Member
Location
E. Yorkshire
Personally love our kuhn 2160 variable chamber,
2014 model done ~17,000 bales. I'll admit I've never used a mchale so can't comment entirely on what their like but have observed a few things looking under the sides.

Firstly IMO the kuhn is a far simpler baler mechanically. Looking under the sides of a mchale there's banks of grease nipples, lots of double drive chains and I'd guess a lot more bearings (I.e. stub augers). Our kuhn maybe has 6/7 grease points each side with most easily accessed. It has extra chains as its double drive, with 2 powered rotors as part of the silage kit but still far simpler than our previous roller Greenland or mchales I've seen. We've never had any issues with bales slipping when baling and think this is a big part of it.

Secondly, the pickup and feed system. I don't think the kuhn has the greatest pickup real in the world but its certainly good, can't comment on Mchales. However, where the kuhn is better in my opinion is the main feed rotor. Kuhn's is the bombproof vicon opticut system with one solid rotor with flight either side. This is where the kuhn gets its output capacity in dry material and its how fast you want to feed it. Behind a 17ft combine not doing silly speeds 80-90 bales/hour isn't uncommon for us. In grass this also helps as grass doesn't tend to ball under the flighted auger and just feeds as a nice mat. I will admit though we bale drier silage/haylage. The knife system is nice and simple and the drop floor is great if it gets blocked, we've found this a great feature in tough permanent grass which knots.

Thirdly, not sure if mchale has changed to it but the isobus controls with the kuhn (option but many are) is absolutely first class. Simple as can be to operate the baler with size and net wrap all touch screen inputs. Ours doesn't but I believe the new ones can even alter the main density setting from there. 40 individual field counters with a main seasonal one gives you the ability to keep individual records with 3 finger taps.

Other things with the kuhn as said, density adjustment is great. Main one is a screw valve at the front to adjust pressure (180 bar silage, 200 straw but we do almost everything at 180), new ones I think can be adjusted in cab. You can adjust the core as well from 3 settings but we find the middle standard setting to be perfectly fine. Net wrap system is nice and simple, with steps to aid access and storage for 2 additional rolls under the wings and manual feed options if there issues through the isobus screen.

Issues we've had with the baler in this time are:
- broken pickup reel chain (baling rigde and furrows)
- broken precompression roller suspension spring
- broken door latches (crap design)
- dolly wheel punctures (fixed so scrub, new ones may caster?)

The one big gripe we have with it is the internal scraper on the main drive. PITA to adjust between straw and grass (1mm clearance to scrap silage, 5mm clearance to stop straw pushing through). We switch it 4 times a year roughly and you can do an odd field in the incorrect way. Apparently you can set it at 3mm and do everything but never tried it.

Despite this, we love it and would have another tomorrow in a heart beat. Great output, clean stubbles and uniform bales so it seems fine!
 

DrDunc

Member
Location
Dunsyre
Hhhhmmmm

Just carted and stacked last night's 2nd cut silage bales.....

I'll not be looking any closer at a belt baler! Soft saggy lumps in comparison to the Krone, whatever variations the Kuhn density core and full pressure were set to. Kuhn intake rotor is an animal, but I'll definitely agree, it's not a baler for lower dry matter.

I'm very impressed with the bale shape from McHale 5600 fixed chamber. They were by far the easiest to wrap, though they were also the lightest (wasn't on highest density).

I've read here that roller balers will now put 220 to 250kg of straw in a bale.

Does anyone know how the Kuhn FB3135 roller performs in straw?
 

icanshootwell

Member
Location
Ross-on-wye
I have Kuhn belt baler up to 6ft diameter hay and straw down to 80 cm if you need to dry crops it’s a animal will take anything
I wouldn’t put anything over 30 % moisture through it as we don’t make that type of food wouldn’t recommend for silage is what I’m saying to many rollers for wet grass
Lots of settings to make bales as dence or as tight as you want with options for tight or slack centers it’s a operator’s baler to get the best out of it if driven well you will get some excellent bales
But wouldn’t recommend for silage
Funny you say that, my mchale was broken down so had to get a chap in to do a bit of baling, he had a newish vicon belt baler, went ok till we done some clover grass, then the grass starting wrapping around the rollers, i remember saying to him, thats why i went to a fixed chamber, it will bale anything, but if you are mainly straw/hay belts are fine.
The mchale fixed chamber will take some beating over all, bloody good baler.
 

icanshootwell

Member
Location
Ross-on-wye
Personally love our kuhn 2160 variable chamber,
2014 model done ~17,000 bales. I'll admit I've never used a mchale so can't comment entirely on what their like but have observed a few things looking under the sides.

