New limits to SFI.

[Hjcarter]

Apart from "welcoming the announcement", where is the NFU on all of this??

A simple Google search for NFU in the last 24 hours doesn't come up with any meaningful statement, press release, etc...... I'd like to think/ hope that they're visiting all the newspapers, radio and TV stations to get the message out....

 

[Nearly]

NFU are awaiting their response from British Retail Consortium?

 

[lloyd]

Just out of interest has there been a definite answer regarding
whether putting large areas into one of these options will have
an effect on the way land is viewed for taxation?
As we can see what is said at one moment in time can count for very little.

 

[BrianV]

my view there options were priced for hole farm acceptance as machinery could be sold reduced now overheads will be all out of kilter have to keep kit and labour for 75% of fields may as well go back to zero big 6 options. Big mistake from sfi Big areas of environmental scheme, make big environmental benefit they were right before now big back track = y the big u turn with only 1 % doing this must be some other reason

You can bet that 1% of so called "farmers " probably accounts for one hell of a large land area if big estates are involved..

 

[J 1177]

Apart from "welcoming the announcement", where is the NFU on all of this??

A simple Google search for NFU in the last 24 hours doesn't come up with any meaningful statement, press release, etc...... I'd like to think/ hope that they're visiting all the newspapers, radio and TV stations to get the message out....

They are too busy trying to backtrack on the gfc

 

[J 1177]

NFU are awaiting their response from British Retail Consortium?

Dont joke

 

[Henarar]

Well no actually if my experience is anything to go by!. I have been to farms which have placed all there land into one or more of these 6 actions. But they have been small farms of 11 to 45 hectares. Not landed gentry estates. Just older retired farmers - tenants in two cases. Never dreamed of such action until the Guidelines were published last July and then amended to be even more favourable in August.

Most of the rest where around 20 - 30% of land has been entered into one of the options is where crops have failed and land is wet and have taken advantage of the SFI Lifeboat with every intention of reducing this by 50% from the Autumn when they will go back to cropping Or will drop Oilseed Rape and other Break Crops. Again very logical agronomic and financial reasons. It is this market price influence which Defra do not seem to acknowledge. Hey ho.

Good to hear the small farms have done ok for a change

 

[andybk]

You can bet that 1% of so called "farmers " probably accounts for one hell of a large land area if big estates are involved..

i will hazard a guess , National Trust and RSPB are two of them ,Land agent driven !
Genuine Farmers would be far more cautious until proven ,

 

[Kiwi Pete]

33% of my productive area is out but the way they ahve built the sfi years even that isn't reflected in the agreement year where is 66%


I await more clarification but this really doesn't seem very well thought out at all and not enough detail given alongside a headline announcement

If you wanted to tip farmers over the brink then I'd argue it's very well "thought out", going through what some would call 'a struggle session' then throwing out a dissolving lifesaver

 

[Yale]

If you wanted to tip farmers over the brink then I'd argue it's very well "thought out", going through what some would call 'a struggle session' then throwing out a dissolving lifesaver

Well, it certainly proves there s no communication or taking note of co design feedback between farmers and DEFRA. Reading between the lines it’s the cosying up to NGO’s of the wildlife variety which have delivered DEFRA to this outcome.

 

[Spencer]

Dont joke

True story

 

[BrianV]

Well, it certainly proves there s no communication or taking note of co design feedback between farmers and DEFRA. Reading between the lines it’s the cosying up to NGO’s of the wildlife variety which have delivered DEFRA to this outcome.

Simply yet another example of government incompetence, there's plenty of others around.

 

[Vader]

Couldn't make it up... only a few years after farmers had pointed this issue out to them.

Edit - The sheer incompetence takes my breath away.

."lessons will be learned.."
(No one gets sacked though...)

 

[Hindsight]

Good to hear the small farms have done ok for a change

Hi H. Thought I ought to contribute my situation for some balance. So far 14000 agreements and Defra say 1% which is 140 farmers have taken 100% of land out of production. It was the 1% that interested me as I know of as say at least 3 of them and they are not landed gentry or using highly paid agents (sadly!).

 

[Clive]

It wasn’t perfect but the beauty of it was you spend it how you saw fit. New shed roof, tractor diff repair etc etc without needing every minute detail of expenditure signed off and inspected by DEFRA.

new range rover, new skis, nice holiday etc etc ……. it wasn’t a subsidy ever given to farmers ( they just pretended they did !) , it was a subsidy for landowners and there is no way you can justify that to tax payers, it REALLY did take the pee ……. as a landowner (who farms) at least i can be honest enough to admit that

sfi is somewhat better in that respect but stil missed opportunity - the key to ag subs is making sure FARMERS get them not landowners (investors) it’s not easy to achieve that however

the cap is a good idea in that respect BUT this inconsistency and moving of goalposts really is not on when we are making often life changing business decisions

 

[Clive]

And there is no way Clive that anyone can now defend the Two Tier sub system that has replaced BPS which will severally disadvantage thousands of farmers due to the rules of the scheme being changed overnight without any warning!

And all this whilst many mixed/livestock farms were still waiting for the 60+ grassland options to be released to be able to make an application.

Janet said on here time and time again when asked that ALL farmers would be able to re-coup their lost BPS under the new SFI system, well that is now clearly a lie and not possible under the new SFI scheme let alone the old SFI scheme.

Personally SFI is now a dead duck walking and needs to be scrapped.

i agree - sfi now discriminates based on date you applied - that’s seems ridiculous

 

[Goweresque]

Surely the best solution should be the larger of 25% or 50 acres (or pick a land area of your choosing) per SBI thus allowing small landowners to take the whole of their holding out of production if they wanted, while preventing large ones from pigging out? It would level the playing field a bit.

new range rover, new skis, nice holiday etc etc

So you're not going to spend any of your farming profits (which will now include SFI payments) on any of those then?

 

[David.]

100% was never going to last, and was probably too good to be true.
Fair play to the early adopters, they were always promised that they wouldn't be disadvantaged compared to latecomers, who to be fair, were probably the ones last harvest saying that Defra could poke it.
Then it set in wet, and cereal prices were successfully managed downwards.

 

[fieldfarmer]

Just out of interest has there been a definite answer regarding
whether putting large areas into one of these options will have
an effect on the way land is viewed for taxation?
As we can see what is said at one moment in time can count for very little.

Well, seeing as these options are called
"Sustainable farming incentives " they obviously still think of it as a farming activity, we were advised if given the opportunity do not go beyond the initial three yrs before rotating an option incase that set a precedent. A change of government policy would be more of a land taxation worry than this scheme to me!

 

[Clive]

Surely the best solution should be 25% or 50 acres (or pick a land area of your choosing) per SBI thus allowing small landowners to take the whole of their holding out of production if they wanted, while preventing large ones from pigging out? It would level the playing field a bit.



So you're not going to spend any of your farming profits (which will now include SFI payments) on any of those then?

i have to EARN those profits by providing the tax payer with something in return for their payment, i have to farm land, to get the best from it i have to produce BOTH food and public good / natural capital

I got my BPS dole cheque just for being wealthy enough to own some land ! - many of the richest people in the UK got theirs as well, they didn’t need to farm anything or provide any public goods whatsoever

BIG difference……. like Huge difference !