Natiinal Grid haven't been paying wayleave

[Grass And Grain]

Got a wayleave agreement from the 1960's.

We've received no wayleave payment from NG for the last 20 years or so.

Now they want to come into our fields for maintenance works.

Anyone have any idea where we might stand on this?

 

[davidroberts30]

Start with f and end with f

 

[Grass And Grain]

Start with f and end with f

And they've sent us a new wayleave agreement to sign. Seems as if they might have realised they're on a sticky wicket!

 

[Grass And Grain]

This is how I see it in my mind...

You can have either an easment (one off payment), so they effectively purchase the right to come onto land for any maintenance works and for having their equipment on your land. Or they pay annually for a wayleave.

Strikes me that if they haven't been paying what they owe for such a long time, then they have broken the wayleave agreement.

Therefore, my view is that they will need to pay me for crop loss/damage AND access to our lane.

Anyone got any experience of a similar situation?

 

[Highland Mule]

This is how I see it in my mind...

You can have either an easment (one off payment), so they effectively purchase the right to come onto land for any maintenance works and for having their equipment on your land. Or they pay annually for a wayleave.

Strikes me that if they haven't been paying what they owe for such a long time, then they have broken the wayleave agreement.

Therefore, my view is that they will need to pay me for crop loss/damage AND access to our lane.

Anyone got any experience of a similar situation?

Yeah, I was here for about five years before they called to see me, and they backdated the payments for the duration. Previous owners had an easement, but apparently that doesn't transfer when they sold the place.

As I say, not biggie, I got a lump sum and they got access, but on my terms and with all costs/ damages sorted to my satisfaction - eventually.

I decided to stick with wayleave, as I thought at the time it gave me more chance to kick them out if they misbehave. Wasn't impressed with the easement idea.

Got to ask, how did you not notice they hadn't been paying you for the wayleave for 20 years?

 

[Grass And Grain]

Yeah, I was here for about five years before they called to see me, and they backdated the payments for the duration. Previous owners had an easement, but apparently that doesn't transfer when they sold the place.

As I say, not biggie, I got a lump sum and they got access, but on my terms and with all costs/ damages sorted to my satisfaction - eventually.

I decided to stick with wayleave, as I thought at the time it gave me more chance to kick them out if they misbehave. Wasn't impressed with the easement idea.

Got to ask, how did you not notice they hadn't been paying you for the wayleave for 20 years?

Just the wires going overhead with no towers, so original agreement was for 5 shillings. New wayleave would be for a jaw dropping £2.10. So we never thought about it.

Even the back-dating of payments isn't going to be all so exciting

Thats why I was maybe hoping I could go down the angle of saying they had no credible wayleave agreement if they hadn't been paying their wayleave/rent. Land has been in our ownership since they built the line in 1968.

 

[Highland Mule]

Just an oversail then - understood. What do you want to happen ? Would be tricky to get it removed.

 

[Wooly]

What is the fuss........... you don't even have a pylon on your land ,which probably explains why there hasn't been any maintenance for 20 years.

As for them entering now, I have always found National Grid to be good at paying for any damage and disruption they have caused.

I'm am sure they will pay the wayleave that has been missing for the last few years.

 

[Grass And Grain]

@Wooly
@Highland Mule

They will be wanting to build a temporary scaffold tower in the field. That's no problem. We all need electricity, and the network needs maintaining. And they will pay fair crop loss compensation - so all that is good.

What I'm not happy with is that they haven't been paying the wayleave.

In my mind the wayleave is a bit like a rent. They pay a small amount (£2.10/year for oversail) each year to have the lines crossing over our land. In this wayleave agreement, it gives them the right to come in and do maintenance.

So they've saved themselves £2.10/year by not paying us. Now they still want to come in and do the maintenance, after having NOT paid their wayleave.

It must be a requirement for them to havea wayleave agreement and pay the annual fee, otherwise such agreements wouldn't exist.

Why should I let them onto the land for free if the annual fee for the wayleave agreement hasn't been paid.

Trying to decide if I'm being daft, or do I have a point?

If I used to rent a field (and enjoyed the benefits of renting said field, e.g. by being able to crop the field), but then hadn't paid any rent for 20 years, then I wouldn't expect to receive the benefits of renting that land - and I would expect to have been evicted by my landlord.

Strikes me that if they haven't been paying the wayleave, then they have forfitted the benefit of the wayleave - one of which was reasonable access to undertake maintenance. So I'm thinking they would need to pay a one-off reasonable payment to gain access, plus crop loss.