Firstly IMO the kuhn is a far simpler baler mechanically. Looking under the sides of a mchale there's banks of grease nipples, lots of double drive chains and I'd guess a lot more bearings (I.e. stub augers). Our kuhn maybe has 6/7 grease points each side with most easily accessed. It has extra chains as its double drive, with 2 powered rotors as part of the silage kit but still far simpler than our previous roller Greenland or mchales I've seen. We've never had any issues with bales slipping when baling and think this is a big part of it.

Secondly, the pickup and feed system. I don't think the kuhn has the greatest pickup real in the world but its certainly good, can't comment on Mchales. However, where the kuhn is better in my opinion is the main feed rotor. Kuhn's is the bombproof vicon opticut system with one solid rotor with flight either side. This is where the kuhn gets its output capacity in dry material and its how fast you want to feed it. Behind a 17ft combine not doing silly speeds 80-90 bales/hour isn't uncommon for us. In grass this also helps as grass doesn't tend to ball under the flighted auger and just feeds as a nice mat. I will admit though we bale drier silage/haylage. The knife system is nice and simple and the drop floor is great if it gets blocked, we've found this a great feature in tough permanent grass which knots.

Thirdly, not sure if mchale has changed to it but the isobus controls with the kuhn (option but many are) is absolutely first class. Simple as can be to operate the baler with size and net wrap all touch screen inputs. Ours doesn't but I believe the new ones can even alter the main density setting from there. 40 individual field counters with a main seasonal one gives you the ability to keep individual records with 3 finger taps.

Other things with the kuhn as said, density adjustment is great. Main one is a screw valve at the front to adjust pressure (180 bar silage, 200 straw but we do almost everything at 180), new ones I think can be adjusted in cab. You can adjust the core as well from 3 settings but we find the middle standard setting to be perfectly fine. Net wrap system is nice and simple, with steps to aid access and storage for 2 additional rolls under the wings and manual feed options if there issues through the isobus screen.

Issues we've had with the baler in this time are:
- broken pickup reel chain (baling rigde and furrows)
- broken precompression roller suspension spring
- broken door latches (crap design)
- dolly wheel punctures (fixed so scrub, new ones may caster?)

The one big gripe we have with it is the internal scraper on the main drive. PITA to adjust between straw and grass (1mm clearance to scrap silage, 5mm clearance to stop straw pushing through). We switch it 4 times a year roughly and you can do an odd field in the incorrect way. Apparently you can set it at 3mm and do everything but never tried it.

Despite this, we love it and would have another tomorrow in a heart beat. Great output, clean stubbles and uniform bales so it seems fine!
On my mchale 5500, 45000 on the clock.
Broken spring on the knife drop.
Replaced top rubber net roller as old one damaged and causing net to wrap on the roller. Thats it in breakages except a few pick-up tines.
You mentioned the daily service, mine is auto grease and fill oil reservoir, 5 minutes in the morning job done, pto every 500 bales or so.
 
Hhhhmmmm

Just carted and stacked last night's 2nd cut silage bales.....

I'll not be looking any closer at a belt baler! Soft saggy lumps in comparison to the Krone, whatever variations the Kuhn density core and full pressure were set to. Kuhn intake rotor is an animal, but I'll definitely agree, it's not a baler for lower dry matter.

I'm very impressed with the bale shape from McHale 5600 fixed chamber. They were by far the easiest to wrap, though they were also the lightest (wasn't on highest density).

I've read here that roller balers will now put 220 to 250kg of straw in a bale.

Does anyone know how the Kuhn FB3135 roller performs in straw?
Something not right if you are saying soft bales from a belt baler? That just should not be
 
On my mchale 5500, 45000 on the clock.
Broken spring on the knife drop.
Replaced top rubber net roller as old one damaged and causing net to wrap on the roller. Thats it in breakages except a few pick-up tines.
You mentioned the daily service, mine is auto grease and fill oil reservoir, 5 minutes in the morning job done, pto every 500 bales or so.
In that amount of bales how many set of chains and sprockets?
 

Drillman

Member
Mixed Farmer
Soft saggy bales has absolutely nothing to do with the badge on the baler or wether it’s a belt or roller machine.

Baler setting come into play to an extent but so does the stuff it gobbling up. I baled some very green silage on a stinking hot day with the V660 a few weeks back and they were a prat to wrap. Baler set at max pressure as well, grass was hot to the touch. Rain forecast the next day so customer wanted it rolling up.

same setting on a cooler day and Grass that was wilted a bit more and it turned bricks out that were still perfect shapes a month later.
 

LIVE - DEFRA SFI Janet Hughes “ask me anything” 19:00-20:00 20th September (Today)

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Hello, I’m Janet Hughes. I’m the Programme Director for the Future Farming and Countryside Programme in Defra – the programme that’s phasing out the Common Agricultural Policy and introducing new schemes and services for farmers.



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