 

[Wooly]

FFS, it is £2.10 a year !!

Are you sure they haven't been paying the wayleave since 1960 ?

Could be any amount of reasons it hasn't been paid.......... change of address, change of conditions, a previous relation saying don't bother / never cashing the cheque, or even an agreement that anything under a certain amount of money goes as a peppercorn rent !

You deciding if you are daft or have a point, I would opt for the first suggestion !



They have been very fair on all the dealings I have had from them and they do maintenance on our 5 pylons every few years.

 

[Highland Mule]

Had similar here, also for scaffold. They paid all my costs, including my time. I wouldn’t get hung up on the wayleave, and just make sure you agree rates and terms before they come on. In writing.

In some ways, your position is stronger without the wayleave - if you’d wanted to get them to re route. That was my ultimate sanction, but wasn’t needed.

 

[Grass And Grain]

Thanks @Wooly for taking the time to reply.

My agent thinks the same as you do, and I am wise enough to go with the weight of opinion. If 8 out of 10 people think 'x', but I think 'y', one would have to think that 'x' was the correct answer.

@Highland Mule , again, thanks for taking the time to reply. A fair and reasonable negotiation seems the way to go.

Anyone hazard a guess as to what is a fair compensation. Expect they will need about 1 acre or so. PM if preferred, or if not, thanks anyway guys for the advice so far.

 

[chaffcutter]

Contact your local wayleave officer direct, and get them out on site to agree the details before you let them on.

We have an annual payment of over a thousand, we also have a branch trip in one field which gives regular problems, they came onto that after one ot the storms last winter and made a hell of a mess which cost them a lot of money, but was easily agreed with the wayleave Officer.

 

[fieldfarmer]

@Wooly
@Highland Mule

They will be wanting to build a temporary scaffold tower in the field. That's no problem. We all need electricity, and the network needs maintaining. And they will pay fair crop loss compensation - so all that is good.

What I'm not happy with is that they haven't been paying the wayleave.

In my mind the wayleave is a bit like a rent. They pay a small amount (£2.10/year for oversail) each year to have the lines crossing over our land. In this wayleave agreement, it gives them the right to come in and do maintenance.

So they've saved themselves £2.10/year by not paying us. Now they still want to come in and do the maintenance, after having NOT paid their wayleave.

It must be a requirement for them to havea wayleave agreement and pay the annual fee, otherwise such agreements wouldn't exist.

Why should I let them onto the land for free if the annual fee for the wayleave agreement hasn't been paid.

Trying to decide if I'm being daft, or do I have a point?

If I used to rent a field (and enjoyed the benefits of renting said field, e.g. by being able to crop the field), but then hadn't paid any rent for 20 years, then I wouldn't expect to receive the benefits of renting that land - and I would expect to have been evicted by my landlord.

Strikes me that if they haven't been paying the wayleave, then they have forfitted the benefit of the wayleave - one of which was reasonable access to undertake maintenance. So I'm thinking they would need to pay a one-off reasonable payment to gain access, plus crop loss.

No, your not being daft. You have something they need to use they pay, simples, do they give you free use of their electricity?

 

[Steevo]

I was unaware that if you have just lines crossing but no poles that you were due compensation or a way leave agreement. News to me!

 

[Ffermer Bach]

I suppose it isn't National Grid who put in three phase? If it was, I would say, install three phase and we we will all be happy and you can repair/install scaffolding as you see fit

 

[Surgery]

re done ours last year , came to a 5 figure settlement.

don’t let them on , get there wayleaves man to contact you , if they get shirty ask to see the agreement between yourselves , possible from generations ago if there is one.

when they agree to pay fees have your agent out and make a definitive list of what poles-stays etc are on your land-hedges-verges if applicable.

They will pay back 6 years back pay if none are being paid for.

don’t sign anything relating to one off payments , you need long term control.

it will take a long time to sort out but it will pay dividends

 

[Highland Mule]

I was unaware that if you have just lines crossing but no poles that you were due compensation or a way leave agreement. News to me!

Called an “oversail”. Very low rates.

 

[milkloss]

Get them to lay you a nice new farm drive.

 

[Highland Mule]

Anyone hazard a guess as to what is a fair compensation.

I charge £100/hr, including meeting preparation time. That took a bit as I had to educate the local guy on the finer points of health and safety. Any damage was reinstated by them to my satisfaction. Crop damage, charged at an agreed rate based on what I would have got for it.